I don't know if higher protein is the reason Atkins "works". No long term studies have been done that show it does work. But Atkins without cutting out carbs isn't Atkins. And Atkins isn't healthy or conducive to athletic performance.



Styrrell

[reply]I propose a modified Atkins diet eating a healthy balance of complex carbs, lean proteins and low in saturated fats.[/reply]

Uhhh - are you aware that your proposal has been around under the label "healthy diet" for just about ever? Or did you intentionally leave out fruits and veggies?


Me? I'm goin' back to roots. It's pemmican or nothin', baby! ;)

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The study found what makes Atkins work for short term weight loss is the same things that make a healthy diet work. The other unhealthy stuff wasn't the cause of it working. So, when you through out the crap and keep the good you end up with no valid reason not to eat a healthy diet.

My recommendation to "modify Atkins" by throwing out the unhealthy portions such as low carb high fat was facetious. Just eat healthy instead.

The show also warned about potential long term dangers since the effects over 20 years are unknown.

I saw somewhere (no I don't remember where) that Atkins worked well for some people simply because they were reducing calories. That's right, after you subtracted all the high calorie white flour and sugar products out of their diet and let them eat all the meat and cheese they want and still couldn't equal their old calorie count. There is a fast food sandwich in this country with over 3000 calories. When you subtract the bread, sauces and veggies it cuts it by a third. Thats what atkins dieters are eating. The sandwich is some sub thing at a gourmet sandwich chain.

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Jim

**Note above poster works for a retailer selling bikes and related gear*

Another reason most people lose weight on atkins (other than small reduction of calories) is fluid loss to due to lack of carbohydrates. Every gram of carbohydate stores 2.5g's(?) of water ... therefore no carbs = no fluid retention. There is a reason why endurance athletes "carbo-load" before events, for hydration purpose as well! Get rid of the Atkins idea and just eat balanced and smart.

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Dave Latourette
http://www.TTENation.com

Fat decreases hunger and delays stomach emptying. This is why eating a steak and cheesecake leaves you feeling full for about 12-18 hours.

Protein has an appetite curbing effect, too.

But, fiber also makes you feel full and delays stomach emptying.

I recommend lots (buckets) of fiber, fruits and veggies as well as moderate fat and moderate protein. Limit the white stuff unless you are carbo loading. Better to use mostly complex carbs--beans, fruits, veggies and a few whole grains.

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Dick

Take everything I say with a grain of salt. I know nothing.

Fat decreases hunger and delays stomach emptying. This is why eating a steak and cheesecake leaves you feeling full for about 12-18 hours.

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Fat decreasing hunger was the expected result of a test they did in the show. To test this theory, they prepared identical looking low fat and high fat meals for two groups. After 2 months thet found the opposite. The group on the high fat diet ate more than the group on the low fat.

That is why they did an experiment to test the effect of protein for curbing appetite. The researches were surprised to find out that protein suppresses hunger better than fat.

The doctors agreed with the high fibre recommendation since the effect on the body of a low fibre diet over the long term is unknown.

What I found best about this show is the doctors did research to determine why Atkins works and the reasons were different than what they expected. Up until know I have intuitively beileved Atkins is stupid but didn't know why it works (The people at the office who have lost 50 lbs are proof that it can work). Now I have an understanding of a scientific explaination of why it works and what in it is crap. The thing I found most interesting is that the research doctors in finding out what makes Atkins work built up a good arguement for eating a balanced diet instead.

here's the REAL reason atkins works (this is coming from an undergrad degree in nutrition and exercise, not a tv show... ) 1. it depletes your body's glycogen. and by depletion, i mean absolutely NO glycogen. this causes a ton of lost water weight. this lack of glycogen has the effect of making your body feel like you've hit the wall perpetually. you barely have enough energy to walk across campus, walk to get coffee, etc. 2. since there are virtually no carbs being consumed, your body's insulin levels are extremely low. insulin is the hormone that absorbs energy into your body's cells. since this insulin is low, the hormone glucagon is very high in the bloodstream. glucagon has the effect of utilizing body fat and protein stores. essentially this is the same effect as when your body is starving, and you're consuming yourself. as you would imagine, this is very unhealthy. however, the reverse happens once any amount of carbohydrates is consumed. insulin levels rise causing glucagon levels to drop. the carbos and food you have just consumed go straight into body storage. guess what this causes to happen when you go off atkins? your weight goes right back up w/ the stored energy and additional water!! ... on another note, there are NO studies that have been done regarding atkins in the long term. when i mean long term, i'm not talking 20 years, i mean that there aren't any studies that have been done past 6 MONTHS!!!! that's the facts, jack

"I propose a modified Atkins diet eating a healthy balance of complex carbs, lean proteins and low in saturated fats."

like Khai said, sounds suspiciously like a healthy diet

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Post: "I propose a modified Atkins diet eating a healthy balance of complex carbs, lean proteins and low in saturated fats."

like Khai said, sounds suspiciously like a healthy diet


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Exactly: The British show took common beliefs of the pro-Atkins groups and interviewed researches who had done studies (some as long as 2 years) to try to determine why the diet worked. In the process they disproved many of the supporters missconceptions. Overall, the arguement was a good soft sell of why people considering this diet should choose a healthy diet instead. The soft sell approach will hopefully get some people considering the diet to listen to the reasons why you shouldn't do it. The hard message of "it is dangerous" doesn't get across when there are others are raving about losing so much weight with no excercise (even though, as dirtrunr mentioned, their bodies are starving)

If you throw out the crap your left with the old healthy diet.

You hear horror stories of people who go on a couple week vacation and gain back 10's of pounds in a week or two because they ate real food on vacation.

Thankfully the fad is starting to fade

The fact is Atkins/South Beach/etc... doesn't work any better that any other diet when outcomes were looked at after 6 months.

A lot of clever marketing crap though, and it's done a good job of convincing a lot of people that carbs are inherently bad (which they aren't).

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I've been missing the ritual Atkins argument. So much more interesting than scientists trying to prove that God doesn't exist in the the Lavendar room. Here's an article from our local rag that has some interesting insights into what works and what doesn't:

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/...amp;ObjectID=9005905

Yes, they all work, if you keep to them. Yes, everybody is right. And please, Atkins is not about no carbs, but about controlling carbs. Exercise is recommended, as are plenty of vegetables and fibre.

But it seems you need to see a psychiatrist rather than a nutritionist if you want to lose weight: its about keeping to the regime. For me the issue has not been one of being unable add up calories, its been how to deal with my appetite. I think this is most overweight people's issue.

For the record, using Atkins was a breakthrough for me: I lost 7kg and kept it off. After a week of weirdness I started feeling really good and had tons of energy. It broke a cycle of endless appetite for me, for the first time in a long time not to feel hungry was a breakthough. The conventional wisdom of an emphasis on low fat content of foods was a disaster as fat was replaced with simple sugars. Insulin rush here we go.

Also for the record, I've still got 5kg to go to hit my fighting weight and are using more conventional means: portion control, low GI foods, frequent meals. Atkins only got me so far, and I have to be careful about matching energy needs now I'm training for IM. Normal, healthy eating is a lot more enjoyable.

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Those who know do not speak, those who speak, do not know.