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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [TH3_FRB] [ In reply to ]
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This was my first Rev3 race but not my first half and I’ve done the Setup Events Patriot’s Half in the past which is in the same general area as well as the Patriot’s Sprint and Jamestown International. Here are some of my thoughts and comments on how the race went and ideas on how it could be improved in the future:

(1) Packet Pickup: I expected to see a great expo with a ton of vendors but there wasn't much there, also the packet pickup wasn't very well setup IMO. The race numbers could have been sent out to athletes ahead of time and/or should have been prominently displayed near the packet pickup location vice a small sign with arrows saying to look on the backside of the tent. This should have been set out front and center for people to see (it was a very nice printed sign with the numbers on it). Also the chip pick up was a little disjointed as well – with the signage it looked like it was a weigh in station for Clydesdales and Athenas but the large sign said chip pickup so it was a bit confusing (I’ve heard multiple people at the site make this comment as well) . Then the goody bag (empty other than a generic Rev3 visor and a Powerbar) was in the next tent over. A head’s up that we wouldn't be getting our shirts until the finish line would have been nice as well – many of us were standing around confused as to if there was yet another area where we could get our shirts. Better signage and arrows directing the flow of Packet Pickup traffic would have made it run smoother.

(2) Bike Check-in: I had no issues with the bike check in but one of my friends discovered on race morning that there was a huge gouge on the top tube of her bike cutting all the way through the paint that was not there previously. No cool if people were jacking around with peoples bikes overnight. The bike racks however were pretty cool – I’d never used those before but it solved the normal spacing issues encountered in transition with space hogs and no fighting over the space closest to the exit.

(3) T2 Setup & Bus to T1: This was my first time with two transition locations and I am not a fan. I got to T2 fairly early around 4:50 so really no issues finding parking, setting up T2, or getting to the site but sounds like there were some issues later when the mass majority of people showed up. I prefer one transition location and it can be done in Williamsburg.

(4) Swim: The swim course was a triangle not a rectangle as advertised on the Rev3 site. If they’d stuck with the original swim course and made a race morning call on the direction of the swim based on current (like they do at Patriot’s) then many of the issues with the current would have been solved (rainfall can have a significant effect on river flow). Also there are some jagged rocks in the water near the start – previous races at this location start swimmers in the water just past the rocks to prevent the mad frenzy of people running over these rocks – one of my friends cut up his foot pretty bad which severely impacted his run and resulted in a trip to the medical tent immediately after the finish. With all of that said, my swim was 1:30 faster than when I did Patriot’s Half, the swim is my worst leg so I’ve put a lot of time into improving my swim. No, I did not cut the course although I saw plenty of pink caps cutting the last red buoy and making the Olympic turn instead. Also the red buoy was very dark and difficult to see (to me it looked much smaller than the others as well) – perhaps using something brighter like a lime green or pink buoy would make it more prominent.

(5) T1: The decision to change the swim entrance/bike exit out of transition at the last moment created a whole host of problems – also I never heard the announcement that it was being changed, luckily my husband did so he told me about it. The narrow driveway that we had to run over to get to transition needs to have carpet down as there were ton of small gravel fragments – one of which got imbedded in my foot and I had to dig out with some tweezers when I got home. From what my husband has told me the traffic was a nightmare with people trying to get to the ferry to head to work and bikes leaving transition. It’s hard to tell from the race map what the original plan was but taking the narrow road leading from T1 though the fields directly to Greensprings Road would eliminate issues with vehicle versus bike traffic for the ferry on Jamestown Road.

(6) Bike: I wasn’t a huge fan of the course with all of the turn arounds and one mile of really rough road with a ton of potholes, however we were well warned about the rough road so I knew to slow down. I did see a lot of blatant drafting from the age groupers – in fact I had one guy pass me and then hop directly on the wheel of the bike in front of me, I’m talking less than one bike length behind the bike and he even turned around to look at me twice to see if I was going to say anything. I didn’t catch his number but he was 36 years old in the half wearing a Rev3 kit.

(7) T2: T2 didn’t go well for me but had nothing to do with the race – I dropped and busted my liquid shot flask halfway through T2 so I had to run back and grab my spare one from the bike

(8) Run: The run course changed within a week or two of the race as well from a 3-loop circular course to an out and back course twice with hills on both ends. I saw a lot of traffic issues and some close calls by cars trying to jet between runners. For the most part the water stops went well but where too close together. I think it would have been better to have a water stop in both ends and one in the middle instead of all being about a mile apart in the middle. I would have been better to have two people on the sponges because twice I wanted a sponge but the one guy manning the tub was handing them out to the racers heading the other direction. Once I had to grab my own water because they didn’t have any ready to hand me – not sure what the deal was there but that only happened once. Also it’s helpful to have Gatorade and water in separate cups (green Gatorade cups and white cups) to make it clearer to athletes what they are grabbing instead of asking every time.

