I've used and had sucess with a set of the schwalbe one, did suffer a sidewall cut that was not the tires fault.
Crr is excellent, durability fantastic, ease of install was average (shim rs 500), cost was a bit on the expensive side.

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res, non verba

happy to poll that. the truth of it is, this is where the market is going. in a few years you'll be riding your IM races with a tubeless tire, with sealant, and you'll carry a plug rather than a spare.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Not seeing it any time soon to be honest.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

did you say the same thing 2yr ago about disc brakes in tri bikes? most people did. you oughta know better than to prognosticate anti the slowman. remember, you are making a wager. me? not so much.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Well I wasn't here two years ago, so I'd say no. Actually I've been fascinated with disc brakes ever since they started to pop up on MTBs, first place I saw them. Loved the performance idea there. If they can drive the weight down I don't see why they won't take over...still haven't.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

Running tubeless on my road bike (schwalbe) and just purchased a set of ENVE 7.8 tubeless for tt bike (Vittoria Corsa Speed). Fewer flats and less hassle IMHO. Carry a Dyna Plug and have had good luck with it as a permanent fix for bigger holes.

Exclusively on Pro-Ones for almost two years (25s on the road bike, occasionally 28s on the touring/gravel rig). Get 4-5k miles out of the front and 2.5-3.5k out of the back. On round 4 on the 25s always mounted on a set of 2010 HED Belgiums. Never flatted bad enough to ever need fixing it in the field. Have been using bontrager TLR sealant + glitter and recently swapped to doc blue but not impressed and will swap back when done. Source them for 38-39 bucks online somewhere so not a bank breaker. Before i got the gravel rig i was riding the road bike (w/PO 25s) on some nasty shit. They stood up to everything.

Have some limited experience with the vittoria but not enough to comment.

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36 kona qualifiers 2006-'23 - 3 Kona Podiums - 4 OA IM AG wins - 5 IM AG wins - 18 70.3 AG wins
I ka nana no a 'ike -- by observing, one learns | Kulia i ka nu'u -- strive for excellence
Garmin Glycogen Use App | Garmin Fat Use App

Which have I tried? All of them (and some others).

None of them make me want to go away from Turbo Cottons w/latex as both my everyday AND race tires (well, actually...I TT on Conti Supersonics and Vittoria Corsa Speeds, but I run latex in them too and not tubeless).

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http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

I'm using tubeless tyre since last year, both for everyday use and racing.

I used to mount Schwalbe Pro One, both 23 and 25, on a set of Novatec aluminum wheel, all of them changed just when run out, so cut, no flats.
At the beginning of this year I jumped on the Vittoria Corsa Speed on the TT rig with HED wheels and it worked great, just a little bit of work to put them on.
I'm using Bontrager sealant.
I think I had just one flat that need to be fixed on the roadside with the Vittoria's, but due to a sidecut caused by a big road hole that I didn't saw.
To be honest, I didn't experience a lot of flat tires also in the past with tubes, something like one flat/year.

I'll keep riding them, I'm right now planning to switch also on the commuting bike, I just need to buy a news set of wheels :)

Mtbers are using sealant and plugs. But back to the question I could not get the spes turbo 23s to seal on my rovals, schwable one 25 were easy, some tyres are easier to fit that others and that is a major decision for me. Got a cut in my schawble last week and the Stan’s sealed it back up for me. You need to keep topping the sealant up regularly for it to do its job. With this done properly I can’t see how any would puncture regularly.

I've been liking the Zipp RT25s. Not as fast as the Schwalbe Pro Ones but a very nice training tire and reasonably supple feel. Don't corner as well as a good clincher like the Schwalbe Ones or Michelin PR4. I would definitely ride them in rougher road races but not crits.

Tubeless I've run Schwalbe Ultremo, Schwalbe One, Panaracer Evo 3, Schwalbe Pro One, and Zipp RT25s. Big trade-off between durabilty and ride feel. The Zipps are close to the best compromise. I think the technology still has a ways to go.

I jumped on the road tubeless bandwagon about 6 years ago and have tried a bit of stuff. Not Tom A. levels of experimenting, but most brands you mentioned above and several models within those brands. There's only two tires that I have bought more than the initial set of:

1) Schwalbe One (Not the Pro One). No issues mounting and the sidewalls are about twice as thick as the Pro One with only a single watt lost to it according to BRR. I grabbed a couple pairs of 28's and 25's and am on my last pair of each. They are relatively fast for their tread and sidewall thickness. I suppose you could save ~200 total grams and 4 watts with the Conti 4000 which has always had more than enough puncture protection for my N=1.

