I have done both recently, and I'm still trying to find out what's best. Personally, I feel like I perform better and reach more of my potential when I train in groups. I tend to work harder, and thrive from competativeness. However, it also hinders me in ways. In races with a bike training partner this year I've had mixed results. When we came out of the water together, I didn't worry about pacing, I just rode with him always around me, and had the highest finish all year. In races where we have not come out of the water together, he consistenly has a bike split several minutes faster. I seem to be dependent on having those people around me to pace from.

It seems that when I race and train alone without others around me (whom I'm familiar with) to gauge my efforts, I have difficulty.

Training in groups is definitely hard these days when everyone has a different schedule, and some people are on easy days, while others are on hard days, but I feel like it's quite difficult to reach my own potential without others. I would say that if you're able to train more effectively on your own, you have a distinct advantage over others. My buddy trains almost exclusively on his own, and when race day comes he is very consistent, as he is very familiar with himself. It is a goal of mine to learn to train more effectively on my own this year for the exact reasons you state.

---

---------------------------------------------------------

"What the mind can conceive and believe, the mind and body can achieve; and those who stay will be champions."

I've also gotten similar results. Training with a group of people (or team) can be fun, and it certainly has it's place in triathlons, just won't push me quite the same way. When I'm out by myself, I can focus, I know exactly where my limits are and I can then push them.

Swimming is a big one for me. I go a lot faster, and I can train a lot harder when I'm by my self instead of having a group of people to swim with or a coach to try and decide what I can or can't take.

Kind of a side note, but I've noticed (my self included) the more group riding you do, the more likely you are to unconsciously draft.

i tend to cycle through periods where i prefer training alone with cycles of seeking out company in my misery. you're right about training time being a great place to plan, contemplate, and just generally zen-out, which is much more difficult in a group setting where others might be distracting you from your inner thoughts.

typically when i'm getting pretty serious i'll skip the group sessions so as to remain totally focused on myself, goals, pace, effort, etc. selfish in the respect that it becomes 'me' time. in the spring and fall i prefer a group setting on the bike and have a more relaxed attitude and will discuss whatever comes up. i enjoy swimming 1-2x a week with masters but can go months on solo training due to scheduling.

however, my favorite training partner (and soon-to-be wife) and i can ride, run, and swim together in silence while letting the other zone out, and that counts as both 'us' and 'me' time!

---

Marty Gaal, CSCS
One Step Beyond Coaching
Triangle Open Water Swim Series | Old School Aquathon Series
Powerstroke® Freestyle Technique DVD

You're lucky Marty. Haven't found that training partner yet.

---

Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

I think it depends on the type of person you are. Triathlon training can appeal to the solitary or even anti-social type athlete and no doubt solo training works very well for some people. However, other people may find that their motivation is much higher when training with partners or even in a group.

As for myself, I find my swim training solo is fine, but as I hate running, it is almost mandatory that I surround myself with runners in order to stay motivated.

My favorite by far is the bike, so much so that I tend to view tris as just another type of TT but with a warm up swim and cool down run attached at either end. I love group riding with our club. They're just fast enough to push me very hard but not fast enough to normally drop me. We have a "drop the other guy" ride on Tuesday and a killer hill climb ride on Thursdays. This is almost like road racing at times and I get my hardest bike work outs on the group rides although they are unstructured. I also ride solo on the tri bike, or maybe with just my wife, but I find cycling solo quite boring compared to the wheel to wheel rides in the group where you have to have your wits about you. At other times in my life I used to race automobiles and go-carts. There is almost the same adrenaline rush with group riding that just isn't there riding solo.

For me tri is all about fun and fitness for a 52 yr. old guy who is grateful that he is still heathy enough to do this sort of thing and if I get an AG sprint/Oly podium once in awhile then that's great, because it won't happen every time because of my running. If there was a specific goal such as qualifying for IM Hawaii, then I imagine, besides changing my attitude towards running, my work outs would tend to be more structured which would probably involve almost exclusive solo training. It would also mean giving up my group rides and some of my other hobbies such as boating and scuba diving to concentrate on solo training, so I guess it's not likely to happen.