(9) Post-Race: I know that Rev3 is advertised as a family friendly race it sucks when a family with multiple small children crossing the finish line in front of you blocks the finish line so you have to slow down and they huddle directly in front of the photographer so I don’t even get a finisher’s photo. It wouldn’t be a bad idea to have two finisher shutes directly next to each other – one for people finishing with their families and one for those sans family that are pushing for a PR – I told my husband he could finish with me if he could keep up because I’m not slowing down :-). The large Gatorade towels soaked in ice water were great at the end.

(10) Swag: I was very very very disappointed in the swag which seems to be one of the huge selling points for Rev3. We got a generic Rev3 visor vice a race specific one – however if you wanted a race specific visor it was available for purchase in the Rev3 store (it was brown – ugh so not very appealing but still at least it’s race specific). Finally the race t-shirt the one thing that you get to wear around town or when working out to discreetly brag about your triathlon experience and it’s a black, long sleeve, cotton t-shirt… I guess that goes in my drawer of running shirts from the 90’s and early 2000’s that I wear for working in the yard, around the house, or layers when going sledding in Ohio. The local running races in Hampton Road have better swag. The medals were cool and about the size of my face.

(11) Timing: There are still issues with the times posted online – it has my T2 listed as 25:43 and my run listed as a 10min half-marathon PR which I know is not correct based on my Garmin data.

(12) Staff & Volunteers: I thought that the announcer was a bit annoying and seemed to talk for the sake of talking. He also said some inappropriate stuff that would not have put Rev3 in a good light if something bad happened on the swim course. He said something to the effect that he thought losing one person on the swim course is an acceptable loss but that the safety people disagree – considering the issues and press lately with people dying on the swim portion of triathlons it was said in poor taste and would have been very bad in the media if someone were to get badly injured or die on the course. I would have preferred more music and less of his talking unless it’s for important race updates such as transition entrance/exit location changes and delays. The Rev3 Staff and volunteers were very positive and enthusiastic.

If Rev3 plans to continue putting on this race in the future, I’d recommend sending a few reps to participate in the Setup Events Patriot’s race in September to see how they eliminate many of the course issues that were encountered at Rev3 Williamsburg. I’m undecided if I’ll do it again next year but I’m sure that Rev3 will be making lots of changes based on the feedback received on race day as well as constructive criticism and feedback posted here on ST.

"Triathlon doesn't create character - it reveals it."
Last edited by: f_ahsile: Jun 24, 13 18:18
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [Tri-Banter] [ In reply to ]
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Tri-Banter wrote:
No offense, but between this thread and the Top Pro Cheating thread, I'm having a difficult time believing that you enjoyed the event. It seems to me that this post is better written up as an email and sent to the RD.

Was there a resolution to the Top Pro thread? It seems to have disappeared.
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [The Guardian] [ In reply to ]
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Probably pulled, but the summary seems to be that there was an opinion that a pro was drafting. An official passed by at one point when this drafting was supposedly taking place but didn't award a penalty; therefore, she was doing nothing wrong (at least at that point in the race) or she got away with it. It happens. Move on...
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [TH3_FRB] [ In reply to ]
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This was also my first Rev 3 event and I will jump on with a few opinions as well. I arrived Saturday around 1 and flew through check in, Everything was easy to find and the people working were well informed. I was surprised how little swag there was, a power bar and visor. I know we do these races for the course, but I thought rev3 was all about cool swag. I also did not stay for the whole athlete meeting, as it was in almost direct sunlight and I figured I would save getting a sunburn for Sunday. Fast forward to race day. I stayed with family in White Stone, about 1.25 hours away. I left at 3:00am and was at T2 by the time it opened, in the pouring rain. I set it up and got on the second shuttle. This was my second 2 transition race and probably my last. It was run a million times better than Poconos inaugural, but the stress of setting up t2 then leaving with everything you need for T1 added stress to race morning. Bike mechanics were plentiful and pumps were floating around. I don't think I had any wasted time and made it to the swim start with time to warm up. the swim was a surprise as the wind was blowing the top of the water with the course direction, but then we watched as the pros drifted and my thought was, "oh sh!t, looks like we will be against current." The run to transition was a little long, seen longer though, so no biggie really.

The bike was ok. Nothing spectacular in terms of scenery and like others said, would've like to have passed some history on the course. There were a good amount of turns, but volunteers and markings made it so you always knew where you were going. Road surfaces were decent, no potholes aside from a short section that was well marked to allow you to avoid them. The rest of the course was typical road surface, not freshly paved and super smooth, but good enough. Aid stations were where you would want them and staffed very well, never had an issue getting what I wanted.

The run, aka the beginning of the end. I, like many others, did not have the dream run I rehearsed in my head during training, so my poor showing may have skewed how I felt about the course. It did go through a variety of parking lots and the aid stations were spaced out oddly to say the least. I had no issues with them running out of ice, sponges, Gatorade, cola, or water. Again can't say enough about how well organized the stations themselves were staffed and how supportive the people working them were.

