Not sure if you mean body weight or equipment weight, or both? Whichever it is, when you're on the bike, weight is secondary to aerodynamics. This has been hashed out a thousand times here. On the run however, very important.

---

VALÄ’RE | YouTube

Yeah holy crap I feel fat. The poster on the Bradley Wiggins diet?

cheers
S.

---

// qui audet adipiscitur

It can be done easily at his weight. He is only 62 kg. That works out to 3.1 w/kg for his 5:08.
You guys keep missing the point on damn near EVERY wattage post. I will state it again.
RAW WATTS ARE NOT THE PROPER MEASUREMENT!!!!!!!!!!!!
W/KG are what you need to be measuring. He is 62kg & did a 5:08. That is not hard.
As a comparison I did a 4:53 at Chesapeakeman Aqua Velo on 3.0 w/kg & I did a 4:58 at Cozumel on 3.1 w/kg. Neither race did I use a disc wheel.
Sub 5:00 on <3 w/kg is very attainable.
Mike

Why do you have to be small? I've done a 58:30 40K TT before on just 225W to the crank. I'm 5' 10-11" and 160-165 lbs. By my quick estimate, 200W would have clocked me ~1:00:30. You don't need to be small...just low drag :-P

A quick rule of thumb is that every 10W is "worth" ~1s/km...so if someone can clock a 60 min. 40K on 235W, then they'd lose ~3.5s/km if they only put out 200W. That would be ~140s slower...so yeah, they should easily be able to go under 1:06 for a 40K. I'm getting more like 1:02:20.

If you want to work it the other way, if someone takes 200W to go 1:06:42 for a 40K, they would need to go ~400s faster to break 1 hour. Using the ROT above (1s/km ~= 10W), that means they'd need a full 100W more to break the hour mark. Your talking more like 300W to be at the 1 hour mark.

So, to answer your question...no, it's not reasonable (all other things being equal, that is).

---

http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

Unfortunately, you're missing the point too...for timed cycling events (unless they are pure hill climbs), it's more about W/drag instead of W/kg.

See my post above to Dev.

---

http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/

4h29 @209w

173cm, 64kg, Challenge Barcelona 2009

alvaro
planetaTri.com

edit: date

+1

I'm 5'9" and 152. If I was any lighter, I'd look and feel like a "manorexic!"

5'11" and 137?!?!? By those standards, I'm overweight!! Aw crap!!

---

"Hold on, you run a marathon AFTER you ride your bike?!?....oh, you people are just insane"......(my Mom)

Rockin' the W in 2013!! Wattie Ink Elite Team

A very fast course, but still, that's awesome!

---

VALÄ’RE | YouTube

I agree that drag is extremely important. I would say the longer the event the more important it is. We are definitely in agreement there. My point is that 99.5% of all wattage posts on this forum reference "raw watts" instead of w/kg. W/kg is the measure that is relative. The relationship of watts to drag is what makes someone even faster. That was my inference when I said the trick is to produce the least amount of watts to yield the fastest time.
I totally agree with you on this.

Wow, is Challenge Barcelona a full 180K or is it a bit short?

Thanks on the grammar help! :)

I found this thread very interesting since I did my first race with a powermeter in IMCOZ and looking forward for next season to improve...

Here's my numbers from my powertap zipp 808, I was riding a zipp 404 front and aero helmet (Giro advantage 2)

Time 5:09:31
Distance: 183.64 km (Yes the course is long...) translate to a 5:03:23 on 112mi
Avg speed: 35.56 km/h
Avg power: 220watts
Norm power: 230watts
Watts/kg: 3.5

Height: 5'6
Weight: 140lbs (I feel fat by reading people numbers)

So getting back to this thread riding a sub 5h on 200 watts... how the hell are you guys doing??? Because if a could save 20 watts that would probably improve my run... Is it most about losing weight? Or you guys riding super agressive setup...

Time 4:56
Distance: 181.2 km
Avg speed: 37.4 km/h
Avg power: 192 watts

Height: 5'11
Weight: 131 lbs

Roth

SRM pro wired

Height: 5'7"
Weight: 165lbs (I obviously AM fat by reading peoples numbers)

As was said earlier in a flat course it's more watts/CdA than watts/Kg what really matters.

I did IMCoz this year: 5:09:31 bike split with 160ap/164np.

Race weigth around 66kg/145lb, Height 1.71m/5'7"

Bike: Cervelo P4 - Zipp Vuka (15cm/6"drop) - Zipp 808 PowerTap, RP Syton Open

My SWAG is I would needed less than 180watts to go under 5hs in those conditions.

---

Ale Martinez
www.amtriathlon.com

If I did IM I could go under 5 with less than 200 watts. Most likely I wouldn't run well after that since my FTP last summer was ~225.

I've got several HIM's under 2:30 with well under 200 watts.

At Halfmax I did 2:22 on 192 watts
At TTTNC the weekend afterwards I did 57 miles in 2:32 at 174 watts

jaretj

OK. I’ll bite (and get ridiculed). IM Florida – average power 173 watts, NP of 180. Time of 4:57. Would I post this if I honestly thought it was drafting? No. Will you doubt it? Yes. My time is a function of riding a draft legal race. I came out of the water in 1:11 and had a really slow T1. For the first 55 miles, I slingshotted past probably 500 bikers and got passed by only one cyclist. I was flying. I averaged over 23 MPH. Average power was 186 and NP was 190. For the second half I averaged 160 watts at a little under 23 MPH, but I rode in a group for about 20 miles (draft legal) and had a huge tail wind going into PCB so I could coast and easily keep good speed.