2) Vittoria Corsa Speed. Running them since July 16. Terrible luck with punctures (my only tubeless flats ever), but crazy fast and feel so good. I had that original 2016 pair on HED Jets earlier this year and they had stretched to 26.5 mm at 80 psi. The Jets are the easiest wheels I have owned to get them on and off, so I'll likely continue racing them.

I originally used the Hutchinson Atoms on Campy Eurus 2-way fit wheels in 2012 and 2013. About average for ease of mounting. Used them at Battenkill. The first set was great. Most miles I ever got out of a set of tires and wore them out with no flats. But they were narrow. After the first set, I struggled to get them seated properly and they would bleed air overnight.

I currently have the IRC Roadlites on a set of Hed Belgium C+ rims. 25 on rear, 23 on front. Very comfortable and durable. 1 flat in 3,000 miles. A little easier to mount than the Atoms, but that could be the rim. Nicest riding clinchers I've ever been on. Also having bleed down problems on second set.

Since I don't get all that many flats and neither of these are race wheels, with GP4000sii's available for less than half the price of the Hutchinson the IRCs, I will be returning to tubed clinchers when these wear out.

then you are not doing much riding. you live in arizona, which is basically where EVERYONE should be running tubeless.

To the OP - I've had no success with Pro Ones, and have watched someone "flat" (but seal) 5ish times in 3-4 rides on the hutchinson galaktik thingies.

I'm about 2.5 years in and over 20K miles running road tubeless.

>99% of those miles on Schwalbe Pro Ones. The 23c versions measure out at 26.x mm wide mounted on 19.5mm internal Aeolus TLR rims. I would estimate 3-4 flats that did not seal. A multiple of probably 3x-4x of flats that did seal and I rode home - most, but not all instances, I didn't realize I had flatted until returning home and seeing the telltale sealant spray on the seattube/rear brake. NBD - easy to clean off. I consider these the tubeless equivalent of the GP4000SII - maybe without the "magic aero."

<1% of those miles on Corsa Speeds, but with three flats. Luckily none during races. Agree they "feel" amazing and fast, but more than the feeling, I look at the data and they say FAST. But damn these things are fragile.

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Amateur recreational hobbyist cyclist
https://www.strava.com/athletes/337152
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My Giant Trinity came with Giant's Gavia Race 1 Tubeless tires mounted on Giant's SR-2 wheel set. I didn't mount them, so I have no idea how bad that process is. However the tires have been great.

Can you expand on that from a racing perspective?

Are you basing your decision purely on CRR? It's a race so you want the fastest setup even if it means you have a slightly higher chance of a puncture. Just like you would race faster tires over a gatorskin.

Or even if a tubeless tire setup had the same CRR as your race setup (clincher and latex) that you still wouldn't choose tubeless because...?

Simply put, the Turbo Cottons not only are one of the fastest Crr options, but IME they're quite durable as well. I don't feel I'm giving up any "robustness" in running those as opposed to other, slower options.

In the end, the only tubeless ready tire option to meet, or exceed, the Turbo Cotton in Crr is the Vittoria Corsa Speed, but the CS doesn't last anywhere near as long. All other tubeless ready tires I've experienced are significantly slower Crr-wise.

So...for everyday riding (including light gravel use), it's 28C Turbo Cottons w/latex tubes for me. All day, every day.

For road races/crits, it's 24C or 26C Turbo Cottons w/latex. Sometimes I'll run 23C Corsa Speeds w/latex too for these.

For TTs, it's an "old version" 23C Conti SuperSonic on the front, and either the same on the rear, or a 23C Corsa Speed, depending on the particular rear wheel I'm using.

I don't bother setting up the Corsa Speed as tubeless since it's just as fast with a latex tube inside, and doesn't seem to be any less resistant to punctures, while also avoiding the mess and hassles of tubeless installation and maintenance...not to mention the mess sealant makes on my TT bike in the event of a tubeless puncture, which invariably I have to stop for anyways :-/

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http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

This has been the “year of tubeless experimentation” for me. Rims used thus far: various Hed Jet+ and Belgium+, Reynolds ATR, Mavic Crossmax, Mavic Road UST (the 64mm deep ones).