Overall, I probably would not do this race again, but am definitely not ruling out rev3 in the future. 2 transition races are not going to be a part of my future. I question the elevations posted for the bike course, but even more so the run course so I look forward to someone's postings of their garmin data. Waiting for our morning bags after the race ended was frustrating, but I heard a group of 30 volunteers got stuck in traffic, so they did the best they could. The biggest disappointment to me is how my splits are completely jacked up, no swim time a 30 minute t2, and live tracking that made it nearly impossible to follow from home. I know it is not looked upon highly by some, but seeing my 2 daughters face as they crossed the line, made the sufferfesst of a run almost worth it.

Also, great job by the race announcer keeping racers posted and entertained in the AM and race conclusion.

Sorry for errors, I hate typing on an ipad
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [The Guardian] [ In reply to ]
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Thread got censored. Let's please keep this discussion on topic. I don't want to drag that over here.

The Guardian wrote:
Was there a resolution to the Top Pro thread? It seems to have disappeared.
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [TH3_FRB] [ In reply to ]
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I didn't do this race but have done Rev3 events in the past. It must have been the 1st year woes as all the Rev3 events I have done have been well organized and enjoyble races. I bet next year will be much improved! But I do agree that the long sleeve cotton T's should be replaced with a wicking material of some sort.
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [f_ahsile] [ In reply to ]
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Some good points here. A note of the T1 change of in/out - As I understand it, this was done because cars had parked up what was planned to be the route leaving T1. They could have avoided that by better roping off that area to parking on race morning. Personally, I was happy about the change because that little "road" we were supposed to take is in pretty bad shape and I much prefer getting immediately on the main road - that's how SetUp does patriots in Sept. I'm assuming the original plan was specifically to avoid causing issues with the ferry traffic.

f_ahsile wrote:
Packet pick-up:The race numbers could have been sent out to athletes ahead of time and/or should have been prominently displayed near the packet pickup location vice a small sign with arrows saying to look on the backside of the tent.

T1: The decision to change the swim entrance/bike exit out of transition at the last moment created a whole host of problems – also I never heard the announcement that it was being changed, luckily my husband did so he told me about it. The narrow driveway that we had to run over to get to transition needs to have carpet down as there were ton of small gravel fragments – one of which got imbedded in my foot and I had to dig out with some tweezers when I got home. From what my husband has told me the traffic was a nightmare with people trying to get to the ferry to head to work and bikes leaving transition. It’s hard to tell from the race map what the original plan was but taking the narrow road leading from T1 though the fields directly to Greensprings Road would eliminate issues with vehicle versus bike traffic for the ferry on Jamestown Road.

(8) Run: For the most part the water stops went well but where too close together. Also it’s helpful to have Gatorade and water in separate cups (green Gatorade cups and white cups) to make it clearer to athletes what they are grabbing instead of asking every time.

(9) Post-Race: The large Gatorade towels soaked in ice water were great at the end.

(10) Swag: I was very very very disappointed in the swag which seems to be one of the huge selling points for Rev3. We got a generic Rev3 visor vice a race specific one – however if you wanted a race specific visor it was available for purchase in the Rev3 store (it was brown – ugh so not very appealing but still at least it’s race specific). Finally the race t-shirt the one thing that you get to wear around town or when working out to discreetly brag about your triathlon experience and it’s a black, long sleeve, cotton t-shirt.

(12) The Rev3 Staff and volunteers were very positive and enthusiastic.
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [number114] [ In reply to ]
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number114 wrote:
......... but I thought rev3 was all about cool swag.

No, Rev3 is all about your kids being able to cross the finish line with you..........

Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [kcb203] [ In reply to ]
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kcb203 wrote:
Billabong wrote:
Great Race. Patriots Half in Septembers starts up the beach just beyond where we finished and ends where we started. I probably swam 1.5 miles or farther but since it affected everyone not a race killer. Since we have all read the Gorilla story there was a guy in the 25-29 age group whose buddy paced him the whole race except for the both times through the start finish line. I will definitely do this race again and other Rev3 races.


I was really annoyed by that pacer. Did we see the same guy? The racer was very pale, but the guy pacing him was ripped and wearing a skin tight short-sleeved short. I walked through the aid stations and ducked into a portajohn, and I think I had to pass them 4 times. Grrr.

The other pacer I saw was wearing a "Positive Mental Attitude" T-shirt, but he didn't seem to be helping anyone in particular--just cheering and running with whoever was going by as far as I could tell.

Thats the guy, kept thinking and wishing a Gorilla would pop up

All I Wanted Was A Pepsi, Just One Pepsi

Team Zoot, Team Zoot Mid-Atlantic

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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [japarker24] [ In reply to ]
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One of my athletes crossed the finish with her golden retriever yesterday.

japarker24 wrote:
number114 wrote:
......... but I thought rev3 was all about cool swag.


No, Rev3 is all about your kids being able to cross the finish line with you..........
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [TH3_FRB] [ In reply to ]
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TH3_FRB wrote:
One of my athletes crossed the finish with her golden retriever yesterday.

japarker24 wrote:
number114 wrote:
......... but I thought rev3 was all about cool swag.


No, Rev3 is all about your kids being able to cross the finish line with you..........

I'm all warm and fuzzy inside now............

Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [TH3_FRB] [ In reply to ]
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This was my first Rev3 race, and while there were some things that were done really well, there were several aspects that were disappointing and left me with the overall impression that Rev3 triathlons focus more on the appearance of glitz rather than the substance of the race.

The Good: the TA2/finish line/packet pick-up area is all together, which gives it a big event feel. The stage and big screen tv with constant video loop also add and create an energetic, great vibe when you go to packet pick-up. There was a green screen for fun photos, which was a nice touch. The finish line was really nice and again having it next to the TA kept all of the spectators clustered in one area, which also provided a lot of cheering and energy when you were on the run course and finishing the bike. The volunteers and few staff I talked to were very friendly and helpful. I liked the run course. As others said having the aid stations a little more spread out would have been nice, but not a big deal.

The Not so Good: The "goody bag" wasn't really full of goodies. There was a generic Rev3 visor and a few postcard ads. I much prefer getting my race t-shirt at packet pick-up not at the finish. There were not enough shuttles. The RDs know how many athletes (and can guess how many spectators) they have to transport to T1 in the short time span in the morning. It's not hard to figure out the math and plan accordingly. Swim course should have been better planned taking into account the tidal currents. The bike course caused an enormous amount of traffic backlog. I will be surprised if there isn't some push back from the community over the amount of traffic. The wait for the olympic distance athlete T1 bags was entirely too long. Many people who don't place in the top 3 don't stay for the awards. They shouldn't have to wait 3 extra hours just to get their stuff. The splits and results posted on the web still aren't correct.

Price vs Value-Rev3 prices are nearly 50% higher than other triathlons in Virginia. For that amount of money I was expecting more. Overall, I felt my extra money went to paying for the big RVs, stage, screen, pro prize money, and finish line rather than improving my experience (swag, more shuttles, better food, better logistics and planning). I likely won't do a Rev3 race again, particularly in Virginia where there are many other quality races with better value for my racing dollar. In particular, the Patriots and Jamestown races are in Williamsburg and have been going on for several years without the swim and traffic issues that occurred at the Rev3 race.
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [ShyRunner] [ In reply to ]
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FWIW - I've heard lots of good things from other people who've done Rev3 races in the past. It seems like most of the issues associated with the quality of the experience - no food/beverage options for spectators, post-race food food, "expo", swag - are uncharacteristic of their typical offering. Unfortunately, I had high expectations as a result of hearing about these events so it was a little more disappointing when they fell short.
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [TH3_FRB] [ In reply to ]
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I was there this weekend. I am a coach for Team Z and I had a significant number of athletes race both events.

I noticed the lines for the busses, and I obviously noticed the issue with the swim. I am aware that there were some traffic issues in town (which did not affect the race, but certainly likely affected the community).

All in all, I felt that this was a very fun event and I received tons of great feedback from our team about the race, the Rev 3 staff, and the weekend as a whole. Even though lots of things went right - and many if not most of you had a terrific experience this weekend...obviously some people feel otherwise and that's ok too.

This thread has been bothering me since it sprung up. I'm not "bothered" because of the heated emotion shared by some of the dissatisfied participants postings. I know that things did not go exactly as planned on Sunday for some of you, or for the race production staff. I know that this has some of you not as happy as you could be, or deserve to be. And you have the right to share your frustration. I can understand and support those feelings. But...

I think that the reason the negative thread bothers me is b/c I have had a unique and privileged opportunity to get to know this race production company (and others) on a personal level. Call me biased, or a friend of Rev 3....go ahead that's fine. Because I am!

I have watched Rev 3 grow from zero to where they are today in just a few short years. I know that their success is due to their goal of being customer focused, and delivering the best possible product for you and your family. I know they mean this b/c I've seen it personally. I've had very direct conversations with almost all of their staff about their customers, and what they mean to them. I've seen them constantly re-affirm the mission and vision in staff meetings before, during, and after race event weekends. They sincerely want to do an excellent job. They want you to smile, and be successful. They do not want to make mistakes. And when they do make a mistake - they take it personally.

We could not participate in this sport without the hard work of so few individuals to put on the races we enjoy. Yes, I am speaking on their behalf. And, for that matter, on behalf of most race production companies. If nothing else - maybe it will just make me feel better by standing up for people that I consider to be our friends. But I hope that it helps each of you to continue to hold our race production companies in a positive light. You are their customers. We are their clients. We are all partners in this "business" and we all want to be successful. Our experience is exactly what matters to them.

Most athletes do not get the chance to interact with race production staff/companies on a personal level. Most athletes don't get the chance to see how a race production staff feeds off of an athlete's energy, both positive and negative. You don't get to see how they celebrate when they've "won". You don't see how much it affects them when they fail to deliver what they intend, when they feel they've not lived up to their own standards. It can be easy for us to be frustrated by their mistakes, or bad luck, especially with a “bandwagon” like this to jump on. But for whatever reason it seems harder for people to notice race directors’ successes, their hard work, and their good intentions. Even on the best days folks like Rev 3 get many more “constructive” criticisms than thank you’s. When people have trained so hard for their big day and something doesn’t go right it’s easy for them to lose their objectivity. What's not so easy is for the Rev 3 staff to stand in front of each of you and let you issue your complaints....and then apologize to each of you, personally, for making a mistake. Which they would do, if they just had the chance. Charlie's post is evidence of that.

