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Soooo confused about fast tires
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I know, I know, there are a lot of threads already about it. Overwhelmingly so!
My summary after hrs of looking at these threads(tongue in cheek): People sure love Corsa Speed, but they are too fragile. Crr is very important but hey, aero and durability more so! Everybody has an opinion and it is alllll over the board.
I'm coming back to racing after a hiatus of ~15 yrs- very reluctantly letting my Tufo 18mm tubulars go. Thin was in but now they are out bc they bounce. I don't think I had a single tire wider than 18mm. I'm trying to digest the basics. But I really would love to just buy my new race tires/wheels etc just once :)
So, since all my stuff is 'ancient', should I start over with tubeless tires? I will race time trials or triathlons of short distances (10-25 miles) over nice roads (I'd say 7-10/10 if 10 is smoothest).
Like anyone else I am just looking for the fastest best race outcome.
I hesitate to post this because it's such a crazy topic and people might be sick of it. But maybe if I get some advice for my specific situation, it's worth it.
Bought a new Speed Concept (formerly raced on titanium w/ clip on bars back in 90's-2003).
Thanks.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [ret123] [ In reply to ]
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Clincher wheels
Continental TT tires
Latex tubes

It’s a very fast setup and also reliable.

blog
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [ret123] [ In reply to ]
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The favorites are Specialized Turbo cotton, Vittoria Corsa Speed, or the Continental GP TT. Pick one and you’ll be good.

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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [BryanD] [ In reply to ]
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BryanD wrote:
The favorites are Specialized Turbo cotton, Vittoria Corsa Speed, or the Continental GP TT. Pick one and you’ll be good.

Turbo cotton are great, turbos are almost as good but more puncture resistant and wear slower.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [alexer03] [ In reply to ]
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alexer03 wrote:
BryanD wrote:
The favorites are Specialized Turbo cotton, Vittoria Corsa Speed, or the Continental GP TT. Pick one and you’ll be good.


Turbo cotton are great, turbos are almost as good but more puncture resistant and wear slower.

I second this....I run turbo cottons for my good wheel set and turbos for my 'training' wheel set. For the record I don't think you'll find a less expensive good option than the plain old turbos.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [ret123] [ In reply to ]
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ret123 wrote:
I know, I know, there are a lot of threads already about it. Overwhelmingly so!
My summary after hrs of looking at these threads(tongue in cheek): People sure love Corsa Speed, but they are too fragile. Crr is very important but hey, aero and durability more so! Everybody has an opinion and it is alllll over the board.
I'm coming back to racing after a hiatus of ~15 yrs- very reluctantly letting my Tufo 18mm tubulars go. Thin was in but now they are out bc they bounce. I don't think I had a single tire wider than 18mm. I'm trying to digest the basics. But I really would love to just buy my new race tires/wheels etc just once :)
So, since all my stuff is 'ancient', should I start over with tubeless tires? I will race time trials or triathlons of short distances (10-25 miles) over nice roads (I'd say 7-10/10 if 10 is smoothest).
Like anyone else I am just looking for the fastest best race outcome.
I hesitate to post this because it's such a crazy topic and people might be sick of it. But maybe if I get some advice for my specific situation, it's worth it.
Bought a new Speed Concept (formerly raced on titanium w/ clip on bars back in 90's-2003).
Thanks.

Tires depend upon a few things from what I see

IMO it’s a good idea to ask the wheel manufacturer you are going to use what is the best tire.

I was told GP 4000 s ll
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [ret123] [ In reply to ]
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If you are a DIYer then I wouldn't hesitate to recommend tubeless. Otherwise, stick with tubes. Corsa Speed haven't been fragile for myself but neither were Supersonics. Both are good tires along with the TT. Wheels have all sort of options, but seeing carbon rim-braking is going the way of the dodo you might as well stick with affordable aluminum clinchers like HED.


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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [Thomas Gerlach] [ In reply to ]
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Tires seem to be personal and with n=1, variance is so high. Supersonics (old) have been so good to me. I cut a 6mm gash in to a corsa speed there first time it touched a road.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [ret123] [ In reply to ]
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I would say that your best bet is to skip the tubeless route (it can be frustrating) and instead go with fast tires (GP TT etc) and latex tubes. Hed Jet+ wheels are a good choice in my opinion.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [GreenPlease] [ In reply to ]
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If you search this forum for latex stories, they sound way more frustrating than just running tubeless. Faster maybe, but installation is finicky.

