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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [Eroc43] [ In reply to ]
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Eroc43 wrote:
I honestly think IMAZ will happen. I am not registered, but did it last year and have a lot of friends in AZ. They are all saying that anything that is called off is not good politically for the person or group that called it off.
The race is 4 months away, and as bad as it sounds I don't think that the counts will continue up for 4 more months. If we are at a 7 in AZ right now, and go up to a 9 in September, then back to a 7 in NOV, I think they will have the race because "things are trending down"
From what I understand from other race promoters, it costs the event a lot more money to cancel, then to be cancelled by the city state or federal government.

These statements are as delusional as the governmental leadership that got our state of AZ to the place it is right now...

I would love to see a race like IMAZ go off in Nov...not for the racing but as an indicator of where our country is in the management of this pandemic. Reality is what others have stated earlier...Some racing/normalcy in late late 2021 is best case scenario...
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [wintershade] [ In reply to ]
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wintershade wrote:
I agree with your assessment.

I do think you'd do well to adjust your tone however. You seem to be gloating in the fact that none of us will get to race this year (nor is 2021 looking great at the moment, sadly). I get it, you've had some epic battles on this forum defending this point of view since March and I suppose perhaps feel vindicated that you were right. Why celebrate the fact that many people's personal goals have been stripped away? Why celebrate the fact that race directors and race directors who make a living in multi-sport have lost their livelihoods?

You’re off base with your comments. I don’t want to be right, I don’t want to be vindicated, and I’m not celebrating anything.

This isn’t an “I told you so” moment. I wish I would’ve been totally wrong about everything. How else was this ever going to play out though? No vaccine or effective treatment = no racing. There’s a lot of people smarter than me that let emotions or pure selfishness cloud their thought process and judgment.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [alex_korr] [ In reply to ]
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If it were that easy, why are colds and the flu still around? By your logic we should have herd immunity and those should be long gone
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [PBT_2009] [ In reply to ]
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PBT_2009 wrote:
My position is that I think there might be a way to have these events in a safe way instead of not having them at all. (or at least, they could be had in a way which is as safe as things are being conducted as of now).


I think most of us agree that there is a way to hold tris in a safe way during the pandemic, but can an RD make a profit on a tri held in a safe way? Field sizes will need to be reduced, hygiene supply expenses increased, volunteers harder to find, course design will likely require increased costs for permits, police, etc. Plus, I've read numerous comments on ST from athletes who wrote that they will wait until they can race "normally" again. Sure, short distance, small, local tris, 5Ks, trail races put on by clubs or non-profits can happen in a safe way during the pandemic but can/will Ironman and other RDs putting on tris, large running races, large cycling events for a living survive the next year or two?
Last edited by: Mark Lemmon: Jul 7, 20 13:03
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [imswimmer328] [ In reply to ]
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imswimmer328 wrote:
If it were that easy, why are colds and the flu still around? By your logic we should have herd immunity and those should be long gone

you're comparing apples to oranges, but ok.
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [imswimmer328] [ In reply to ]
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imswimmer328 wrote:
If it were that easy, why are colds and the flu still around? By your logic we should have herd immunity and those should be long gone

If COVID mutates at the rate of the seasonal flu/cold, then we are certainly screwed until an effective treatment is found. But fortunately, it has not been proven to have a similar propensity to mutate. See https://www.healthline.com/...d-19#More-infectious

Next races on the schedule: none at the moment
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [wintershade] [ In reply to ]
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wintershade wrote:
I think what we could do with more of are threads about new ways to challenge ourselves, how to best to train through this period of darkness, etc. We don't need to be reminded that 2020 sucks on so many levels. We need to be reminded that there is light at the end of the tunnel, and we need suggestions for how to get there.

Completely agreed.

