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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Kenney] [ In reply to ]
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So if Doctor puts me on something, per this thread, I am a cheat.
I will NOT take anything for sport improvement. I am just an old fart with arthritis trying to stay active



I think this is the 4th time I have said this, but once again. If you have an illness that requires T supplementation, then you can get a TUE and race, you are not a cheater. Now the caveat of that is, most doctors are prescribing T like it was some harmless candy. So the drug enforcement agencies are on to this, so they have strict guidelines as to who is really sick and in need of these drugs. So I hope you doc is not one of these, they just cannot always be trusted these days..You need to take some control of your own health, and use the doc's as a top source of information. But now we also have the internet, 100's of other doctors opinions at our fingertips, and just about every study ever done right there in front of us. Lets not be lazy...

I'm old too, probably could have had a dozen docs give me the goods over the past decade. But so far, I'm just getting older, slower, things hurt more, recover less, and generally I just feel a lot more tired than I used to. But I cannot attribute any of these symptoms to anything other than getting older, and trying to stay somewhat of an athlete. If it got worse to the point of degrading my lifestyle with my family, well then I would start to look at these other things, And too bad for me, I will be regulated to fun runs and gran fondos. Plenty of non sanctioned races to keep you busy, no need to muddy up the sports that are more competitive, and of course I dont want to be a cheater..(-;
Last edited by: monty: May 23, 19 15:06
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [jstonebarger] [ In reply to ]
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It's not sanctioned so a TUE does nothing. Per this thread, I am just to drop.out and never enter even a local 10k again.....ok
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Twinkie] [ In reply to ]
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Twinkie wrote:
IGNORE the below. I stand corrected (read below to see the correcting). I do not want misinformation on here.

Also, if I get tested they will just think I live a rockstar lifestyle and have too much money. NOTHING I can enhances my performance in any area of life haha oops



Thomas Gerlach wrote:


Regardless of when they took them that doesn't mean they haven't cheated. Enhancements to fitness and endurance have a lasting effect. You can't just take a substance that it is banned inside competition and compete clean. Well you can, but you are still cheating. Maybe they won't get an OOC test but that doesn't excuse their behavior.


If it brings them to a normal range of T it isnt cheating. It is playing not at a disadvantage.

Now I have to disagree. The laws only say that it is illegal to race or compete while using PEDs. Nowhere does it say it is illegal to train on PEDs. Is it morally ethical? eh depends on what your morals are. I don't want man tits or other side effects so I will stick to light beer as my PED haha

I think there's something missed here.
SOME PEDs are banned totally (e.g. EPO).
Some are only banned in-competition (but not out-of-comp).
Some can be used either in and/or out of comp, with a TUE, just depending on what it is.

And some stuff is OK within limits (eg some asthma inhalers) but not beyond certain doses.
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [monty] [ In reply to ]
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But see I think if it is non sanctioned, I do not believe it is with the Spirit of sport if someone is doped to the gills.
I am not sure if my 100 is sanctioned. If so i would not be able to get a TUE in time. I am not going to drop doing it IF for some reason I am on something that would text positive.
I am just blown away. We had a very respected member already say that a 78 year old doing a 10k in 90 minutes should be disqualified if not proper documentation...
I am the minority. If anyone wants to bring up this thread after June 13, I will tell them what my Doctor said and if taking something they can call the race Director in my 100.
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Kenney] [ In reply to ]
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The difference between BOP and FOP gets kinda weird in the older age groups. I'm 66, I've been an average, maybe slightly above average swimmer and biker most of my life but because I'm still out there competing I have a shot at my AG podium. Why? because all my competitors were sidelined by life somewhere along the way. All those kids in my high school gym class who could kick my ass back then are 60 lbs overweight and drink too much, or something. Anyway for those of us who are left in the arena, we're all low T, any outside help would put us ahead by a huge margin. I would be absolutely furious if I were to be knocked off the podium by some guy who justified in his own mind that his T was dangerously low and he needed a supplement. I'd be almost as furious if I finished 5th instead of 4th.

So far I've lived through a number of things that should have put me in the grave, I deserve a fair chance for glory and I don't want to have to cheat to get there.