***
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [M----n] [ In reply to ]
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All I can really provide is my own personal anecdotes. Personally, I’ve never had a problem with latex across a variety of wheels and tires. Tubeless? Not so much...
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [ret123] [ In reply to ]
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ret123 wrote:
I know, I know, there are a lot of threads already about it. Overwhelmingly so!
My summary after hrs of looking at these threads(tongue in cheek): People sure love Corsa Speed, but they are too fragile. Crr is very important but hey, aero and durability more so! Everybody has an opinion and it is alllll over the board.
I'm coming back to racing after a hiatus of ~15 yrs- very reluctantly letting my Tufo 18mm tubulars go. Thin was in but now they are out bc they bounce. I don't think I had a single tire wider than 18mm. I'm trying to digest the basics. But I really would love to just buy my new race tires/wheels etc just once :)
So, since all my stuff is 'ancient', should I start over with tubeless tires? I will race time trials or triathlons of short distances (10-25 miles) over nice roads (I'd say 7-10/10 if 10 is smoothest).
Like anyone else I am just looking for the fastest best race outcome.
I hesitate to post this because it's such a crazy topic and people might be sick of it. But maybe if I get some advice for my specific situation, it's worth it.
Bought a new Speed Concept (formerly raced on titanium w/ clip on bars back in 90's-2003).
Thanks.

I raced on Corsa Speeds this season, unfortunately 2 flats. Both on relatively good road surfaces. Fast tyres, but very fragile even with sealant. Worth using if you're just doing sprints/OD, but not longer stuff, unless roads are impeccable. Some guys have raced on these with no problems, but they got lucky! Vittoria say on their website these tyres have poor puncture protection. I've raced on a lot of different tyres the last few seasons, clinchers, tubs, Schwalbe, Vittoria, Conti and some are "faster" than others, but we're not talking a significant amount of time. Not a whole heap of variance in my bike splits. Going from a budget clincher to a top of the range tubs hasn't seen my km/hr jump up suddenly. So IMO, don't get too caught up in butyl vs latex, clincher vs tub, you'll go crazy. Yes latex are quicker, but you're not going to drop 2mins off your 70.3 time, I don't care what the data says! I went from clinchers to tubs last year and I went lala trying to find out what the best tyre was, what pressure, tape vs glue, diameter - gains are negligible. I love tubs, I'm sticking with them, will probs switch from Corsa Speeds to Conti Comp (butyl). Note with the Corsa Speeds their latex tubes lose air like a bitch. 5 psi over 3 hours.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [ret123] [ In reply to ]
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Everyone has different experiences. I've had some friends who swear by Conti GP 4K SII's for everything, but I flatted the heck out of them way too often over three years of going through multiple sets, and for me they are too easy to puncture to train on. I had one left which I use as a training tire on my spare front wheel on the TT bike, but nothing else anymore. I don't even use them to race on my road bike.

My current daily on the road bike (used for training and racing) is the Schwalbe Pro One Tubeless. Fantastic mix of race-ready performance, they last decently (half the life of a training tire, mind you), and the tubeless setup hasn't flatted more than three times total in two years---have had minor punctures which sealed with Orange Seal sealant fine.

My favorite durable training tire (not a lightweight tire, but not the heaviest) is the Michelin Pro 4 Endurance; they handle like a race tire, never seem to flat, don't lose air, and I've PR'd lots of things on both road and TT bike on these. Kind of baffling really, nobody ever talks about them, but I've had incredibly good experiences with them as a training tire.

I've just raced on the Vittoria Corsa tires twice with latex tubes, and got a puncture in warm-up prior to rolling up to the starting line in my last 40K TT...I'd suspected I was losing air, but had no time to do anything about it, finished with a nearly flat rear tire. Converting over to tubeless Corsa setup next and will see how it goes. I've read user reports that these are [very] delicate tires, lots of punctures and cuts. If they last well in tubeless form, I'll stick with them. If they don't, I'm going to switch to the Schwalbe Pro One tubeless or something else which is fast and tubeless, not sure what yet.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [ret123] [ In reply to ]
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TTer here. The Corsa Speeds cost me a podium yesterday. Sometimes you lose when you roll the dice. BUT, one of my clients has won two TT's this year including a State Championship with a combined winning time OF LESS THAN A Second. With a different tire he would have had two second places.

BoulderCyclingCoach.com
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [rockdude] [ In reply to ]
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rockdude wrote:
TTer here. The Corsa Speeds cost me a podium yesterday. Sometimes you lose when you roll the dice. BUT, one of my clients has won two TT's this year including a State Championship with a combined winning time OF LESS THAN A Second. With a different tire he would have had two second places.

Wht did they cost u a podium, you flatted?
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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zedzded wrote:
....I went from clinchers to tubs last year ....

I miss racing on tubulars, never flatted with those either. But I do love the simplicity and low cost of being able to throw on a new clincher tire anytime, quickly (no gluing time), always go on perfectly straight with no bumps, etc.