But strangely, in many ways I feel that this whole situation is a blessing. Over the last 8-10 years I have allowed WTC and the big marathon races to trap me in this yearly cycle of planning, scheduling, working around things, etc. I am feeling quite liberated actually with nothing on the schedule at the moment. It is not all that bad. I still train 9-10 hours a week, but to me it feels more valuable - there is nothing superficially pressuring me. Anything I will accomplish in this period is of my own free will, as opposed to some sketchy marketing pushing me.

Next races on the schedule: none at the moment
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [Mark Lemmon] [ In reply to ]
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Mark Lemmon wrote:
PBT_2009 wrote:
My position is that I think there might be a way to have these events in a safe way instead of not having them at all. (or at least, they could be had in a way which is as safe as things are being conducted as of now).


I think most of us agree that there is a way to hold tris in a safe way during the pandemic, but can an RD make a profit on a tri held in a safe way? Field sizes will need to be reduced, hygiene supply expenses increased, volunteers harder to find, course design will likely require increased costs for permits, police, etc. Plus, I've read numerous comments on ST from athletes who wrote that they will wait until they can race "normally" again. Sure, short distance, small, local tris, 5Ks, trail races put on by clubs or non-profits can happen in a safe way during the pandemic but can/will Ironman and other RDs putting on tris, large running races, large cycling events for a living survive the next year or two?

I don't think it really matters.
Nor does it matter if:
-The locals really want it
-Tourism needs it
- Thats how Texas rolls...

Because regardless of all that, no municipality is going to give a permit for it.
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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The GMAN wrote:
You’re off base with your comments. I don’t want to be right, I don’t want to be vindicated, and I’m not celebrating anything.

Maybe. Just doesn't read that way to me.
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [alex_korr] [ In reply to ]
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I agree. The USA is a failed country at this stage and there seems to be no light at the end of the tunnel yet....
Sam
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [japarker24] [ In reply to ]
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No Ironman. No problem.
ITU. Super League. Challenge. Those are just the big names.
Triathlon is so much more than the m-dot.

#swimmingmatters
Laugh hard. Run fast. Be kind.
The Doctor (#12)

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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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Well I am signed up for IMMD, live in Maryland and am a practicing physician. Yes training like it's going to happen, but I really really doubt it. Also signed up for Eagleman which was cancelled so I guess I'm doing that event next year. Most of us are planners, frankly just tell us so we can move on and plan for next year. Waiting until the last minute is actually cruel for many athletes who financially may suffer.
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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SBRcanuck wrote:

Because regardless of all that, no municipality is going to give a permit for it.

I think Lubbock 70.3 may have happened if the race was scheduled a week or two earlier. There have been tris held in the U.S. in recent weeks that have been mentioned on ST.
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [Flagster] [ In reply to ]
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To be clear, I am not saying I agree with any of the things I said. But there are people that do, and in some states, there are a lot of them. My whole family lives in Texas, they are still having motocross races (my family is not attending), The Driveway series in Austin is still going on and the promoter more or less said exactly my point
“I do wish we were shut down — I’d prefer that we weren’t risking it,” Willis said. “But since we are open, and we do have to pay these bills, I see this as a personal responsibility.” https://www.velonews.com/...es-return-to-racing/
The post was more about will a race happen somewhere, not should a race happen. And I think if there is a race that could occur, it would be IMAZ
Last edited by: Eroc43: Jul 7, 20 13:32
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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The GMAN wrote:
wintershade wrote:
I agree with your assessment.

I do think you'd do well to adjust your tone however. You seem to be gloating in the fact that none of us will get to race this year (nor is 2021 looking great at the moment, sadly). I get it, you've had some epic battles on this forum defending this point of view since March and I suppose perhaps feel vindicated that you were right. Why celebrate the fact that many people's personal goals have been stripped away? Why celebrate the fact that race directors and race directors who make a living in multi-sport have lost their livelihoods?


You’re off base with your comments. I don’t want to be right, I don’t want to be vindicated, and I’m not celebrating anything.

