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Treadmill Incline
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I typically run at 2% incline on my treadmill based off things I have read and heard.

Like most I have training paces for each build based on testing on repeatable outside flat course. Do you adjust treadmill speed for incline?

For example... using a treadmill pace conversion chart 7.0 mph would be 8:34 outside, 8:56 treadmill 0% incline (considering you're running on a moving belt), 8:32 1% incline, 8:10 Treadmill 2% incline.

I'm looking at this from an injury perspective as to not go too hard on the treadmill compared to outside testing
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Calvin386] [ In reply to ]
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I use a garmin footpod to track TM pace. I've found through direct comparison in similar conditions that my footpod pace on the TM corresponds to outside pace when the TM is set for 2.5% incline. At that incline, I will get the same footpod pace, and same heart rate, if the indoor and outdoor temperatures are the same. In fact I just redid this last week, since fall temps are generally perfect for that.

My approach was to log a 30minute run outside in temps that were the same as indoors (65F in my case). Then I set the TM at 1.5% incline, and adjusted the TM pace until my footpod read the same as my grade adjusted pace for the outdoor run. Then I increased the incline every 5 minutes until my indoor HR equaled my outdoor HR.

I'd guess everyone is slightly different depending on your running style/cadence/etc. So, I'm not saying 2.5% is right for you.
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Calvin386] [ In reply to ]
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Don't have a definitive answer for what you're looking for, but would like to point out errors in treadmill speeds.

The treadmill I run on is slow ~30secs/mi near the 7mph end, and 10secs closer to the upper end.
Measure your belt, and plot the rpm --> speed vs what it says on the dashboard while you're running, after the motor's warmed up.
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Nonojohn] [ In reply to ]
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I have calibrated my treadmill. It's pretty close

I use the garmin footpod as well for the treadmill. I calibrate it to match the adjusted for incline(2%) speed.
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Calvin386] [ In reply to ]
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I use the garmin footpod as well for the treadmill. I calibrate it to match the adjusted for incline(2%) speed.

I don't understand why you would do that? That seems completely backwards to me.

I let my footpod auto-calibrate to my outdoor running. My TM reads 8:34 pace when my footpod tells me I'm running 7:45 pace. I can confirm via RPE and HR that I AM actually running closer to what the footpod says.

So, I ignore all indicators on the TM panel, and just use my footpod / HRM for gauging effort...and calibrate HRM/RPE using the incline of the TM.
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Tom_hampton] [ In reply to ]
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+1

"see the world as it is not as you want it to be"
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Tom_hampton] [ In reply to ]
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Tom_hampton wrote:
Quote:

I use the garmin footpod as well for the treadmill. I calibrate it to match the adjusted for incline(2%) speed.


I don't understand why you would do that? That seems completely backwards to me.

I let my footpod auto-calibrate to my outdoor running. My TM reads 8:34 pace when my footpod tells me I'm running 7:45 pace. I can confirm via RPE and HR that I AM actually running closer to what the footpod says.

So, I ignore all indicators on the TM panel, and just use my footpod / HRM for gauging effort...and calibrate HRM/RPE using the incline of the TM.

That's interesting. I'm going at from a totally different angle. My treadmill belt speed is accurate. Therefore if the belt is running at 7mph (8:34 pace) at 2% incline, it seems my effort would be more than an 8:34 pace due to the 2% incline. That's why I calibrate my foot pod to match the adjusted pace. .

When your TM reads 8:34 and your FP is 7:45, are you on 0% incline?
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Calvin386] [ In reply to ]
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What formula are you using to come up with the graded pace on the treadmill?
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Re: Treadmill Incline [offpiste.reese] [ In reply to ]
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https://www.hillrunner.com/calculators/treadmill-pace-conversions/
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Calvin386] [ In reply to ]
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Calvin386 wrote:

That's interesting. I'm going at from a totally different angle. My treadmill belt speed is accurate. Therefore if the belt is running at 7mph (8:34 pace) at 2% incline, it seems my effort would be more than an 8:34 pace due to the 2% incline. That's why I calibrate my foot pod to match the adjusted pace. .

When your TM reads 8:34 and your FP is 7:45, are you on 0% incline?

Incline doesn't really matter for belt speed / footpod pace. Nevertheless, my TM doesn't go below 1.5%.

Until recently I was using the 1.5%. My HR always seemed a little low for the pace I was running versus outside (147 @ 7:45 pace). But, the outside and inside conditions were always so different that I couldn't really be sure. Now that fall weather matches my indoor conditions I finally had some data to confirm that suspicion and adjust the incline to boost my heart rate up to where I expect it to be (152 @ 7:45 pace).

Now, if I slow down to a footpod pace of 8:30...my heart rate falls to about 145 or so. And, if I speed up to 7:00, my HR is up around 159, and 169+ for sub-6. These all match up quite well with my outdoor paces and HR for equal conditions (temperature).

Truly calibrating a TM belt isn't trivial. So, I would ask how confident are you in that calibration. Because if your body is telling you something different than what the TM says...I believe the biology, not the electronics.
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Calvin386] [ In reply to ]
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Depending on your injury you might want to consider keeping the treadmill at 0% and adjusting treadmill speed to desired effort level. Continuous running at an incline can worsen or induce plantar fasciitis in some runners. I used to always run at 2% but now tend to do most of my intervals/speed work at 0% based on effort, plus running on the treadmill makes it easy to keep upping the speed a bit at a time. I make notes in my garmin file about the setting for later reference. I also do use a garmin foot pod as well, automatically calibrated to outdoors, for comparison as well. For long treadmill runs, I adjust the incline up and down every few minutes.
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Tom_hampton] [ In reply to ]
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Tom_hampton wrote:
Calvin386 wrote:


That's interesting. I'm going at from a totally different angle. My treadmill belt speed is accurate. Therefore if the belt is running at 7mph (8:34 pace) at 2% incline, it seems my effort would be more than an 8:34 pace due to the 2% incline. That's why I calibrate my foot pod to match the adjusted pace. .