I train alone most of the time by necessity. I don't have many people around who are as slow as I am, and training with someone in a different world of speed is merely frustrating. I also may be in 3 or 4 cities in a week and tend to do what I can, when I can.

I actually like it. Like TD, I get a lot of thinking done. I'm a consultant, and some of the ideas I've had running, riding or swimming have proven lucrative. Maybe I should deduct my bike or running shoes as a business expense, huh?

An interesting thing I read a long time ago possibly relates to your insight cerveloguy: It is the premise that "elite" athletes tend to be "associators", not in the social sense, but in the context that they are constantly monitoring their own performance. They do not mentally focus on external factors during training or racng such as the scenenry or others on a group ride. Their focus is internal, on their performance. Their only observation of their surroundings is from the perspective of "How does this affect MY perfromance?" They are actively concentrating on only what they are doing. The very best demonstrate brain wave activity that indicates a state of arousal not unlike a person meditating. They are neither too aroused nor too distracted. They acheive and maintain an optimal state of arousal for a given task.

Recreational athletes tend to be "disassociators". They are the people who wear a Walkman, watch TV when they train, talk on group rides and couldn't imagine pounding out a 120 mile training ride by themselves with nothing but the wind, the pavement and their imagination as company. Often times these athletes cannot (or will not) be able to accurately identify their motives for participating in endurance sports. Upon deeper examination and interviews it is common to discover that "disassociators" engage in endurance sports due to some outside influence, not of their own desire. Their motivation is not internal, but external. Interesting.

---

Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

Speaking of training alone- I am out of here to do a 38 mile ride. Then 4 mile run- then the pool tonight before 9:00PM. Feels good to be back in the game.

---

Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

Having had alot of experience with solo training this year I feel that an ideal program for me needs an equal amount of both.

While working with a group can be fun, you may not be addressing your own specific weaknesses. Working alone may give you more focus and attention to your own needs, but it may also breed a complacency which is hard to shed on your own.

The Gopha mentioned being able to focus and awareness of limitations, and that is important. However, I sometimes find that the best way to break thorugh your own limitations is to ride with others. I can't push myself nearly as hard alone as with a group. It's just the way I'm hardwired. Unfortunately, the other side of the sword is that I would often find myself pushing too hard when I really needed to back off. It makes for some wasted training time for sure.

I've read similar stuff regarding elite runners and recreational runners. Elite runners tend to focus on the pain and how their body is feeling and responding to the stress. Recreational runners tend to do things to disassociate with the pain, like listening to music, etc.

I end up training alone 90% of the time, mainly do to family commitments. I try to go for 1 group ride a week. I don't mind training alone, since it lets me pay stricter attention to what's on my schedule for that day.

I have approached others about developing some type of training group next year, with the idea being that we meet 1-2 times per week next year and do a structured hard workout. Sometimes I find that it's hard for me to generate high intensities by myself. Hopefully the group atmosphere would help. The problem I'm running into is that so many people are fixated on "the plan" and everyone is training for different races of different distances.

Zeke

For swimming and running, I mostly train alone. It is just too hard to find partners who can train at the same time and at the same pace. I mostly prefer biking with others if only for the safety factor, but do ride alone at times. On my solo rides, I usually stay on a trail and do some intervals or something.

With a demanding job and a two year old at home, I have trouble finding time during the day\evening to get training done and as a result the majority of my trainig occurs at 5:00 in the a.m.. Given my distaste of early mornings, the possibility of disappointing others by not showing up for a workout is what gets me out of bed on many mornings. Also, having Masters' Swimming on Mon. and Wed. evenings gives me a set time each week to reserve for swimming. Everyone at work and home knows that I will be unavailable during those times. If I just tried to "fit it in", it would probably never get done.

