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Home > Forum > Triathlon Forum > Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8?

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Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8?
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ElliotOP
Jun 28, 18 12:27
Post #1 of 11 (2844 views)
Hey guys,

I have a few dents in my Enve 6.7 tubular wheelset and was offered a crash replacement on the rims and an upgrade to the 7.8 clinchers (for about 50% off + price of the spokes).

The wheels are still rideable, but are getting old and are tubulars…

I am debating whether I should pull the trigger because :
  1. I have a Super 9 Zipp tubular that I’d have to sell to pay the difference in price. If I upgrade, I won’t be using the disc anymore anyways because I don’t want to double my flat kit (I already hate carrying that huge Xlab tubular pod).
  2. I heard crazy stories about being unable to mount tires on the 7.8, because of the tubeless rim
My question : Am I getting a slower setup going from A to B?

A) Enve 6 front + Super 9 (both tubulars with corsa G+ tubs / not the speed)
B) New set of 7.8 clinchers with latex and GrandprixTT tires

In other words, do you think the advantage of clinchers (aero and rolling resistance) + better wheelset (7.8 should be much faster than old 6.7) offsets the benefit of the disc (Zipp Super 9 tubular)?

If the setup is faster, please reassure me the 7.8s are not a nightmare to work with!!!

Thanks!
Elliot

*Post updated for clarity
Last edited by: ElliotOP: Jun 28, 18 12:35
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Re: Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8? [ElliotOP] [ In reply to ]
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DBF
Jun 28, 18 17:45
Post #2 of 11 (2755 views)
It is a very tough rim to get tires on and off. If you practice a little and do it the right way you wont have issues, but that rep is deserved.

I finished worlds last year, went to pick up my bike and had 60 psi in the front tire(tubeless s-works). There was a big line in my tire where I nailed a pothole, would have pinch flatted for sure. Tubeless is nice, best rr and extremely unlikley to get flats. I did not carry tubes in races.
Quote Reply
Re: Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8? [ElliotOP] [ In reply to ]
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pk1
Jun 28, 18 18:50
Post #3 of 11 (2718 views)
i run GPTTs on my 7.8s and don't have any particular issues mounting them - tight but not problematically so.
i do pre-stretch tyres before mounting with latex tubes though and have been fortunate enough to never puncture with this combo so only worked on them in the convenience of my garage.

i'm not sure which combo would be fastest, you'd have to find comparable test results which is likely to be challenging.
tyre change gains you ~2W each https://www.bicyclerollingresistance.com/...corsa-g-tubular-2016 but thats with butyl tubes so call it 4W per tyre with latex


there was an enve graph a while back that indicated the 7.8 is only 1 or 2 watts faster than the 6.7, i'd expect the disc to more than gain that back but it needs about 10W to get the system back to even.
googled because i'm bored and did find this comparing your rear options, not sure with that testing how the drag converts to watts but think it is probably a bit more than the 10W in which case you wouldn't be gaining any speed but would get new wheels with some convenience benefits and more or less retaining overall system speed
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Re: Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8? [ElliotOP] [ In reply to ]
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grumpier.mike
Jun 28, 18 20:12
Post #4 of 11 (2676 views)
The 7.8 front (7?) is possibly one of the fastest front wheels out there. Some of the UK TT crowd claim they are the super fast. The other tidbit of information is that Jim Manton once said there was a front wheel out there that was super fast with the TLR 25mm, but he didn't specify. I did see about a month later that Amber Neben, who has worked quite a bit with ERO, was riding a 7 front with a TLR at World's. My guess is that it is the ENVE wheel that works great with the lowest Crr tire out there.

My suggestion would be to grab the 7.8 pair. sell the tubular disc and buy a used Jet. Nearly a break-even deal and you have a Kona-ready rear wheel.
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Re: Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8? [ElliotOP] [ In reply to ]
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spntrxi
Jun 29, 18 8:47
Post #5 of 11 (2532 views)
I'd go for the 7.8s personally...