Race Production companies are so personally invested in your experiences that it does not matter if "most things go well". Everything has to go perfectly or their sense of accomplishment is taken away from them. Right, wrong, or otherwise. It's hard to see so many people work so hard, for so long - and "almost get it right". And instead of "great race, can't wait until you dial it in next year"... they get blasted.. You don't need to tell them that they needed more busses, or that the transition bags took to long to get back from T1 to T2. They know.

I mean. I wish you could all see it in their eyes. Even the pride they have in the smallest detail, like the medal. One thing you know, they'll come back stronger next year. They want to get it right, and they will. Keep the faith.

Personally - I felt this was a fantastic weekend. And I encourage all of you to volunteer for a weekend with a race production company. The entire weekend. It may change your perspective on things a little bit. I mean - I can remember the days when our sport didn’t have post race food. I remember when I was handed a brown paper bag with an apple and smashed up PB&J sandwich and thought "SCORE!".

Rock on Rev 3 - and all race production companies. Thank you for busting your ass so we can have fun.
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [japarker24] [ In reply to ]
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I also did the half yesterday ... and LOVED it. I dont know if I had different expectations that some .. but i though the race was very well run. The key i keep seeing here is that you had an easier time moving through the wickets if you timed it well.

Left the Philly area with friends friday afternoon (supposed to leave at 2pm but I was a little delayed. Luckily they didnt drive off without me!) We had a relatively easy time through Philly, Baltimore and into the DC area. From there all traffic hell broke loose. Wound up being in the car for a little over 8 hours. Good thing we had music and easy conversation to keep us company. We stayed at the Governers Inn. Were originally worried that we would be too far away. It turned out to be a GREAT location!. The rooms were large enough for three people and all our gear. We were walking distance to the historical part of town, great restuarants and (marginally) expo/transition.

The day before: We got in on Saturday morning and decided to scope out the place first. Got checked in (quickly!) and loved the printed banner of bib names. I could see that it would be tough if there were tons of people. It mgiht have been good to mount somewhere close to the entrance though so people didnt have to get all the way up to the tent to see the sign to go around back and find their numbers. Packet pick-up was aweome ... friendly folks checked me in. Headed into the photo area to complete checkin and key up timing strap. Again ... awesome folks helped move us through. I agree the bag was "lite" but i get lots of crap i usually wind up throwing out. I'm not one for free peanut butter, new types of shave products, or chamois lube. I actually appreciated the sparseness of my bag. We spent a little (a lot) of money in the expo tent and went to go check out our T2 locations. With the lay of the land at hand, we went back and grabbed our stuff to head over to T1. We left as the briefing was winding down, wanting to beat the rush. Turned out to be a great decision. T1 setup went pretty flawlessly. we checked out the swim entry/exit and logistics. Love the bike boxes btw ... best racking ever. Really controlled clutter and happy to have a defined "me" space. Name tags were an awesome touch (my T2 is hanging up in my cube). Headed back around 3 and just enjoyed the night in town. Really awesome place to walk around. Kudos on having picked a location that adults can go and be relaxed heading into a huge race. Totally enjoyed the Williamsburg hospitality.

The day of: Alarm set, bags pre-packed double checked and ready for T2 drop-off. T1 bags packed and ready for the morning. Open door - DELUGE. Wait 10 minutes and head out. We were down on site probably around 4:45. Since we had a mix of oly/half folks we wanted to be in the lot that we could leave before 3. It was darkish - but enough light for setup (this is where having prepacked bags and a scopped out spot REALLY helps). Dropped things off and were ready for the bus in around 5-10 minutes. I think we were on the first or second bus out. The bus driver filled the seats ... we each had our own one and off we went. There were a few wicked (and unsuspected bumps!) and we were there. Set up and prayed for the rain to hold off ... but the clouds to stay! Bike techs were great ... the line up at the tent moved. I had a quick once over and tires pumped.There were plenty of porta-poties.

Wet suit legal temp announced so i hit the sunscreen, body glide and got ready. Went down and listened to the announcement that the transition was changing. It was well announced ... preceeded by a "if you are having a conversation - STOP". The delay with the start was a bit tough ... but also well communicated. During this time i decided that the temp was just too hot. The water stop people let me stash my wetsuit up at the water table (THANKS!!). I made it down in time to still see the pros start. My swim was horrible - but I dont have alot of open water experience where the tide/waves/etc play a large role. I'm thinking of it as a learning experience. I would have liked to see some more folks in on kayaks etc, but when i passed one ... they were very encouraging. One person gave me a heads up on the difficulty along the outside edge and atleast i knew what to expect. Got out (eventually) and soldiered right into T1.

