What is your AG?

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Aaron Bales
Lansing Triathlon Team

Get the super shoes. Even if you're not a great responder, they'll probably help with recovery versus whatever shoes you're currently training in. The Hoka super shoes haven't tested as well in the lab (SFA study in 2021). The Alphafly + Vaporfly + Metaspeed Sky all performed the best. Endorphin Pro + RC Elite were mid tier. Rocket X & Hyperion were bottom tier. The new On super shoe seems really good but wasn't a part of this study. They also didn't include the Adidas shoe but did a self-test and found them to be in between that first and middle tier.

Grain of salt because most of the shoes have newer models & you're not going to go to the lab and find out which shoe you respond best to. I've always found the Endorphin Pro to be a good shoe for me.

Agreed with the above. The super shoes are going to increase your effective leg length, bounce you off the ground better, and stiffen you foot on push off. These effects are greatest at high speed, but still there at lower speeds.

Don't get the Hoka's though, they truly suck. I used a friends pair and they were nothing like the Nike/Adidas supershoes. If you're going to buy a pair the Alphafly's, Metaspeeds and Prime X's are well liked by everyone who uses them. Race day shoes is a really bad place to pinch pennies.

If you do get the Super Shoe, limit yourself to just racing in them. If you're in the older age group and you were once prone to injury, running a lot in these kind of shoes will start to show any instability you have in your hips/stabilizer muscles that may have been ignored over the many years of activity. I save mine for race day only after I use to do workouts in them. I've gotten away from all carbon shoes for training and have seen some of those muscle/soft tissue issues start to leave my system.

I am at the bad end of the 65-69. The 10k times are from last year. Those time are now a memory and a goal as I rehab from a bike crash at the end of August.

Anyway, the thing that instigated this post was the new HOKA Rocket X2, which seems to be getting some positive reviews. I do not intend to use a super shoe for training -- except I would expect to have a run or two with them in the week or two leading up to the race (nothing new on race day).

You are doing awesome . . . I am close behind you in age and I train and race in super shoes. I am slow, but I appreciate the difference, particularly in recovery.

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David
* Ironman for Life! (Blog) * IM Everyday Hero Video * Daggett Shuler Law *
Disclaimer: I have personal and professional relationships with many athletes, vendors, and organizations in the triathlon world.

I am in the 60-64 AG. I started with the Endorphin Speed three years ago which is not technically a super shoe (nylon plate) and used it in a rotation with my ON Cloud Flow and New Balance Rebels. The speeds were more cushioned and faster Over time, I moved up to the Endorphin Pros (carbon) and New Balance Elite (carbon). I use them for speed days and races only. The rest of time I use the Rebels and the Speeds. I am definitely faster in the super shoes, but wouldn't wear them for every run for fear of injury.

I too had the same questions. Last year I bought my previous "go to" Hoka Cliftons and after several months gave up on them as I never got comfortable in them and they just felt (and were) slow. I hobbled about for several months in those, then rotated through pairs of Nike, Altras and New Balance (fresh foam?) that I have bought at different times. Also not a fast runner and couldn't see the point of Carbon for my pace as so many say they don;t provide an advantage until you hit 18kph. I only get that fast on a bike.

A couple of months ago there was a sale locally of Puma Nitro Deviates that were a 2021 model for CA $99 (that's about $1.95 US 🤣 ). I can never resist cheap. And carbon to boot. They have proven impossible to wear out are comfortable as all get out, they're fast and allow me to run 4 times week without damage. I understand the 2022 model is even better. They don't get a lot of love here but all sorts of Run sites in England love them.

My 2c

Not a fan of Hoka here but just bought a pair of Rocket X 2 out of curiosity. Holy crap!!!! They are game changer. Just get them and you will see. I’m sure a couple of threads will pop up soon as more people buy them. They will be my racing shoes this year. They hit the jackpot on these.

I think it's actually advisable to run in them as much as possible - which means if you choose to go this route you will need two pairs as you'll accumulate training miles on one, and race in the low-mileage one.

These shoes have specific things like heel-toe drop (Nike) and other fit issues that you're just asking for trouble if you ONLY use it on race day. A lot of people have gotten Achilles strains on the Alpha/Vaporflys from the shock of racing super hard on a shoe they're not adapted to since they only run with it on race day.