Coming out of the water later and having a slower T1 was a huge benefit since I could pass 30% of the field. Let’s face it, I could ride up to someone’s wheel, pass them, and get on the next wheel.

My equipment was a P4, Zipp 808 front, Hed Jet disk rear. Bonty R4 aeros front and back with Bonty latex tubes. Single bottle on the aero bars and single bottle hidden behind rear saddle. Specialized TT helmet. Tight fitting clothes. Cables hidden neatly.

FWIW. My last race rehearsal before IM FL I rode about 21 MPH on a similar wattage but without any aero gear, different powertap, by myself (ie no drafting), and a ton of water bottles on the bike. I’m 5’10 and raced at 164 pounds. Semi muscular build but relatively good position. I basically bought all the “free” speed I can. I rather have a higher power output and a slower ride, but know that I untapped potential.

Damn! I am the same height and 70 lbs heavier!!! Starting tomorrow I am going to lobby for wrestling to be added as the 4th event. I think I may be competitive.

---

________________
Adrian in Vancouver

aprox. 180.5km from T1 rack to T2 rack (the same)

measured by several people

alvaro
planetaTri.com

Please man....spare us from this. Last time you said you hit 800W accelerating from a stop sign, now you're going sub 5 hours on an IM split on account of being able to go sub 2:30 at a half Ironman. You realize that these two are completely different animals. Please come back and post your wattage from an IM sub 5 once you have done a sub 5 in an Ironman. Just because you can do sub 2:30 at a half does not mean you can do sub 5 at a full. I know a bunch of guys who have done 2:15's on legit courses in Half IM's who have not broken 5 hours at the full IM.

Next, let's discount all the folks going sub 5 at IM Florida, because a sub 5 there even with legal racing and slingshotting does not even qualify as sub 5 on a legit course from where we can use the sub 200W for 5 hour claim. Could most of these guys head out the door on a closed course with no one on it and do a sub 5 solo? I think not. Here is the best guage. A rider like Dirk Boeckel goes 4:37 in Florida (solo) after riding 4:30ish in a legal group in Kona . Meanwhile age groupers are doing 5 hour rides in Florida (let's say in legal groups), and are 50-70 min slower than Dirk in Kona (partly in legal groups, partly solo). Why did the spread suddenly go from 23 minutes to double or triple that?

Let's use something like Sesel in Austria. He backed up the Austria result with a 5:04 in Kona and also killed the bike course at Tristar Monaco....at least you know that this guy can turn the pedals on his own. A guy who is aero can also climb like Schleck (age group version) is the real deal.

Alex (MTL), 220W for you at Cozumel seems really high. I've seen your position and it really is not that bad and your bike gear is OK to....at least not enough to cost you 20-30W over other guys of your size doing a 5:03. Putting it into perspective, that's 220W for 2:31 half IM split. I don't know how windy it was, but off 220W, I would think you can do 2:20-2:25 in a half IM or 4:4x in a full IM. By the way, congrats on your race. Great job....so close to sub 10!

Just out of interest, do you have any bike splits and wattages from other races like Lanzarote, IMFrance, Roth/Austria/Switzerland. That's pretty low for such a fast time (faster than 40 kph). Is the course loop, or point to point (can make a huge diff). Just interesting in comparing the courses. For example Marcel Zamora was around 30 minutes faster overall at Barcelona than Kona (2007) and IM France, with most of it on the bike.

5h06 at LZ on 2010, exceptionally good conditions, no PT

4h48 at Austria 2008 with 200w, but with different position/equipment. on a very rainy day

Marcel Zamora is an exceptional cyclist on hilly courses, but he doesn't perform at the same level on flat courses. Challenge 2009 was his best bike leg ever on a flat course, but he has always underperformed in Kona (his swim is not good enough without a wetsuit and he misses the train)

alvaro
planetaTri.com

This thread is about going under 5 hours on under 200W. If you can go under 2:30 on less than 200W then you can go under 5 hours on the same wattage.

And why is 800W accelerating from a stop sign a big deal? I doubt I know any Cat 4 or above bike racer who can't do that.

---

Dimond Bikes Superfan

Well, the OP's original post just said "thoughts", so I guess it is open to what our thoughts are.

"This thread is about going under 5 hours on under 200W. If you can go under 2:30 on less than 200W then you can go under 5 hours on the same wattage. "

No arguement there....of course it means you have to PUT OUT THE SAME WATTAGE FOR DOUBLE THE LENGTH OF RIDE AFTER DOUBLE THE LENGTH OF SWIM WITH DOUBLE THE LENGTH OF RUN AFTERWARDS....but this is ST, so people can claim whatever they want.

Jaret is saying that he can do sub 5 hours in an IM on less than 200W. I'm saying that I doubt he can do sub 5 in an IM (I really don't care what his wattage is....it could be 150, it could be 250, he should come back after he actually does it). I'm cool with his half IM bike splits and wattages are, just don't claim you can do a 5 hour IM bike split on the internet until you can point us to an actual race result where it was achieved.....this is why I pointed out his 800W acceleration from a stop sign...he said he could do it, I asked to see the power file, he then said that he "thought" he could do it, but actually never did. This falls into the same category of internet hero claim. Maybe I need to call over Uli to play his role of ST bullshit police.

a few posts above that, MTL said he did 5:03 (for 180K) at Cozumel on 220W. MTL is a very strong cyclists and he has something like 10 IM's under his belt , is a strong age group swimmer, with a very decent position with good equipment and has never gone sub 5 (I'm thinking that MTL has a bit of miscalibration)....so to Jaret, come back when you've done it and post the actual split.

Agreed about Zamora.

Would you say that the Barcelona bike course is ~ 15 minutes quicker than Austria (if both were similar days)?