I have three sets of enve clinchers all with Turbo Cottons.. 2.2,4.5(not tubeless) and the 7.8. In terms of installing non tubeless tires (hard to semi-hard-easy) 2.2-7.8-4.5.

I will agree the 7.8s are fast. used them on a recent sprint tri and set a PR on the bike course. Previous was Zipp808/Super9 combo. Sure there are tons of factors but my watts where within 1% of old time and I was 30+s faster.
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Re: Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8? [pk1] [ In reply to ]
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ElliotOP
Jun 29, 18 14:32
Post #6 of 11 (2456 views)
Thanks for the feedback and analysis. I'm going for it.

Conclusion :
  • Probably not faster (hoping for close to a match)

But :
  • I get new wheels
  • I can stop carrying my huge tubular flat kit
  • I stop messing with glue and buying ridiculously expensive tubs

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Re: Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8? [DBF] [ In reply to ]
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ElliotOP
Jun 29, 18 14:39
Post #7 of 11 (2449 views)
Thanks for the feedback. I saw some videos and it seems like if you use thin tubeless tape and have the proper technique (both beads in center groove), it does not look too bad. Even saw some people mounting without levers.

Not planning on running them tubeless though. Setup and flat change looks too complicated and ultimately, it doesn't seem faster than latex tube and fast tires.
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Re: Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8? [grumpier.mike] [ In reply to ]
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ElliotOP
Jun 29, 18 14:42
Post #8 of 11 (2446 views)
Decision is made. I'll go with the 7.8. Thanks for the suggestion.
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Re: Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8? [spntrxi] [ In reply to ]
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ElliotOP
Jun 29, 18 14:46
Post #9 of 11 (2442 views)
Good to hear they are treating you well and that you did not lose any speed compared to your previous setup which is comparable to mine (minus the tubulars...).

I'm going for it! Can't wait to get the 7.8s
  • From your experience, what tires were the easiest to mount on the Enves?
  • Can you compare Continentals (GPTT, 4000SII) to the Spec Turbo Cotton?

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Re: Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8? [ElliotOP] [ In reply to ]
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TriSpencer
Jun 29, 18 14:48
Post #10 of 11 (2438 views)
ElliotOP wrote:
Good to hear they are treating you well and that you did not lose any speed compared to your previous setup which is comparable to mine (minus the tubulars...).

I'm going for it! Can't wait to get the 7.8s
  • From your experience, what tires were the easiest to mount on the Enves?
  • Can you compare Continentals (GPTT, 4000SII) to the Spec Turbo Cotton?

My 7.8's are tubeless, but in the past I have used Conti 4000SII's on my ENVE's and they have worked well.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Tough Times Don't Last, Tough People Do.
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Re: Should I upgrade to Enve's 7.8? [ElliotOP] [ In reply to ]
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spntrxi
Jun 29, 18 20:39
Post #11 of 11 (2344 views)
ElliotOP wrote:
Good to hear they are treating you well and that you did not lose any speed compared to your previous setup which is comparable to mine (minus the tubulars...).

I'm going for it! Can't wait to get the 7.8s
  • From your experience, what tires were the easiest to mount on the Enves?
  • Can you compare Continentals (GPTT, 4000SII) to the Spec Turbo Cotton?

I have not used GP4000II on 7.8 but based on using them on 4.5 and 2.2 they are no easier (or worse) to install then TurboCotton. I've tried Corsa Speed and Corsas and Schwalbe Pro One (tubeless) .. Schwalbe were the hardest to mount and unmount.

Turbo Cottons to me a faster, grip better in the wet and dry and last nearly as long. I actually square off GP4000s rear rather quickly for some reason. I'm no lightweight at 80kg+. Unless I get something for dirt cheap, I dont see switching from TC for clinchers anytime soon....the tire is good.
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