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VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business
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The current alliance between local bike shops and manufacturers will sink both, and yet neither seems to have a solution. Financially speaking, direct-to-consumer products, especially bikes and components, are increasingly commodities, with players racing to the bottom on price -- few are making a good margin and the addressable market is smaller each year. Manufacturers can't figure out the inventory puzzle that firms have long ago mastered in other fields. All this failure will hurt the sport.

This is 2018, and the only really strong, profitable, scalable business I see in cycling is Zwift. I'd like to start a cycling/multi-sport endemic business that has the potential to make a fuck ton of money and make sense athletes and consumers.

The future of the bike shop isn't Velofix -- that is a good idea poorly executed through a bizarre franchise model that doesn't even solve the issue of up front capital investment and fairly massive overhead. The service doesn't work well in markets that lack population density. The wrenches cannot be assessed for expertise by potential customers in any meaningful way. And the service just is not that good: the idea of quality control for this master brand is hogwash and there if no dynamic pricing model or scheduling platform or network effect or anything like that.

There's nothing about Velofix or any other company, really, that smacks of what makes modern tech companies and services platforms great. So what is the AirBnb or Uber or [insert other wildly disruptive logistics/technology/p2p/network company] for triathlon and cycling services?

VeloWorks (Velo.Works is the domain) is my answer. VeloWorks is TaskRabbit meets UpWork meets Airbnb meets Angie's List -- a hybrid e-lance and freelance service platform that connects consumers/athletes with local, virtual, and long-distance/by mail professionals, whose work quality and merits are assessed by the network of clients who post a simple rating and review.

Local: Everyone knows what TaskRabbit is, but you cannot find independent bike mechanics on there -- they exist locally and may be willing to perform the dreadful services (brake bleed, internal cable routing, etc.) on your terms, like at your house, or with pickup from and delivery to your office, and they'll make a healthy wage and can do it on their own terms, perhaps double dipping in between courier missions. BikeFlights is easy, but packing up a bike carefully sucks. Why can't someone who is making $14 per hour at a shop come over and pack my shit up for double or triple that? This isn't brain surgery, it's just annoying as hell and it sucks to pay $70 for when it takes you half an hour and someone can do it for half that and do it in front of you while you ride the trainer.

Virtual: The tech platform that supports my (traditional) business has half a dozen full time engineers and they were all found via UpWork, a platform for freelance, virtual professionals. They are in the Ukraine, Russia, and Algeria, and they work for pennies on the dollar for services that would cost $200K per year in the Valley, which is our annual payroll for the team. This is how virtual services can drastically reduce the cost by connecting professionals with consumers over the internets.

Why isn't there a central site for coaching services, regardless of location, with profiles and athlete/consumer ratings and reviews? What about coaching consultations or power file review? Coggan could be on there consulting with and insulting athletes for a fee. Coaching services as a subscription makes no sense for a lot of people, but I'd like Joel Filliol to review my file and check my work.

Why can't I hire fitters and assess quality from a profile and portfolio in a single location, and judge from customer reviews whether they are charismatic charlatans without skills or actually worth the cost? There is no substitute for an in-person fit, sure, but the reality is the traditional model is broken because the comfort and efficacy of a saddle requires time on that saddle, and so when you change your most important piece of kit six or seven times, you need a re-tool of your fit every time. You don't need lasers, either. A single video and 15 minute interaction is enough to ensure that you don't purchase a Canyon that is a size too small.

Can somebody please get out to Xantusia and help slowman with road tubeless? Tubeless setup curricula should be taught in person, with live diagnosis, but who will teach it...your local shop? I'd love for someone to come over and break their thumbs on these awful tires so I can do something else that doesn't suck.

Custom/Remote: This is the "everything else" niche space where you can ship your bike somewhere for service work. Why can't I hire someone to make 3D printed parts for my bike? The single lowest hanging fruit in aero today is custom fairings for your front end, and the only way I'm getting those is by begging chicanery to do them for me or piggybacking off someone's efforts. Want a custom carbon mod on your P4? Open your wallet big as Calfee it is -- there isn't another service provider. I want these guys doing better work out of their homes to be offering custom services (that are superior to the incumbents) online for a price that's fair for both parties. HotTubes is it for paint as far as I know, but then again there's nowhere to find out my options. Want a true custom build that nobody can do locally? Send your bike to someone who likes fussing with this stuff through an efficient market of others who can offer the same. Custom Garmin mount? Glen Alden is great, but his website was build when dinosaurs roamed the earth.

