Seems like that is not a scenerio for any type of comparison. You need some constants to guage where each of you are. If you have resting heart rates, AT's (better yet is the HR for VO2max) and MaxHR for each of you... then you can guage your workloads relative to each other. But even then, I am not sure what you gain from the knowledge unless one of you has forgotten your HRM and the other wants to know about where you are in the workout. Even then, how rested your bodies are will cause variations.

To answer your question... the difference is not unusual. My girlfreind is only 2 years younger than I am. Her HR hits 150 within 5 minute of a ride and mine is still under 110. I have been running all winter so my heart is in shape... but my cycling legs are a bit behind. It is hard as hell - and takes me 20 minutes to reach FA - nearly kills me to be at AT on the bike right now. My last training partner was 12 years younger - but her HR was within 5 beats of mine almost all of the time. Go figure...

I don't know about the Princess but I know that my heart rate tends to race abnormally high. When training my max heart rate is about 250 - even though my resting heart rate is about 55 and I too have pretty good endurance (although I don't do ironman, only oly and under, as I enjoy too many other things to dedicate that amount of time) A moderate jog is about 160 bpm. I have gone to the doctor and was told that as long as I wasn't feeling any dizziness etc. then don't worry about it. My heart rate seems to jump almost instantly to these levels and then stay there. I don't know why but it has been the same way since I started tracking heart rate when I was about 13 (with swimming in '86). My coaches throughout the years have just had me track perceived effort and heart rate for a few weeks and then adjust the 'recommended' heart rate for me based on this. (i.e. 80% effort is about 180-190 bpm).

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"which is like watching one of your buddies announce that he's quitting booze and cigarettes, switching to a Vegan diet and training for triathalons ... but he's going to keep snorting heroin." Bill Simmons, ESPN

Tom

Women typically have higher HRs then men. That being said, there is nothing wrong with getting stress test done. It's always better to be safe then sorry.



Mike

www.d3mutlisport.com

Desire. Determination. Discipline.

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Mike Ricci
2017 USAT World Team Coach
USAT National Coach of the Year
Coaching Triathletes since 1992.

I'm married to a French Canadian Princess (medium sized) - and I have also noticed that she too has a much higher heart rate than mine by 10-30 bpm. She's in pretty good shape and can usually keep up with me for the short to medium run. Maybe it's just an FCP thing.

It could also mean her heart rate goes up when you're around. ;)

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put the mettle to the pedal

Um, maybe specificity of training?

She's not necessarily in "cycling" shape, even if she can ski you into the slope. But she may have a higher rate due to lower stoke volume. Women do tend to have slightly smaller hearts.

As an example, several years ago I was doing hill repeats (cycling) with some team mates. One guy was a bit of a sprinter type, but a good rider any way. We were going up this hill side by side (he was preparing to dust me at the top). I glanced over at his HRM and saw 195, while mine was at 160. He saw mine, too. He wasn't any slower than me, and we were about equal condition at the time, he just tends to have a higher heart rate at similar loads.

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Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies...

https://triomultisport.com/
http://www.mjolnircycles.com/

She has pretty good cycling specific fitness. She does a killer spinning class once or twice a week and swims every other day with a masters group that is super strong. She has been in the sport for a year (she and I started dating in January- we've only been seeing each other about 6 weeks if that). I suspect that, although she is reasonably fit, she does not have enough easy "base" miles. Those spin classes get pretty intense and her swim workouts are legendary. I tell her she trains too hard for this time of year. It would be tough to get her to back up and do some long, easy training. Any further suggestions?

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

[reply]Tom

Women typically have higher HRs then men. That being said, there is nothing wrong with getting stress test done. It's always better to be safe then sorry.



Mike


There is something wrong with getting unnecessary medical tests. I'm not a cardiologist, but I don't see why a 29 y/o women who can maintain a heart rate of 190bpm while doing vigorous aerobic exercise would benefit from a stress test. Any internists out there want to comment? If not, how 'bout the medical students (Taku?).

[url "http://www.d3mutlisport.com"]www.d3mutlisport.com[/url]

Desire. Determination. Discipline.[/reply]

I'm sure there are many factors that determine an individuals heart rate. In my marathon training group runs there is a guy the same age and weight as me but his HR is 30 beats higher. He runs the same distances with no problem and stays aerobic at the higher rate. Her HR is probably just naturally higher for whatever reason and unless it is causing some kind of problem for her I wouldn't really give it much thought.

and drop back again instantly. Difficult to explain to a Doc but as soon as I show up at the ER and get an EKG I am sent to have it eval and it turns out it is PSVT.