Onto the bike. After drinking more of the James River than expecting ... THANK YOU for having porta-poties at the aid stations. I also would have liked a bit more history on the ride - but i thought it was a nice course. Again echo the above comments about the road conditions - but we were well warned that there was a rough portion of road. I had trouble on the hill at 40/1 but was able to continue after the support of several passers by who stopped to ask if i was ok and the bike support guys. I guess i was so far back, i didnt see much drafting at all. There were some places i needed to wait for a car to pass before i could pass the rider in front of me .. so that was a little frustrating - but overall no issues with cars on the course.

Run (or my attempt at running under prolonged sun exposure). That sun thing came out and I just cooked on the run. Just cooked. I cant say enough about the water stop folks on this course. Yeah the locations were weird. But the staffers were AWESOME. So encouraging. The ice and sponges were a huge help. Props on the flatted cokes filled to the right amount in the cups. I would have liked more visible port-a-poties on this part of the course. I found one set on my 4th time through the loop. Good thing i didnt need them on the run! Got caught in a bit of traffic around the shakespeare festival. The hills were hard - but reaching the top was fun. Running past the finish was SO hard, but i was cheered all the way in when it was my turn. I bolted through the finish line -- so much fun! Hit the med tent for ice and extra cooling support and a quick wash and bandage of my road rash.

The after - took a while for me to cool down. Got everythign packed up and headed back for some post race food. I cheered people coming in ... it was nice that the race didnt empty out super quick. I hate when i come in late and everyone is gone! Medals are awesome -- it would be nice if the oly and half had different ribbons though (I'm super proud to have completed after such a tough start) I really like the long sleeve t. I have enough race shirts and dont like to only ever wear wicking. I'll be wearing my finishers shirt proudly come the fall! Also, I like the run visor ... i wish it was race specific ... but i'm pretty stoked for people to ask which race I did.

The Police/Fire/EMT support was amazing. I thanked each one as i went by on the run. If you think we were hot .. they were out there in uniform dealing with racers, traffic and I'm sure a few angry locals. On the big curved hill, i chatted with a fireman who asked if i was ok, if i was on my last loop and encouraged me on. A few of the Policemen i said thank you to ... thanked me for being out there. The support of the neighborhoods was a little lower than expected - but there was still plenty of support out there.

Please do it again :) Please!
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [ezerkle001] [ In reply to ]
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Compliments to your team. They all seemed to really be enjoying their experience and were really supportive of each other. Great job creating that culture, keep it up.
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [lovebug] [ In reply to ]
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lovebug wrote:
Went down and listened to the announcement that the transition was changing. It was well announced ... preceeded by a "if you are having a conversation - STOP". The delay with the start was a bit tough ... but also well communicated.

I went straight from setting up my T1 area down to warm up for the swim and never heard the announcement about the transition changing - I'm sure I was warming up in the water and that's why I didn't hear it - my husband who was standing right by the start did hear it and let me know. However they should have made another announcement just before the race when everyone was at the start line so that the half of the athletes that were warming up during the announcement and missed it could hear it. Also we just assumed the race was delayed when it didn't start on time but they did do a good job of communicating the new timeline after they started the pros - the compressed time frame afterwards did cause some issues with swim pileups.

To some of the previous posts, I don't think that anyone is knocking Rev3 as a company but for many of us that have heard such great things about Rev3, it fell short of our expectations, many of those can be attributed to it being the first year here in Williamsburg but others such as the swag, water stop locations, food, etc. shouldn't be anything new. A lot of people see constructive criticism as negative but just to make it clear constructive criticism is "criticism or advice that is useful and intended to help or improve something, often with an offer of possible solutions." We all know that the Rev3 staff worked very hard and there have been a lot of positive things said about their enthusiasm and support during the race, however things can always be improved. If you had a great race and saw no room for improvement then good for you but I and many others see potential to make it an even greater race.

"Triathlon doesn't create character - it reveals it."
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [f_ahsile] [ In reply to ]
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Just recieved a E-Mail from Ashley at REV 3 regarding split times this is her reply:

Hey Ken,
I apologize about the delay in getting back to you (I e-mailed REV 3 this am at 7:04). We had a slight glitch in our timing software that made some T1 times longer than they were. It is a very simple fix and we will be updating all times this week.

This was my third REV 3. Yes there were issues, but I am encouraged that Charlie and Ashley are prompt with there understanding and I would venture to guess that next year ( I will be there again), the event will iron out some of those issues.
Last edited by: Vanwolfenstein: Jun 24, 13 11:10
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [TH3_FRB] [ In reply to ]
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First off, thanks to TH3_FRB for starting off the post in the right way – recognizing that while all of us love going to races, almost none of us wants to or does run them, and thus have very little idea or perspective on the various challenges attendant to keeping hundreds of type-A personalities satisfied for a large block of time. I also think that it’s very easy to gripe, but it’s more important to give credit where credit is due and also to offer ideas for fixing problems. I was in this race with my wife yesterday. There are some real problems with the race that need substantial attention, but I think there is a lot of potential here.