"Aquabike is a swim then sleep session on aerobars ...."
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Kenney] [ In reply to ]
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Kenney wrote:
As I said for myself I just got tested and waiting for the third test on my T. Both myself and my Doctor in general do not believe in raising my T, since I have no other symptoms at this time......but I go in on June 13. If that they find that it is so low because of something else that needs treatment for health , should I just quit what am signed up for?
I have Telluride 38 Mile and Run Rabbit Run 100 then in Sept. On ultra sign up my projected time is AFTER the cutoff.
So if Doctor puts me on something, per this thread, I am a cheat.


You say you have no symptoms... which means you obviously aren't in need of T. If T is low because of something else that is wrong, why wouldn't you address that "something else"?
Last edited by: rruff: May 23, 19 15:25
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Fuller] [ In reply to ]
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In my case I am totally fine if I has no results...
Again, using things to fight of aging cause we all have low T....I agree.
They do not know why my readings are so low when I have no other symptoms. Again, I said I would not take it solely because the number is low. But on the 13th, if I am given anything for health, I am not dropping out of what I signed up for. ...if it was an IM, I would never even take a roll down.....but I am not stopping when my goal in a 100 will be at least 16 hours after the leaders
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [rruff] [ In reply to ]
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I have no idea. As of right now the Doctor has no idea. My first two texts were 49 and 45 I think.
My point was if for whatever reason the give me anything, not necessarily T, there is no time for a TUE,, not even sure what kind a sanction for a 100....but after all this training , with arthritis and goal to make cutoff, I am not going to cancel.
Again, as of now, both myself and the Dr think artificial boosting of T is a bad thing to do
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Kenney] [ In reply to ]
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My point was if for whatever reason the give me anything, not necessarily T, there is no time for a TUE,, not even sure what kind a sanction for a 100....but after all this training , with arthritis and goal to make cutoff, I am not going to cancel. //

I think you are making"your" situation a lot more complicated than it has to be, and it appears you are putting some stress into this. Your 100 ride is most likely fine to ride, no matter what. your doc gives you. And even if it were, and you were a letter of the law kind of guy, I think you could get a retroactive TUE if you so choose to. At the very least, that process would tell you if your doc is correct, somewhere in-between, or completely oblivious to drugs and the connection to sport.


So dont worry about this, plan on having a great ride, and things will sort themselves out later on. You are kind of caught up in the middle of this debate, but reality is that you are really just on the fringe. Like I tell my kids, dont worry about stuff that hasn't happened yet, and may never happen!!! (-;
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [monty] [ In reply to ]
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Thank You......its a 100 mile ultra. My goal is to average 21 minutes per mile. :o)
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Kenney] [ In reply to ]
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Well if 21 minutes per mile is you goal for cycling a 100, you better have a good night light!!!! (-;
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [monty] [ In reply to ]
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Well since it running,walking in the mountains, I will need a light, but if they give me drugs that allow me to glow I will have an advantage
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Kenney] [ In reply to ]
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Ya, after I hit reply thinking you meant 21 miles per hour, dawned on me that you were talking about running. Night lite either way!! But of course 100 miles is way more studly and time consuming that a century ride, so good luck with that one. I have given up any ambitions of running long, just seems too damaging in my mid 60's. But every once in awhile I do think about the Boston Marathon, just wish I didnt have to run one to get there..I was a pretty decent long distance runner on very little mileage in the old days, wonder sometimes if that is still true all these years later...
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Kenney] [ In reply to ]
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Kenney wrote:
We had a very respected member already say that a 78 year old doing a 10k in 90 minutes should be disqualified if not proper documentation...


Who said they should be banned? On a brief skim through the thread you're the only one I saw mentioning a ban in respect to your example.

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Last edited by: desert dude: May 23, 19 16:58
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [desert dude] [ In reply to ]
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Sir, your reply to my example of the 78 year old was that my response was I did care about the right thing in sport.
So it appeared that I should report the 78 year old to do the right thing about sport.
I think the right thing in sport, is to clap bravo to the 78 year old who still improves his health.
I see through this thread that I am perceived as wrong. I just never thought people would think bop people as cheaters. I was wrong.
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Kenney] [ In reply to ]
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I'm sure it's like beating a dead horse, and I have many stories but this one really was surprising to me.