Their explanation for no dizziness or other symptons was that I was relatively fit, the problem was that as my HR rocketed my blood pressure was dropping at the same rate. I jsut never knew it.

Its worth checking out.

That's my contention. I worry about her. She has a history of broken bones. She fell in the hallway at work and broke her wrist. She took a fall on a mountain bike in Equador and broke her wrist again. She got tested for osteoporosis (sp?) and tested "one level away from having it" whatever that means. The girl is only 29. She seems to train very hard and very consistently but doesn't seem to make huge improvements. Personally, I think she needs to gain 5-10 pounds. She's 5'4" and about 130 lbs. I think. She has a thinish build but isn't super skinny. Her arms seem a tad thin to me. If she put on a little weight I think she'd be more comfortable but I don't see that affecting the heart rate thing. She has a good appetite and maintains a much better diet than me (not hard). It's interesting. I am 12 years older, have been sick, lots of injuries and I just seem to be able to bang away at the training and get better but she seems to hang in there very well but not improve much. Strange.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

How much rest does she get? Could be overtraining? Training to long at to high heart rate not enough recovery rides. Spin class will do that.

Tom, Just a suggestion, don't ever, ever, ever guess your girl friends weight and or size in public. It is risky business doing it in private, doing it on the internet could be down right lethal. I have been married for 11 years and dated 4 years previous to marriage, I am still learning things about "WOMAN" but I can tell you that that is not a popular topic for most women.

Back to the topic, this week we have been doing benchmark tests and Conconni style tests with 5 very different riders, with very different backgrounds and abilities. It is truely amazing how the heart and how exercise effects all of us so much differently. For instance a very tall expireinced rider 44 years old has an average heart rate of 177 bpm over a 10 mile CT course averaging 307 watts. Myself 34 years old does the same benchmark and I do it at an average heart rate of 158 bpm and only 254 watts.

Hmmm, Point taken, but she's pretty secure with it. She had a long discussion with a few people in the store and openly discussed her weight with them. Not a big issue (at least she says its not....). I would have guessed her 10 pounds lighter anyway. You do have a point though.... gee, maybe this is why I have so many problems with women:)

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

I would tell her that she seems a little clumsey then tell her to lift weights and build strength also tell her to drop some fat so when she does fall there won't be as much weight landing. While at it mention a new hair style! This should make her feel as though you really care about her well being. Take my advice
and you'll do great with the womens

OK I have to put my two cents in after hearing this.

It is hard to determine what might be wrong or not wrong with her.

Good places to start.

Is she vegetarian, if so does she take any supplements.

Are her parents of the same build

Has she ever been worked up for anemia.

Does she have regular menses

Does she take any supplements.

Does she have any history of endocrine dysfunctions such as parathyroid disease

Is she allergic to any foods specific gluten or does she have a family history of this

does she have a history of mononucleosis

has she traveled outside of the US and Canada within the last couple of years.


As you can see some of these questions are kinda personal... But there is the possibility that something may not be quite OK with her. Obviously there is very little anyone could do over the internet and even less that I could do. But if both of you are sufficiently concerned than it may be worth it to first:

1) get a check up with her primary care doc, and describe her specific concerns. Depending on the results of the workup, it may be worth it to see an endocrinologist, a nutritionist, among other things.

It also may be thoroughly possible that she has a different genetic make up than you and being an athlete of considerable experience you may not be the best person to compare her to


either way if you want you or your gorlfriend can send me one of those private messages and we could talk about it some more. I won't be able to give you any answeres but I may be able to point you in the right direction.

Hmmm. I think this should have been posted under the "10 toughest sports" thread. This would be more dangerous than any of them.

OK, I see the med student has emerged from the lab/library or wherever he's been, so his opinion is certainly more valued than mine on this, but...

This seems like much ado about nothing. From reviewing the stuff on the bikesport michigan website about Tom's triathlon background, I think I'd be working pretty damn hard to keep up with him on a bike too.

I run frequently with a guy in my office who is about 5 years older than I am. We head out for easy "jogs" that rapidly turn into a series of 7:30 miles where he's trotting along talking up a storm with a HR of about 135, and I'm breathing hard, dog cussin' him to slow down and pumping about 165. This is not because I don't have regular menses. It's because he can run a 2:03 800 and a sub 17:00 5k, and I...can't. He is a lot more talented than I am, so I have to expend more energy to go at the same pace. His entire heart rate "range", i.e., both resting and max, are lower than mine, so that's part of it, but it's mostly just that I have to work harder to go at the same pace. Same for the princess.