Local shops are not excluded, but their services model is part of the problem. I can't stand when people ask who should fit them and posters recommend a shop, because shops don't fit athletes, people do. On VeloWorks, any entity can create individual profiles for staff members and market services, with those individuals reviewed and assessed by customers. The idea that you can get "great service" at a certain LBS is patent nonsense. The quality of your service experience and result depends on the individual who works on your bike, and there is only one mechanic in my city who touches my bike -- he works at the local bike shop, and he charges too much. I'd hire him outside of that place if he didn't own it.

The business model for VeloWorks is viable and obviously scalable if you can get users to the platform. Beyond that, there's a long term pivot to product showrooming -- I'd back a Tactical from Jim@ERO if he were warehousing it in a garage, but I wouldn't even consider buying a Canyon from Velofix. I have a sense of quality service and who delivers it, but the vast majority of consumers only know a local shop that charges them too much for too little to offset the declines in a business that is faltering under the weight of an operating model that makes less and less sense each year.

Discuss...and tell me why I shouldn't do this.
Last edited by: kileyay: Mar 1, 18 14:19
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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I stopped reading at "everybody knows what TaskRabbit is" ... because they don't. I've literally never heard of it. Maybe it's only me?

Also, Velofix is fucking amazing if you live in the right market. I'm in Los Angeles and it changed my life. My LBS is dead to me. I was basically only going for wrench work anyway and my Velofix mechanic is way better.
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [BrentwoodTriGuy] [ In reply to ]
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BrentwoodTriGuy wrote:
I stopped reading at "everybody knows what TaskRabbit is" ... because they don't. I've literally never heard of it. Maybe it's only me?

x2. Never heard of TaskRabbit until five seconds ago.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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I’ve had many of these ideas floating in my head lately. I was thinking just today how I hate cutting brake lines and rebleeding, but the shop where the mechanic works that I trust charges way too much. I like working on my bike but certain things I find annoying, don’t want to invest in the tools, or simply don’t have time for it. I think this model would only work well in medium to large cities - no surprise there.

I do know about TaskRabbit! Whew, I thought I was old and out of touch.

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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [Bonesbrigade] [ In reply to ]
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Bonesbrigade wrote:
I do know about TaskRabbit! Whew, I thought I was old and out of touch.

Based on what the service is... maybe you know about it because you ARE old ;-)
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [BrentwoodTriGuy] [ In reply to ]
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BrentwoodTriGuy wrote:
Bonesbrigade wrote:
I do know about TaskRabbit! Whew, I thought I was old and out of touch.

Based on what the service is... maybe you know about it because you ARE old ;-)

Ha! Sadly you are correct. The older I get, the more things I’m willing to pay others to do. I can’t believe I used to change he oil in my car and the brake pads.

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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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wat
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [BrentwoodTriGuy] [ In reply to ]
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Sorry don’t know what TaskRabbit is either, and love velofix...so....
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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I think your last paragraph hits the key issue: will users join your platform? And an even more important question is even if users want to join, are there enough of them to make this business viable? I think the answer is maybe yes for some of the services that can be done remotely, like coaching or fitting via video, but for things that you need a local person to do something like bleed your brakes I don't see how your platform would have an advantage over Velofix. You would still need to be in a high density urban area where there is a large supply of good mechanics to share between your service, shops, velofix, pro teams, etc. Sure, I can see some mechanics that work elsewhere freelancing on your site but I can also see competitors like local shops and Velofix banning their employees from participating.
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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Another Velofix lover and TaskRabbit non-knower here! How much easier can it be to schedule when you want your bike worked on, have a competent mechanic show up, have the work done, and not have to take your bike anywhere? I know the competent mechanic part may be hit or miss, but I'm definitely a fan after only a few times.