When your TM reads 8:34 and your FP is 7:45, are you on 0% incline?


Incline doesn't really matter for belt speed / footpod pace. Nevertheless, my TM doesn't go below 1.5%.

Until recently I was using the 1.5%. My HR always seemed a little low for the pace I was running versus outside (147 @ 7:45 pace). But, the outside and inside conditions were always so different that I couldn't really be sure. Now that fall weather matches my indoor conditions I finally had some data to confirm that suspicion and adjust the incline to boost my heart rate up to where I expect it to be (152 @ 7:45 pace).

Now, if I slow down to a footpod pace of 8:30...my heart rate falls to about 145 or so. And, if I speed up to 7:00, my HR is up around 159, and 169+ for sub-6. These all match up quite well with my outdoor paces and HR for equal conditions (temperature).

Truly calibrating a TM belt isn't trivial. So, I would ask how confident are you in that calibration. Because if your body is telling you something different than what the TM says...I believe the biology, not the electronics.

Now I'm totally confused as my whole approach is in question. We are really splitting hairs but I want to figure this out
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Re: Treadmill Incline [s-b-r-ofthemill] [ In reply to ]
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s-b-r-ofthemill wrote:
Depending on your injury you might want to consider keeping the treadmill at 0% and adjusting treadmill speed to desired effort level. Continuous running at an incline can worsen or induce plantar fasciitis in some runners. I used to always run at 2% but now tend to do most of my intervals/speed work at 0% based on effort, plus running on the treadmill makes it easy to keep upping the speed a bit at a time. I make notes in my garmin file about the setting for later reference. I also do use a garmin foot pod as well, automatically calibrated to outdoors, for comparison as well. For long treadmill runs, I adjust the incline up and down every few minutes.

I am not injured now but all my injuries come from running too hard. I'm just being careful.
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Calvin386] [ In reply to ]
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When using woodway curve manual treadmill, my garmin 920xt in indoor mode is dead on. On motorized belts it's off, and I trust the treadmill more, definitely has to do do with your stride form, and softness of treadmill


http://www.coupleofathletes.com
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Calvin386] [ In reply to ]
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glad to hear you are not currently injured! fwiw following the hillrunner pace conversion chart as a rough guide has worked for me on my own treadmill with my garmin speed then closely matching the stated treadmill speed (although as noted above this can vary greatly between treadmills). good luck!
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Calvin386] [ In reply to ]
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Calvin386 wrote:
Now I'm totally confused as my whole approach is in question. We are really splitting hairs but I want to figure this out

What are you confused by?

For my TM, I don't think that 50s per mile or 10bpm is splitting hairs. That's nearly an entire training zone difference.

I don't know how accurate yours is. So, I can't say. But, if your heart rate outside at a set pace is different than it is on the TM at that same "pace" by more than a couple BPM...and the indoor / outdoor temps are the same...then the TM isn't right. That comes with all the usual caveats about heart rate training...hydration status, previous training, etc. all effect HR. But, if you control for those...its a very good indicator of effort.

I calibrated my TM at 3mph, because that's the speed my wife walks. She uses the TM every day...me, twice a month. Even calibrated, it is STILL off by the 50s noted above at 7mph. So, even when calibrated at one speed they can be wildly off at another speed. So, I just skip the entire TM thing entirely as described above.

So, my advice would be to put your footpod on auto-calibrate and go for a couple of runs outdoors so that the footpod can calibrate with your GPS. I'm assuming your local outdoor temps are similar to indoor temps right now (50-60F). Use some 10-20 min section of your last run where you are running at normal training pace over level-ish ground, and get your average NGP, and heart rate for that section.

Now get on the treadmill and run at that same pace for about 10 minutes using your footpod as the pace indicator. Adjust the TM speed as necessary to get your footpod to read the right pace. Check HR after 10 minutes. if its low compared to your outdoor run, raise the incline. High? lower the incline. Let your HR settle for 3-5 minutes. Repeat. Once you are within a couple BPM that's good enough.
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Calvin386] [ In reply to ]
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No incline for me. My chiropractor said that running on an incline was partially responsible for my back pain. I think she was right.

It probably makes your legs stronger, but if you are having any back soreness, you may want to go back to flat.
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Lindenin] [ In reply to ]
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Same. Hate incline. I would rather run faster and longer. Going tonight and have a bunch of new song on You Tube ready to be replayed 4 times each. Most of morons walk on tread mills. WTF?
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Lindenin] [ In reply to ]
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Lindenin wrote:
No incline for me. My chiropractor said that running on an incline was partially responsible for my back pain. I think she was right.

It probably makes your legs stronger, but if you are having any back soreness, you may want to go back to flat.

I can feel in my back for sure, but I do it sometimes because it's tough and my HR skyrockets with some incline.
I usually set to 1.0 incline and don't feel much but I can tell I can run better if I set it to 0.
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Re: Treadmill Incline [Calvin386] [ In reply to ]
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Do you adjust treadmill speed for incline?


No, I adjust my effort to achieve the desired HR...I don't care what speed/pace the machine tells me I am doing.
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Last edited by: LSUfan4444: Nov 22, 18 4:30
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