3-4 years ago I'm sitting around a table at a coffee shop with a group of recreational triathletes, because I was there that day and it was news at the time people were talking about Lance and doping in cycling/triathlon/running and on and on. I diplomatically said that I had seen some stuff, and it probably goes on, but I don't know know who and how these days, also we should be careful taking Holy stances when a lot of people dope right in town here, and we don't think too much of that. They asked how, I said hormonally and it's a big help. A couple people interrupted me and said they don't mean T or HGH as that's not really doping, that's just what people need to be normal. As it turns out, I had painted myself into a corner when 9 of let's say 12 at the table admitted to using T as part of their "health program" on a regular basis. Pellets, cream, pills, whatever. Were the other 3 just not admitting they too were doing it? I didn't know what to say, many of them people I knew pretty well. I'd say 8 or more had pinned on a number in the last year. It was pretty depressing.

The only other story I have is that over the last 5 years I've seen maybe one person per year make significant physical and ability changes within my circle in the local triathlon world. If it's a friend, I congratulate them on their progress, I then almost always ask about their changes to become leaner/faster. In all five instances it was followed with a,"Well, as a matter of fact, I went and got tested and it turns out this whole time I've had Low-T!!!" Again, super depressing, I've kind of accepted it as the norm. -L
Last edited by: LewisElliot: May 23, 19 17:49
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [LewisElliot] [ In reply to ]
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First....how are you Lewis. You probably dont remember me, I used to bike with Renee Coppock, did IM with Laura Esp , Pam Harder and Jen Drinkwalter. Hope you are well
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [HardlyTrying] [ In reply to ]
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HardlyTrying wrote:
If you take 3rd in your age group at a local event, I wouldn't bother going through the trouble and embarrassment to DQ even though you cheated the 4th place guy out of their spot. But if you're gunning for a national age-group championship with others who are taking it very seriously, that's over the line.

Damn I’d be pissed. The local ones are the only ones I’ll ever win and being on the podium is really important to me. Winning a local 10k changed my entire outlook on the sport. I may never win one again.

There’s a lot of elitism on this board. I do IM but won’t be top ten probably ever, but my local races are super competitive, we all want to do well. You can’t dope ant take my podium spot. No way.
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Kenney] [ In reply to ]
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Doing well! Visiting my dad right now so in Billings hitting masters still with Mike Burton like the old days down at the Y. Are you still racing and in Montana?
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [LewisElliot] [ In reply to ]
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Just doing ultras now. Got in bridger ridge run. The telluride 38...RRR 100
Maybe I will see you at the Y...have not swam in awhile, lost upper body weight. Enjoy the holiday
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [LewisElliot] [ In reply to ]
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Miss the old Masters when Mike was leading it
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [TriMom95] [ In reply to ]
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Females can't get a TUE for Testosterone, nd the rules on men getting one are pretty strict.

Most national antidoping agencies allow anonymous reporting. If the report is acted on they do a target test on the athlete. If I knew for sure someone was for sure cheating I'd have a hard time being social with them knowing that and would have a hard time holding that kind of knowledge in.

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Re: Testosterone Pellets [Kenney] [ In reply to ]
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I think you'd do well to read up on the actual status of what you're taking, and get a little bit more knowledge.

Your 10k was fine: your cortisone injection was OOC

Your other stuff is fine. Look on Global DRO under Hyaluronate. It is legal in and out of competition. https://www.globaldro.com/...NEM0VnBzcVRPeVd3VHk1

As to the other bloke: it's a clear protocol. Testosterone supps are prohibited in and out of competition without TUE or RTUE. Apply for an RTUE, or don't race. If you're looking for a goal time, just go and measure out a damn course and run the thing.
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [altayloraus] [ In reply to ]
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Maybe someone's dream at the same race was to finish top ten for once in their life and finished 11th. You really should report them.
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Re: Testosterone Pellets [TriMom95] [ In reply to ]
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I have a colleague who has a pellet every 3 months to manage high risk of hormonally mediated breast cancer. Not sure how that works but she said she also feels great, lifting more weight in her (recreational only) training and recovering better. Additionally it was prescribed by a specialist gynaecologist and she had to sign a legal declaration at the medical practice that she would not participate in any sports or events where testosterone is considered performance enhancing or illegal in any way.
She has no intention of competing but used to race and knows full well it's a banned substance. She has chosen her health over any future competitions. These people know that, whether they want to podium or not, it's still cheating - and it's taking away a place from someone who is racing clean - whether that be podium, top 10 or anywhere really. Not cool to continue to compete. AND I agree with the posters questioning the authority of a naturopath to prescribe and insert these - it's a medical procedure under local anaesthetic with sutures! I would welcome more random testing of age groupers by WADA and would be willing to pay a bit more in entry fee to accommodate that - entry fees cost that much anyway, what's a bit more for a cleaner competition!
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