Blog: http://262toboylstonstreet.blogspot.com/
https://twitter.com/NateThomasTri
Coaching: https://bybtricoaching.com/ - accepting athletes for 2023
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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So you use your reputation as someone that starts controversial conversations to get eyeballs on a business idea of your own. Has this been your end game all along?
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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this is not going to succeed.

the tech companies you express so much enthusiasm for don't make good models. many of whom are leveraging insane amounts of capital and getting the illusion of margins by working around established (and generally necessary) regulations. there are also able to remain entrenched as middlemen. you can't easily just grab the number of your uber driver and text her off-platform for a discounted ride.

taskrabbit-for-cycling is has too small an audience, and folks will disintermediate you. if you did get any traction you'd quickly run up against the same problem shops have, which is not enough mechanics, and you'd lose throughput advantage. cyclists also quickly generate meatspace networks. if i need something i can text people. i don't need your service.

some sort of local wrench-ambassador for d2c brands sounds like a good idea, but i think lbs can and eventually will do it better. or some sort of new rep network (which is one of the values i saw in the business of velofix, not just fixing shit, but as a front for repping some brands shops cant).

sliughtly more promising is the linkedin/angieslist for various cycling expertise angle. so you want to be a directory. not an easy business, and i think your audience for "services people know they want but don't also know who they want it from" is small.

take coaching. its personality or price man. personality is gonna be people putting out content that sells me on them, or with reputations. and price is being eaten by automated or pseudo-automated coaching plans.

i'm a web/mobile developer and have thought a lot about two related ideas.

one is on-demand expertise.

for a long time i wanted jim@ERO to produce something like clarity.fm for aero. clarity was a directory of business experts you could search and then book calls with on a price per minute basis. i'd love to get on skype and just go over some shit with an aero expert. same for coaching. i don't want a plan, but lately i'm confused about how to structure some specific weeks and would love to ask someone. wanna ask $some_pro a question about tremblant bike course? 4.00 a minute, click here to schedule a call.

the other is airbnb/vayable for bikes. connect people to shared bikes or rentals, and people to help them or guide them on rides when they are traveling. i would use the shit out of this, but i think the problem is liability and bikes. i'd happily take visitors on the best rides around here and give them gels and fix their flats, and loan them a bike. but i don't have a bike to loan in any other size, and if i get us lost and they get eaten by bears, i don't want to get sued.

if you weren't so damned abrasive on this forum i bet more people would chime in here. i think there are some opportunities in this space, but they are hard to assess as we are very much hostage to our own experiences and distinguishing the common core from idiosyncrasies is hard.
Last edited by: buzz: Mar 2, 18 5:13
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [buzz] [ In reply to ]
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buzz wrote:
if you weren't so damned abrasive on this forum i bet more people would chime in here.

andy coggan is a good example of why this is not true.
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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Manufacturers can't figure out the inventory puzzle that firms have long ago mastered in other fields. All this failure will hurt the sport.


What has really held the bike/tri business back is a HUGE amount of what I call polity, a lack of sophistication and professionalism, particularly at the retail level but also at the wholesale level as well.

I've worked all kinds of different angles in the business, and what has amazed me across the board is this lack of sophistication and professionalism. Are there good people who get it in the business(?) - of course there are, but they are few and far between. But it's so abundant and pervasive a problem, that when you try and be sophisticated and professional, you get laughed out of the room! I have SO many examples and stories of this over the course of 30+ years, wearing a number of different hats. I never know where to begin!


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
Last edited by: Fleck: Mar 2, 18 7:05
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [BrentwoodTriGuy] [ In reply to ]
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I stopped reading at "everybody knows what TaskRabbit is" ... because they don't. I've literally never heard of it. Maybe it's only me?


You are not alone - I've never heard of it either.

But in my work in the B2B world I often come across these businesses, web sites, etc . . where I go "What the heck do you do"? Even after spending some time on a lavish and impressive looking web site, I have no idea what the business is doing/offering.

Cool name though! I guess that's a start.

When you dig deeper into these sorts of companies, many of these are software/tech start-ups. They are often running off of large up-front investment money. Day-to-day they are losing a bunch of money. Their only end-goal is to be sold - where they (the founders/investors), hope they will recoup and cash in.