The one thing that has made training with others possible is that I have a number of different groups with whom I do things. I can almost always find someone who is interested in doing what is on my plan for the day.



litherland

Both have their merits and I think that to take full advantage of the situation from a performance persective you need to mix solo and group training. However, different people are going to feel differently about this. Indeed, some get into these types of sports almost solely for the social aspect of it. The highlight of the week for them is the group long ride or run on the weekend. Others get into it for the completely opposite reason, a training ride/run may be the only time in their lives that they are alone and they want to keep it that way.

Back on the performance beat - from my experience I always seemed to push harder and go further in a group situation. But I do recall some epic solo work-outs and training days as well - typically a more controlled effort If it's Ironman triathlon training you are talking about at some point in time you need to be able to start to push yourself, on your own for extended periods of time while running/riding. This means solo efforts. So, again, the BEST is a mixture of the two.

---

---

Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

I have to say that me best training is solo. I can push myself as hard as I need to solo, and I can do easy days at the right pace solo. Training solo, allows me to connect to nature and to the spiritual side of things without the disruption of talk and other distractions.

All this being said, I probably do over 70% of my training in groups. Why ? For the social aspect of it. I've raced in tris now for 18 years and I have tons of tri friends. I have three types of friends: college friends (who I see a few times a year), professional friends in the semiconductor industry who I see constantly through work and tri friends. If I don't train with the tri and ski boys, I don't get to see them...period. It's not like we have time to go out for a 3 hour ride and then go out and hit a pub for another 3 hours. The 3 hour ride is our "pub time". So the bottom line is that I love training with my friends, not for the training aspect, but for the social aspect. I always get better training value when I do it solo, but it sure as hell helps to know that someone else is getting up to train at 5:30 am on Sunday to ride in 5 hours of rain !

I swim better in groups because it keeps my mind from wandering. And though I occasionally get a group ride or run in, I do all my specific training alone.

John "Lone Wolf" Royal

Just got back from my windy (Southwest at 16 mph, gusting to 22mph)39.25 mile ride. Felt good.

---

Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

It sounds like the consensus here is that group training has plusses and minuses, as does solo training. My experience seems to mirror most everyone else's

Solo Positives

• Solo You can work at the exact right level for your training plan that day
• Peaceful/meditative experience
• Easier to fit into a tight schedule

Solo Negatives

• Sometimes you don't push yourself as hard as a group would push you
• Can be tough to be alone for long time
• Easier to put off/procrastinate

Group Positives

• Working out with faster people helps you push yourself.
• Learn skills/techniques you wouldn't come up with on your own

Group Negatives

• You have to do the group workout, even if it isn't the best for you that day
• Sometimes end up helping others more than helping yourself

I started off not being a big fan of group workouts, mostly because I was training with Team in Training and I was faster than most. It was a good social experience, but I wasn't getting as much training benefit. Now I'm swimming with a Master's team, and that pushes me a LOT harder in the pool than I would push myself, and I'm slower than most of the people in my lane. I don't care so much that the workouts aren't ideal triathlon specific workouts, because they're damn good swim workouts. Besides, it seems like more than half of the team are triathletes anyway.

I'm still running and cycling on my own. This spring I'm going to join up with the New York Cycle Club's "A-19" group. If there was such a thing, I'd be a "B18" rider, so the group will go a little faster than my current pace, and I'll learn very valuable bike handling skills. No, the pacelining practice won't help me too much in a tri, but being forced to hammer up a hill because I'm at the front of the line with a bunch of fast guys behind me is a DAMN good workout.

I guess my conclusion is that if the group helps me push harder than I would push myself, I'm into it. Later into the season, I'd probably do more solo bike and run workouts that are more tri specific, but the group setting is great for winter & early season to get in some volume and extend my limits.

Lee


(Editted to fix formatting)

I'm a firm believer in doing both solo and witha group. When I'm training for an ironman I tend to do most on my own or with one other dependable person. With short course racing I need to push the threshold a bit more so I do as much as I can in a group. I think your mind needs to be trained for doing things on your own for ironman so during the race you are use to it. People tend to get carried away on long rides if they are riding in a group.