My wife has only been doing triathlons for a year, and this was her second. She chose it because it was close to where we live, and she heard that Rev3 events were well run and not as intense a WTC events. Since she supports me in all of my crazy endeavors, it really was the least I could to do agree to ride behind here (4 lengths, of course) and then run with her and help her finish her first 70.3 race. My perspective on how the race went was largely colored by doing the Raleigh Half earlier this month, which was also a PTP and an inaugural event. With that in mind, here’s my take:

1) This is a small point, but I emailed Rev3 before the event about the athlete guide. Yes, it is very colorful and chock full of information (and ads), but it is impossible to print out in a useful way – i.e., so the embedded maps for parking and the course show up as part of the print-out. Rev3 needs to offer a link to a .pdf version that we can print out so that we can look over the course maps and parking maps from the athlete guide in hard copy before the race and while we are there looking for parking, etc. (I do appreciate that there were lots of free printed maps at the expo and that there were course changes, but I would rather have received multiple emails with updated maps, rather than not being able to print anything out).
2) There’s been a lot of commentary on the expo. I will say this. It was by far the easiest and quickest to navigate of any I’ve been to. I loved that I could find parking five minutes away and pick everything up without huge lines and confusion. I also have no use for goodie bags. Sure, the WTC gives out nice drawstring bags that I use, but usually they are just full of sample products I’m very unlikely to use (how many kinds of lip balm can our economy really support?) and circulars for local businesses that I rarely would have anytime to patronize. I appreciated the low-key Rev3 approach (visor, sport nutrition sample, plastic bag, done).
3) Race morning was something of a disaster, in my view. We arrived at the parking lot at around 5:25, which given the information in the packet, should have been plenty of time. It was only six miles to T1. Dump stuff in the T2 bins and get on the bus, easy enough? Except that there were major miscalculations here. I imagine that there were some number of buses that were accumulated and left prior to my arrival, but when we went to line up for the shuttle, there were easily 200 people in front of us and by the time we left there were easily 300 people behind us. Having just had the experience in Raleigh where everything went very smoothly and T1 was 40 mines away, I think the following were the culprits here:
a. Buses need to be leaving from a separate area that does not require that they cross incoming traffic. While I appreciated how easy it was to park right next to transition, that convenience was apparently at the price of holding up the oncoming buses that were to take athletes to transition. There needs to be a better thought-out flow to traffic.
b. More buses. There just weren’t enough for all the people, which leads me to….
c. Early buses should be reserved for athletes. I’m thrilled that people have families and friends that will get up early and watch people swim. I think it is great for the sport. But if they are going to allow spectators on the buses, there needs to be a whole lot more buses. As it was, I think they should have told spectators to wait for athletes to go, as we still had a number of things to do in transition.
d. The announcements in T2 were not the same as what was being broadcast at the start. As a result, it was hard to know what was happening. Because of the bus situation, it would have been nice to be better informed, as I wasn’t dropped off until 18 minutes before my heat was supposed to start. (As it was, they moved everything back a bit).
e. They need more organizing on the start. There was too much confusion given how confusing it already was because of the late start.
4) The swim course. I’ve swum competitively since I was five. I played four years of collegiate water polo. I’ve done 5 mile open water swims. Nonetheless, I found this course rather hard to sight (the red turn buoys sat quite far down in the water), and the water was fairly choppy. Nothing I couldn’t handle, but I don’t think I’m a good reference point. For instance, my wife is a very competent pool swimmer, but is still learning to be a stronger open water swimmer. This course was just about all she could handle. It was also apparent to her, that because of the swim buoy marking and the need to pull many swimmers out of the water, it was basically a free-for-all out there. She saw large numbers of people doing the half cutting the red buoy in favor of the orange buoy, either because they couldn’t see the red buoy or there simply was enough watercraft support to police the race and help distressed swimmers out. This race needs to be done so at least one leg is WITH the current. As it was, two legs were against a strong cross current and the long leg was completely against the current.
5) The bike. I thought the bike course had some very nice scenery. I was hoping that more of the roads would be closed, as there were times when there was traffic on narrower roads with smaller shoulders. It also seemed that there hadn’t been a lot of publicity about the race, or that most of the citizens of Williamsburg simply don’t want a triathlon. This is the first race I’ve been to where people in automobiles coming from the other direction flipped me off, yelled obscenities and cat-called women that I was riding near. In Raleigh, whole neighborhoods turned out to watch the race and were cheering, even though the roads were closed and obviously created some headaches. I don’t think I saw a single spectator on this course. It’s not so much that I want or need crowd support on the bike, but I do think it reflects a certain apathy from Williamsburg about hosting the race. (Or in case of the nice gentleman in the white sedan smoking who drove by, that either “he’s number one,” or that he thinks I can take my tri-bike and shove it right up my ….).
6) The run. I thought the run volunteers were great – positive, and helpful, and the stations were all very well stocked. I didn’t mind the course at all, but my wife pointed out that we ran through a fair number of parking lots, which isn’t all too interesting, and given the heat there were two longer stretches with no water or ice. I think this is because it runs along the bridge and up into a neighborhood and so it wasn’t possible to put a water area anywhere. It was also one of the more shaded parts of the run.
7) The shirt. I know it’s not popular among some, but we loved the long-sleeve non-technical t-shirts. We ended up putting them on in the car on the way home as it was dry clothing and we started getting those chills one gets after being out in the sun for prolonged periods. I also think that the race t-shirt pendulum has swung too far. It used to be that everyone gave out cotton t-shirts. Then people realized that people had too many cotton t-shirts and everyone needs/wants technical t-shirts for training. But now nobody gives out cotton shirts and many races put so much ink on the shirts when they print the shirts that they lose a good bit of the wicking and aeration function that make tech t-shirts important. So I, for one, am glad to have a nice cotton, long sleeve shirt. I recognize I might be in a decided minority on this one though.
8) Race results. They are still not correct. I’m pretty sure I was the third or fourth person in my swim wave out of the water and yet my swim time is listed as over 1:30. In fact, most of the swim times are completely screwed up. Some people are recorded as finishing several minutes before the pros even started. There are very few things in a race that you have to get perfect. Routes can be a little off, post-race food can be sub-par (I never eat afterwards anyway), but timing has to be right. Period.