This isn’t an “I told you so” moment. I wish I would’ve been totally wrong about everything. How else was this ever going to play out though? No vaccine or effective treatment = no racing. There’s a lot of people smarter than me that let emotions or pure selfishness cloud their thought process and judgment.

Well, it does come across like you are gloating (I already said this to you 2 months ago, that it comes across that you feel happy that people are losing their livelihoods, while others are losing their athletic outlet). If this is not your intent, it does not come across that way. A better angle would be, "while I am waiting for racing to hopefully happen in the future, I will do XYZ that motivates me in the mean time"

On my side, I have already done 450 hrs of training this year. Last week was a 22 hrs week the week before 20 hrs, just for the sake of training. I do several solo triathlons per week, some easy, some I race myself. I don't NEED WTC or any race organizer. I'll hopefully do my own 10,000m swim event (25x400IM on Dec 30th) assuming I can get a 3.5hrs block of pool time. I don't need racing, although I was looking forward to it after a 4 year hiatus and just getting back into triathlon last year. I did the Dubai70.3 when the pandemic was in full swing in Wuhan and on the Diamond Princess. I was looking forward to more, but I can wait now and I don't need to do events with travel. A local sprint and olympic tri is just as satisfying.

But for the people who have their livelihoods tied in events, equipment, coaching and other supply chain aspects of the sport, I would like there to be racing all around the world as we get to the path of a vaccine, while we live with the virus around us and manage risk. For those people, how you and a few others have come across hurts them. You're effectively saying, "NO CHANCE FOR ALL THESE PEOPLE TO PUT FOOD ON THE TABLE" and many are here on a triathlon forum hoping that many of us will sign up for their business when risk is low again.

Just think about your angle.

Now if this was a monster truck forum and we were gloating that all those skinny guys in Lycra can't do their stufff anymore but we still get to do our monster truck racing from our distanced cabs, then that might make sense. But we're on the Slowtwitch triathlon forum, the entire point of which is doing triathlon, not the "Shut Triathlon Down Forum".

...and I get you and I will disagree on this topic, and the funniest part is you're the one addicted to WTC racing and seemingly don't care about local racing. You just want to do WTC racing while at the same layering every possible doom and gloom angle on the thing that you want to do!!!
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [Eroc43] [ In reply to ]
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Eroc43 wrote:
And I think if there is a race that could occur, it would be IMAZ

IMAZ is a race least likely to occur for several reasons:

- COVID hot spot
- Large metro area not dependent on tourism
- One of WTC’s larger races in numbers of racers, spectators, volunteers, and staff
- Vast majority of out of towners
- Held in a large university area that’s going to present its own set of COVID problems
- Possible permit issues with the reservation, in addition to local permitting

A race like Lubbock or Muncie was far more likely to happen than a race like Arizona.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:

Well, it does come across like you are gloating (I already said this to you 2 months ago, that it comes across that you feel happy that people are losing their livelihoods, while others are losing their athletic outlet). If this is not your intent, it does not come across that way.

You were wrong two months ago too. Not my intent and I believe I called you out on it then.

Re-read what I posted without your projections. Could you point me to the part where I did a victory dance and rejoiced in people losing their livelihoods? I was merely speaking matter of factly. If it doesn’t align with your outlook then so be it.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [imswimmer328] [ In reply to ]
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So how is it working now with Ironman if you got moved from your original race to a later race and then the later race postpones/cancels as well? I don’t know about anyone else, but if there’s zero racing this year and possibly not next year some people are getting pimped of a fair amount of money. Will we ever get refunds or just keep playing this shell game???
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:

Well, it does come across like you are gloating (I already said this to you 2 months ago, that it comes across that you feel happy that people are losing their livelihoods, while others are losing their athletic outlet). ....

Uh, yeah, thats complete BS. I've read most of his posts, and while he's held firm in his stance that racing ain't gonna happen (and he's been right), I never got even the slightest hint that he was happy about any of it, including people losing jobs etc. I have no idea how you could possibly interpret any of his posts like that. Maybe you need to go for a ride.
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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SBRcanuck wrote:
devashish_paul wrote:


Well, it does come across like you are gloating (I already said this to you 2 months ago, that it comes across that you feel happy that people are losing their livelihoods, while others are losing their athletic outlet). ....