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [Fleck] [ In reply to ]
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Fleck wrote:
I stopped reading at "everybody knows what TaskRabbit is" ... because they don't. I've literally never heard of it. Maybe it's only me?


You are not alone - I've never heard of it either.

But in my work in the B2B world I often come across these businesses, web sites, etc . . where I go "What the heck do you do"? Even after spending some time on a lavish and impressive looking web site, I have no idea what the business is doing/offering.

Cool name though! I guess that's a start.

When you dig deeper into these sorts of companies, many of these are software/tech start-ups. They are often running off of large up-front investment money. Day-to-day they are losing a bunch of money. Their only end-goal is to be sold - where they (the founders/investors), hope they will recoup and cash in.

i'd never heard of taskrabbit either. but after nosing around it seems like a rehash of discombobu.web, of which you are of course familiar, as everyone is.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [jkhayc] [ In reply to ]
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coggan has advantage of always being some combination of: a) he's coggan ffs b) brief c) correct
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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I'm a IT / Telco / Tech field engineer, and I get a considerable part of my income through platforms like the one you're suggesting.
I work directly for local and regional businesses (the local high end bike shop is one of my clients), I subcontract for national companies, and I do a number of varied jobs the way that you're describing. The end users are from tiny to huge (up to literally the largest retailers in the world).
It works great for me (I can be a full time single dad, train 8-10 hours per week, and make enough money to do this triathlon thing).

The reactions that basically consist of "?!?" seem to mainly be potential users. A user just needs to automatically go to the app/ site.

Looking at it from what I know, I believe you could succeed. A ton of caveats, but hey, that's life.

NO
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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To answer your last line: I think you should do it, but only launch when you have a viable product.
I think you should probably stay off the forum discussing it, you're dropping a tech business discussion here that might be off-putting to the same people here that will happily use the service once it exists.

NO
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [Alabama Viking] [ In reply to ]
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OTOH, its nice to build allies and a pool of beta users and a source for honest feedback. so as long as it stays real and doesn't get too promotional, i think it is good.
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [ In reply to ]
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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I have no idea what TaskRabbit is, either. But I'm old and no longer in a market demographic that matters to most advertisers or businesses. However, I think you're correct.

Here are my two latest experiences with local LBSs. I need a new rear brake for my Shiv, but I'm not in a rush. I go to one LBS where I used to work. They have one at another location. It'll be here in three days. Fine by me. Ten days later, no communication. I call. "Their inventory was off, I'm going to order it for you tomorrow." Don't bother, I told him.

Went to a second LBS. Ordered it and a saddle. It'll be here in a week. The saddle was, but the brake took 10 days. Not a big deal since I'm not in a rush. But if I had been, this would have been bad. Sadly, I could have ordered the saddle from Specialized, but the brake isn't on their website.

I was on vacation in Florida in December and needed some work done on my bike. I called Bike Bus. Ralph came out and did a great job. But I knew Ralph from when he managed and LBS where I like to vacation, so I was comfortable calling him. I usually stop by an LBS a few times before taking my bike to them. Would I call someone like VeloFix if I didn't know them? Maybe, maybe not. But as long as service at LBSs fails to meet promises or expectations, online sales and mobile services will continue to grow.
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [BrentwoodTriGuy] [ In reply to ]
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Interesting. Unlike others here, I've heard of TaskRabbit, but haven't heard of VeloFix before (I'm based in NYC). Wonder why there isn't a VeloFix franchise here in NYC. I bet it would do pretty well. Lots of cyclists in NYC.
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [JonathanNYC] [ In reply to ]
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haven't heard of VeloFix before (I'm based in NYC). Wonder why there isn't a VeloFix franchise here in NYC. I bet it would do pretty well. Lots of cyclists in NYC.


They (Velofix) only recently closed a deal for a franchise (s) in the NYC area and the two vans only started rolling a short while ago - https://www.velofix.com/...ions/new-york-metro/


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
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Re: VeloWorks -- The Future of the Local Bike/Multi-Sport Shop & Services Business [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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First I had heard of taskrabbit
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