Last but not least, it’s very encouraging and positive to see that the race director is reading these blogs and considering peoples’ input. I think this race has a lot of potential, and I’m sure the kinks will get worked out. My wife is a little less pleased. She’s sworn off Rev3 races entirely. Her experiences have always been at WTC races or well-established local races (i.e, Savageman, etc.), including several inaugural events (IM-Mont Tremblant, Raleigh 70.3), which all seemed to run much smoother. I think part of this is her perspective as someone newer to the sport. The “rookie mistakes” with buses and last minute transition changes are annoyances to people who have done multiple triathlons and who can roll with the punches, but they are huge stressors to those doing their first big race that adds to already large cases of nerves. It also wasn’t just “issues” with the swim, it was that there was a real sense that people were not safe. My wife stopped twice to try and call kayaks for distressed swimmers who were unable to yell loudly enough to get someone’s attention. In time, I hope to convince her otherwise, as I think the more options to choose from the better, and that even a bad day of racing beats just about any way to spend a Sunday. I’ve also heard lots of great things about Rev3, but this race fell short in significant and serious ways, and there better be some real evidence that the problems have been resolved or this race will not last long.
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [NeverEnough] [ In reply to ]
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No kidding. Much respect for taking ownership. This seals the deal. Will definitely do a Rev3 race this year and look for more opportunities to race the series!

NeverEnough wrote:
Nice...new found respect for R3Tri. Good luck on #4 and Congratulations!



rev3tri wrote:
All,
I'll post a more detailed response soon as my wife is about to deliver our fourth child, but I wanted to post on here to let you know that we are reading this.

Bottom line is that we had some issues today. Without going into details, some were rookie mistakes. Please know that we will own up to these, take responsibility for them, take our blows and come out of this better for it. You all deserve more from us and honestly, we are better than this.

Charlie
http://Www.rev3tri.com
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [TH3_FRB] [ In reply to ]
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I was personally very happy about the T1 change. I am a slow swimmer but a fast biker, there was a huge group of 1/2 and oly bikers when i was coming out of T1 that would have been a complete nightmare trying to work through on that narrow trail. It seemed like i passed 100 people on the 1st little straight before the left turn and a couple hundred more in the first few miles, i was very glad for the change.

On a drafting note, a friend of mine was racing as a pro, he saw the group of 7 riders together, said they were all in a pack, but riding the legal staggered distance. I didn't see the original thread so im not sure if that's what it was about
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [japarker24] [ In reply to ]
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japarker24 wrote:
When a multiple transistion race is done right, you don't even notice. Examples: B2B and IM 70.3 Raleigh (and that was an inaugural race).

O yea? B2B had NO logistical challenges for athletes and spectators the first couple of years?? Hmm...
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [James Haycraft] [ In reply to ]
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FYI: my split times have been corrected.
Last edited by: Vanwolfenstein: Jun 24, 13 12:06
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [bujayman] [ In reply to ]
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I have absolutely no problem with riding within the rules even if there is an advantage. I do it myself. I know for a fact there is an aero advantage at the legal distance so I ride there when it makes sense. The other thread was about straight up cheating.

On a related note, since I was up near the pointy end of the race I'm not sure how congested the course was and how officials were handling it. I think there is always going to be some incidental rules violations when you have a lot of people out there together. I don't hang the officiating on the race directors so it's really a seperate issue if there are issues with not enough course marshals. Do race directors specify how many marshals they need/want or does USAT dictate that based on something like registration numbers?

bujayman wrote:
On a drafting note, a friend of mine was racing as a pro, he saw the group of 7 riders together, said they were all in a pack, but riding the legal staggered distance. I didn't see the original thread so im not sure if that's what it was about
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Re: Rev3 Williamsburg - constructive criticism [Vanwolfenstein] [ In reply to ]
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Mine showed an 18min T2 and a 1:18 run. Unfortunately, I had a melt down on the run and was closer to 1:35.

Vanwolfenstein wrote:
FYI: my split times have been corrected.
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