Uh, yeah, thats complete BS. I've read most of his posts, and while he's held firm in his stance that racing ain't gonna happen (and he's been right), I never got even the slightest hint that he was happy about any of it, including people losing jobs etc. I have no idea how you could possibly interpret any of his posts like that. Maybe you need to go for a ride.

..
I agree with you SBRcanuck. I think this is a manifestation of the "if you are not 100% with me then you must be against me" attitude that has become so common in western society over the last year or two. To have an opinion that "seemingly" goes against the grain,no matter how correct is often met with harsh and mostly emotion led resistance. ( I am about to go through the same thing on another thread) :-)
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [Flagster] [ In reply to ]
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Flagster wrote:
These statements are as delusional as the governmental leadership that got our state of AZ to the place it is right now...

I would love to see a race like IMAZ go off in Nov...not for the racing but as an indicator of where our country is in the management of this pandemic. Reality is what others have stated earlier...Some racing/normalcy in late late 2021 is best case scenario...

There are states with races already happening.

Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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I don't think GMAN is happy that folks in the tri community are suffering. In every post from him I see in his signature the tris that he hopes he still may have a chance to do this year (even though he states in this thread that neither of those events are going to happen).
Last edited by: Mark Lemmon: Jul 7, 20 17:00
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [TheStroBro] [ In reply to ]
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TheStroBro wrote:
Flagster wrote:

These statements are as delusional as the governmental leadership that got our state of AZ to the place it is right now...

I would love to see a race like IMAZ go off in Nov...not for the racing but as an indicator of where our country is in the management of this pandemic. Reality is what others have stated earlier...Some racing/normalcy in late late 2021 is best case scenario...


There are states with races already happening.

Are they much smaller races than WTC events though?
When I say no racing on a slowtwitch thread, I guess I'm thinking WTC. I def think its possible for some areas to get approval for much smaller events. Our local tri's typically have less than 100 people, I could see events like that happening where I am (Eastern Canada) in the near future.
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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I'm not the only person who is reading that your motivation for this thread is a victory dance for triathlon shutdown. As you said, its really too bad for that there are no triathlons in sight yet in some parts of the world and no major triathlons in other parts of the world. Where I live, there are some larger tris planned for the province next door (Quebec) in Sept/Oct. They are likely to not happen, but for now, they are on, and youth sport is back in to varying degrees in that province. It looks like Hawaii 70.3 is planning to be on in November, but their cases are creeping up too. A little hope goes a long way though versus everyone throwing in the towel.

A few people on this thread already pointed to the reality of timing and rollout of vaccine. We're not going to be able to dole out 7.7 billion doses to humanity in a big bang, so the entire hope on a vaccine is mired in impractical challenges of production rollout anyway (if it even works) to all the world. In the mean time, its not just triathlon, but many aspects of life all around the world will start to roll in some capacity at some point weighing risks. This will include all levels of sport (pools in my city opened this week for example, gyms are shut, most youth sport is shut). In the mean time what on earth turns on or not is the question. Can some form of triathlon be part of the turn on. You're saying no, others are saying, "let's see and keep training". I'm pro "staying shut more aggressively now, so we have a chance to get back to life of all kinds later". I would like the business world to turn on properly, then sports and entertainment will all happen. Right now the biz world is toast for a lot of industries.
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Re: The state of Ironman racing 2020-2021 in the USA [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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Until IMFL cancels, that race has a lot of hope.

I'm with Dev on this, the fact that there are people cheering on cancellations is really dumb. Every cancellation is bad for the sport. I see posts elsewhere cheering on an IM bankruptcy, and even here. If IM goes Bankrupt, Challenge won't be far behind and this sport's model will crumble.

Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.
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