Of all of them, the Mavic Road UST system has been the best and most consistent. Honestly, it’s easier than setting up a tubed tire. The tires have been bulletproof too using Orange Seal and I’ve been actively trying to kill them. That said, and as a caveat to all of my other feedback here, I ride on pretty nice roads and trails. The downside to this set up is that the Mavic tires are slow-ish according to BRR.

I’ve also tried the Hutchinson “tubeless ready” tires on the aforementioned Mavic rims. They also mounted and sealed easily. One tire I took out of service because it developed a sidewall bubble in the first 200 miles. It didn’t burst but I also didn’t want to ride it until it did. The other tire was no worse for the wear after 500 miles at which point I took it off and put the Mavic tires back on. These tires warrant further experimentation in my opinion.

Mavic Crossmax Pros: these are on my F-Si. I’ve set up two pairs of XC tires (Mavic Crossmax tires and a pair of the Vittoria Mezcal). Both were easy to set up. I also mounted a Schwalbe G-One All Around in 29x2.25 for kicks about a week ago. Very tight to get on but it seated and sealed easy enough. The nice thing about the Mavic rims is that you don’t have to worry about rim tape.

Hed Jet+ rims:
-Pro One: bitch to mount, not sure I would feel confident I could get it off and back on if I had to put a tube in road side. No flats in probably 1,000 miles but the rear has worn more than I would expect for this mileage.
-IRC Roadlite: almost impossible to mount and I literally had to cut it off the rim.
-Specialized tubeless 26mm: not too bad to mount, seat, or dismount. No flats but didn’t run it for very long. Profile on the Jet+ rim certainly wasn’t aero.
-Vittoria CS 23mm: nearly impossible to mount and I flatted the rear within my first 10 miles. Orange Seal did seal the flat but I’d lost enough air to notice and had to stop to top it off. This was on the very, very nice roads around my house. No obvious culprit. I flatted the front the very next day less than a mile from my house and terminated my experiment. Removal of tires was very difficult and I wouldn’t want to do it road side. Normally I’d say Jet+ rims with Conti tires are a “6” on the install/removal scale. The CS was a “9” on the install/removal scale.

Reynolds ATR:
-Specialized Sawtooth: easy install, seated on the first go
-WTB... 45mm: impossible to seat, tried every trick multiple times. Gave up and popped tubes in them. I’m now hunting for a gravel tire in that size range.

Honestly, after all of the experimentation I’m a bit disillusioned with road tubeless. The only avenue I’ll continue to pursue is the Mavic/Hutchinson combo. Tubeless for my XC bike has been drama free and I’ll stick with it (just like everyone else it seems). Gravel still requires more experimentation. If I had to race tomorrow I would go back to my trusty Hed Jets with an Attack tire up front and a GP TT in the rear with latex tubes. I’ve never had a flat in a race with that combo (knock on wood) and if I did it wouldn’t be too much drama to repair. In training I’ve flogged the crap out of GP4000 Sii tires with latex tubes with only one flat in probably >10,000 miles. Said repair would have been hassle free if my CO2 inflator hadn’t gotten stuck on the valve (BOOM).

The last note I’ll add: road tubeless in its current form is probably only worthwhile for people racing short course competitively where a flat equals the end of your race. If you are racing long course you are probably best served by fast clinchers and latex tubes.

Thanks.

Do you know if there is a fundamental reason why you can't take today's list of fast rolling non tubeless tires and simply make them with a tubeless ready bead? Forgive me for ignorance, but isn't the bead the main difference? Does it take different TPI or casing design to support a tubeless bead that then impacts CRR?

What you describe is basically what Vittoria did with the Corsa Speed. They took a high-TPI, poly-cotton casing with a "glued-on" tread construction. Most likely changed the bead reinforcement from Kevlar to carbon (for lower stretch) and then applied what appears to be a latex-based barrier layer to the sidewall exterior and to the inner part of the casing. I think those extra layers were not only about reducing air and sealant leakage, but also about helping latex-based sealants "work" better in the event of a puncture as well.

I don't know why other manufacturers haven't tried something similar.

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http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

I just wish Vittoria would offer a version with a slightly thicker tread. In my (short) experience it was just too fragile as it currently stands. Also, Schwalbe needs to bring the Ironman Tubeless back but without the butyl layer and with an updated compound.

Agreed. Just thicken the tread until the Crr matches, or just barely beats a Turbo Cotton w/latex :-)

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http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

Spesh Roubaix, Schwalbe pro one, Schwalbe pro.

I'm not looking for elite level Crr, so the feel of the roubaix do it all for me. And I've had good durability with them.

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