I have found that my best swimming has come from training with age group teams. Yeah it's can be a bit embarrassing when a bunch of 14yr olds won't let you lead the lane. running has gotten me mixed results. I truly enjoyed my college XC days and miss running in that group. Every afternoon was a comedy session or a suffer fest. I prefer to find people to do my track workouts with since I know I'll run 1-2 secs per 800 faster if someone is pushing or pulling me around a track.

---

Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

I know it! She is the best! (and occasionally checks the forum) ;-)

---

Marty Gaal, CSCS
One Step Beyond Coaching
Triangle Open Water Swim Series | Old School Aquathon Series
Powerstroke® Freestyle Technique DVD

I'm pretty much with everyone else -- group training and solo training both have positives and negatives. I let my next race determine whether or not I train with the group or solo. For example, right now, I'm training for a late season half IM, while our local group is training for a sprint in two weeks. So the group's training is geared toward this sprint. So I've been training on my own, especially swimming and biking. I can fit a group run into the mix about once a week, but even then, it's different. They run a 4.5 mile tempo run on a hilly out and back course. What I do is slow the pace down and do that loop a couple of times plus a little more distance. So I'm on the course with the group for half my run, but I'm not exactly running with them.

If we are all training for the same race, we usually all train together. But I find that the more focused I am on achieving personal goals, the more likely I am to train alone. Training with a group is often a compromise in many regards, and the more concerned I am about my performance, the more often I train alone.

That being said, I do get tired of long solo bike rides. Sometimes I'd love to have some company on those lonely Saturday morning rides when I'm way out in the boonies. But nobody in our local group wants to do a 4-5 bike ride, especially when their next race involves an 11-mile ride.

RP

I guess I am a total loner. As a newbie I set a goal in Aug 02 to finish IMWI 03, never having done any triathlon and being in marginal condition. All of my training, including the regular +100 mile rides where solo. I swim in a pool that, at the time I swim, I can have my own lane . Running, again, was all done by myself. I am not sure if this was the best plan but it gave me the flexibility to complete my goal and it totally turned me on to the sport.

---

********************************

Steve C.

I am with you scorner, all my training is done alone. Here and there I pick up a group ride with my cycling team (kind of required), but otherwise it is all solo. I run during my lunch hour and then swim on evenings I do not have my daughter. Cycling, well that is done whenever I have time and on Saturday mornings (usually crits or road races). I do not fit in on group rides very often. I am out there to train, not talk about world events (I am 'news free').

I did pick up a training partner this summer though. My roommate/buddy wanted to get into shape, so he signed up at my gym. Now we are swimming together and swim side by side. That is fun, plus between intervals there is someone to chat with. Just need to get him out on the bike and enter him in some races :)

---

Reverend Dr. Jay
Lake of the Pines Triathlon fastest bike course record holder - Golden State Super Sprint fastest tri course record holder - Wildflower Long Course slowest run course record holder (4:46:32)

---

"If you have a body, you are an athlete." -Bill Bowerman

I do most of my training alone for various reasons:

• From Monday to Friday I find it hard to waste 1-2h (waiting or just doing something to fill the time) after work since usually a group run will start at 7 or 8 PM.
• Usually on Sunday I attend a group long run but for this I had to wakeup at 6 AM to eat something before. Of course the run will not start at the announced hour and I end arriving back at home at 12 - 1 PM. So a 20-30km run is taking 4-5 hours with gathering, warming up, random breaks on course (mostly for pictures).
• No one from the group has training knowledge so is hard to explain why I run easy today for example. They just go all out every workout and also are doing a lot of basic mistakes (at least some of them are funny e.g. wearing cotton panties under running shorts or cycling bibs).
• There is a lot of hate going on and they put my results on the fact that I'm younger. But they forget the thing that when I started training I was younger and slower than most of them.
• There are not many people training in the town so the group training options are limited.