Now I feel safe using GP4000SII's with vittoria latex tubes. No flats in 4 years so far.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [ret123] [ In reply to ]
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I'm using the superfast vittoria corsa speed tlr, sure they're fast, and sure they're fragile.
I mount them tubeless with caffelatex (non ammonia). Don't go cheap or light on sealant. First time i pour about 40ml in it, first fit just need more sealant. It takes approximately 2 months to dry here in lyon. I add 15-20ml of sealant. If you're short on sealant because too much has dried it won't repair itself properly and you'll hate yourself.
Even with sealant i get puncture from time to time but it'll usually seal around 3-4 bars which is enough to not loose that much performance.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [stevej] [ In reply to ]
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stevej wrote:
Clincher wheels
Continental TT tires
Latex tubes

It’s a very fast setup and also reliable.

This is combo is probably the most “balanced” suggestion. Good Crr and CdA balance with decent durability.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [Super D] [ In reply to ]
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I'll add my N=1.

I race TTs with a Corsa Speed 23mm in the rear and a Conti SS 20mm in the front. The rear has 3 40K races and 13 other TTs ranging from 8-9 miles over the last two years. This includes riding to and from the 40K races through a gravel parking lot and riding to and from the midweek TTs through bike lanes that haven't been swept free of gravel after the winter. The front has 2 40K races and 11 of the shorter TTs on it. Both tires still look new.

Over the last three years, the one tire I've punctured on the most is the Schwable Pro One.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [geauxTT] [ In reply to ]
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geauxTT wrote:
I'll add my N=1.

I race TTs with a Corsa Speed 23mm in the rear and a Conti SS 20mm in the front. The rear has 3 40K races and 13 other TTs ranging from 8-9 miles over the last two years. This includes riding to and from the 40K races through a gravel parking lot and riding to and from the midweek TTs through bike lanes that haven't been swept free of gravel after the winter. The front has 2 40K races and 11 of the shorter TTs on it. Both tires still look new.

Over the last three years, the one tire I've punctured on the most is the Schwable Pro One.

It's interesting how there are so many different experiences with tires, isn't it. I flatted the heck out of my Conti GP 4K SII's, but have friends that absolutely love them and ride nothing else, and you've had incredible durability with your Conti's. The Schwalbe Pro One has been solid for me in the last two sets (I bought the first sets to hit the ground when they were first released and early sets punctured easily, but recent ones haven't...wonder if I've just been lucky, or if they changed the material mix after the first batch hit the market).

The Corsa you run on the rear, is it the one with the black center and gray sides? (That's the one I'm using on my TT bike currently.)
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [grumpier.mike] [ In reply to ]
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grumpier.mike wrote:
stevej wrote:
Clincher wheels
Continental TT tires
Latex tubes

It’s a very fast setup and also reliable.

This is combo is probably the most “balanced” suggestion. Good Crr and CdA balance with decent durability.

I’m doing IMLP in three weeks and just ordered two Conti TT tires to mount on my HED 9/disc wheels. I’ve gone with 4000S in the past, but having missed a KQ by 7 seconds, I’m looking for every advantage I can get.

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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [Super D] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
The Corsa you run on the rear, is it the one with the black center and gray sides? (That's the one I'm using on my TT bike currently.)

The same. I run it with a latex tube.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [grumpier.mike] [ In reply to ]
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grumpier.mike wrote:
stevej wrote:
Clincher wheels
Continental TT tires
Latex tubes

It’s a very fast setup and also reliable.


This is combo is probably the most “balanced” suggestion. Good Crr and CdA balance with decent durability.

X3. Switched from Conti gpsii this year to TTs. Have run latex tubes past 6 years and no problems. Ditto, a well balanced setup if you want to maximize your potential.
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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zedzded wrote:
rockdude wrote:
TTer here. The Corsa Speeds cost me a podium yesterday. Sometimes you lose when you roll the dice. BUT, one of my clients has won two TT's this year including a State Championship with a combined winning time OF LESS THAN A Second. With a different tire he would have had two second places.


Wht did they cost u a podium, you flatted?

Ya had a flat. A week before I also had a flat with one on the Track. A guys lapped my wheel and punctured my sidewill. They are fragle but fast.

BoulderCyclingCoach.com
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Re: Soooo confused about fast tires [rockdude] [ In reply to ]
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rockdude wrote:
Ya had a flat. A week before I also had a flat with one on the Track. A guys lapped my wheel and punctured my sidewill. They are fragle but fast.

I always wonder what these flats consist of, to gauge whether I might get one... ;). Punctures and sidewall cuts can usually be avoided in TTs by staying off the shoulder. IME sidewall cuts are much more common, and it's from sharp rocks that are numerous on the shoulders here.
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