At the least, do regular faster day training in a reasonably close shoe that approximates the speeds and power you'll hit with the race day shoe. It's a bad idea to do what some people do, which is use highly cushioned, 'maxi' shoes for all their training in hopes it'll preserve their body, then shock the system with an Alphafly on race day which has different impact, geometry, and weightloading. A good x-over type speed training shoe is the Endorphin speed, which is light and fast enough you'll get most of the stresses you'll see on race day with the race shoe.

Hoka’s previous super shoe was definitely lacking. The new Hoka super shoe Rocket X2 is supposed to be legit.

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Let food be thy medicine...

I’ll put in my vote for the non plated Asics Superblast. I’m very close to you on age and speed. I’ve been training in Hoka Bondis since they came out over 10 years ago, and racing in Cliftons. My attempts at carbon plated shoes or any other lighter racers, has alway failed with tender shins, reaggrivating old stress fracture areas, and knee pain and swelling. Then, recently, after reading very positive reviews, I defected to Asics, and got a pair of Superblasts. Holy smokes, the competition has caught and passed Hoka. More cushioned than Bondis, lighter than Cliftons, and they bounce instead of sucking energy, like most max cushion shoes. Plenty of reviews, and they are all true. If I could handle the carbon super shoes, I would, but my age and old joints say forget it. But the Superblast is the next best thing, and I’m planning to get a fresh pair, just for racing. For context, I was struggling to get 40-50 mpw in the Bondi 8, and just hit my 3rd week in a row of 70 miles in the Superblast, with no niggles.

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Athlinks / Strava

I'm in my 60s also. I have found neither one of these to be true. Do not run in these shoes as much as possible and don't just save them for race day. Once a week might good amount and pay attention to how your legs/Achilles feel and back off if necessary!

Also, in my 60's. I have moved from Bondi's to train to Super shoes all the time. Currently train in Adidas Prime X and my legs feel so much fresher, but the biggest benefit is that they are truly fun.....I look forward to running in them. I will race in either Alphas or Vapors.....haven't really decided which.

What is your weight? That seems to be the more important question for older runners and super shoes. I believe the older and heavier you are then you need something like the Hoka Bondi to protect those brittle tendons, ligaments, and bones :) That said I'm 67 and 180 and do have a pair of Alphaflys but only use them for racing. And yes, a lot of things hurt after I race in them, but I believe that's mostly due to running faster than I have trained for in my Hokas.

I’ve been using the Sketchers Go Run Razor 3. They are very light weight - not really a Super Shoe.

Is there a Super Shoe that matches up with that model?

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Dan Kennison

facebook: @triPremierBike
http://www.PremierBike.com
http://www.PositionOneSports.com

Run in what makes you feel good and fast. When Vaporfly arrived they were a game changer for me. Times came down. No injuries. Run in them (and now AlphaFly) all the time. And I'm approaching the 4th lap of the life mile.

Sounds like what you need is the Bondi X. The next version will be even better considering RocketX2 is now peba based and getting crazy reviews.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

I wear Metaspeed sky for triathlon (full and half). Not as ‘snappy’ as the Nikes but more stable and probably better for older and slightly slower runners? I also have a pair of Rocket X’s…there is literally no comparison, the Hoka’s are comfy but have none of the cushy springiness of the ASICS or Nike. I can’t comment in the new Rocket X 2 though. At the pace you are running there will still be performance benefit in a true super shoe.

I agree with your assessment of the Puma deviate nitros, but had to give up on them because their distribution in the USA is the worst of any of the running shoe brands. You simply cannot find them at any of the running stores.

Don't get the Bondi X. It's not fast at all. It does have a 'fun' feeling, it that the carbon plate does make it feel springier, but let's be real - this is a heavy, superpadded shoe that I think is all old-school EVA. I'd pick it to race over the Bondi original, but any non-maxi shoe will be faster than it. A decent training shoe for the maxi lovers, but not a good race shoe at all.

My BondiX were great for 100, but dead by 200 miles. Very disappointed, considering the cost.

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Athlinks / Strava

There was recent research released that showed the Nike VF Next %'s were worth .9% to 1.5% improvement in running economy for those going 10kph and 12kph with 5 people in the study actually negative responders (their running economy got worse in the super shoes)

Hope that helps

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

Any other mer mortals have a take on the super blast by asics?