On the slopes, she is simply more skilled than you, so she doesn't work as hard there. One more example, those guys who started swimming 30,000 yards when they were 6. Now, at 46, they are 15-20 pounds overweight, and they kick my skinny butt in the pool. Swimming and skiing are more skill things than cycling, but the analogy holds.

Hi Taku! Man, I was waiting for your response... Thank you!
So, Not a vegetarian. Her parents are "stocky"- a bit overweight, but quite active in a moderate way (walking, farming, etc.). No anemia. Takes a bunch of pills every morning. Plumbing working OK. Has been to an Endocineologist and came up with the low calcium thing (supplements that)and the osteo concern. That is an ongoing thing. No known allergies. No mono. Has recently travelled in several third world countries including Africa, Asia and Central/South America (including medical treatment in Equador in a hospital). In general her disposition is very calm but she takes her work very seriously and stresses over it.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

If she has seen an endocrinologist that covers the serious things that may be wrong with her. It may be worth it to have her speak to a nutritionist.

If she is an athlete low bone density should not really be coming up. As you exercise bone density should actually increase. But it is a very very good thing that she did see the endocrinologist. Getting back to the point, a nutritionist should be able to look at her diet and see if there is something changeable in her diet that can be addressed.

If after that she is still not feeling better it wouldn't hurt to speak to a psychologist about her goals in her life and her stresses. If all else fails go take a vacation on the beach, eat good food and relax... she probably needs the rest.

The other possibility is, because of her travel history it is thoroughly possible that she may have one of these infections tat western doctors are not very good about. It may be worth your time to see if there is an infectious disease specialist that you could speak to. There is so much that western doctor's are not familiar with... this I would have to say is way beyond what I know anything about.

Chances are, you sae the endocrinologist and they said there was nothing that they needed to treat her with that deals with all of the ovious things. It would be important to follow up with the endocrinologist after a while to see if the calcium supplements are doing the trick...


good luck

Tom,

Maybe you're the reason her heart "pitter-patter's" a little quicker than normal!

You romantic devil

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E-Z

--It ain't a good idea to swim near MY bubbles!

Tom,

I would have to every bit agree with Taku. It's late at night and my mind isn't that sharp right now, but there is a sort of female "over exercise" female athlete syndrome that has been recently given some print in the med journals that I remember reading about recently. Not as obvious as anorexia nervosa or other eating disorders, but it basically involves under nutrition long with pushing herself to physical limits. She might be just over working herself. As Taku asked, are her menses regular? Does she also have a day job and a life outside of the training of being a being a tri-geek? What about iron levels?

If in doubt, consider a full physical with blood work, urinalysis, etc. As she's in Canada this service is paid for by the government, so there is no excuse.

Thanks to all you guys for your concern and thoughtful responses. I really appreciate them and so does my French-Canadian associate.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

Hi Tom-

The following is quite lengthy but may shed some light on your girlfriend's low bone density. We've had a couple of fit, local tri ladies suffer pelvic fractures in the last year. Low bone density was the culprit. The British Journal of Sports Medicine has published the results of studies which indicate that, in some cases, long distance runners may actually have weaker than average bones. Dr. Melanie Burrow's (Lead Researcher at U of East London) researchers measured the bone density of the spine & hip in 52 women who ran from 5k-70k a week. The women, who were all pre-menopausal, were between the ages of 18 and 44. They all kept food diaries to provide info on nutrient and mineral intake, especially zinc, magnesium and calcium, all of which affect bone turnover. Other factors such as body weight, menstrual irregularities and the use of hormonal contraceptives were also taken into account.

The results showed women who ran longer distances were most likely to have the lower bone density. There seemed to be a small percentage drop in bone density with every further 10k run in a week. This could be the result of a diet lacking a healthy balance of essential nutrients. Higher magnesium and lower zinc intakes were associated with greater thigh bone density. This is because magnesium is important for thyroid hormone activity, low levels of which would decrease calcium uptake and therefore bone composition. It is also possible that zinc stiumlates the immune system to start breaking down bone. Further research continues.

Might be worth it to analyze her mineral intake and also get a complete thyroid check.

Good luck.