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BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle
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One more Bottom Bracket discussion!!!

I have a BBright Frame, looking for a short crank (165) and a big gears (53/39)... and there are basically no aftermarket 24mm crank that will work.

I had great success with the wheelsmfg BB in the past... they don't offer a BBright to 30mm. I think they could swap the bearing on request. just wandering it's a good idea?
(fit, baring life, more creak, stiffness)


Also, could someone explain to me why the 30mm (bigger) are lighter?
https://www.sram.com/sram/road/products/sram-red-crankset-0
(similar with rotor)
Last edited by: benleg: Mar 24, 19 7:34
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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Force https://www.sram.com/...am-force-22-crankset
Ultegra offers 53/39 165mm too

Unless by aftermarket you want AX lightness or something else premium?

Bad idea to swap bearings - the 4130 never last long as the balls are tiny

30mm lighter because it can be made from aluminium. 24mm needs to be steel.
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]
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I was hopping to get a Rotor Aldhu... but somehow they decided that only the 30mm people need a 165...

But, why are people sticking with the 30mm standard if it create issues with bearings?
I'm assuming that there are some patent issues with 24 (shimano) and 24/22 (Sram)... but the is alot of option between 30 and 22 that will fix the bearing durability issue

Do 30mm Ceramic have the same issue?
Last edited by: benleg: Mar 24, 19 8:19
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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benleg wrote:
I was hopping to get a Rotor Aldhu... but somehow they decided that only the 30mm people need a 165...

I was under the impression that the Uldu was made un 24mm with 165 arms as that's what I wanted to get on my TT and 1x setup

benleg wrote:
but, why are people sticking with the 30mm standard if it create issues with bearings?
I'm assuming that there are some patent issues with 24 (shimano) and 24/22 (Sram)... but the is alot of option between 30 and 22 that will fix the bearing durability issue

Do 30mm Ceramic have the same issue?

I just really don't bother with any other BBs if they're not from BBINFINITE, best BB in the market! Have it on the trek, venge and now on my omni!!!

Whatever the crank just go bbinfinite they make every single combo for a 1 piece BB

Speed kills unless you have speed skills!!!
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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benleg wrote:
But, why are people sticking with the 30mm standard if it create issues with bearings?

It's only an issue when you try to fit a 30mm spindle into a frame BB shell that can fit a 41mm OD (outer diameter) bearing - such as PF86. THat is what 4130 means - OD and ID.
BB30 bearings have a 44mm OD. A BB30 frame shell takes 44mm, a PF30 expands that to fit a plastic sleeve around the 44mm bearing.
So where the 4130 gives 5.5mm for inner + outer race and bearings, the 4430 has 7mm. Which doesn't sound like much except that the extra all goes on ball size.

IME Ceramic has the same issue, you should get a bit longer out of the bearings but it's a non optimal setup so nothing can excel.

I'm a fan of Wheels mfg ACB, for a 30mm spindle use this https://wheelsmfg.com/...ontact-bb-black.html and this https://shop.fullspeedahead.com/...o-bb-right-pf30-79mm

Or this if you want to go all out https://www.ceramicspeed.com/...tom-brackets/pf4630/

No patent issues that I know of - plenty of people making 24mm spindle cranks
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]
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cyclenutnz wrote:
Ao where the 4130 gives 5.5mm for inner + outer race and bearings, the 4430 has 7mm. Which doesn't sound like much except that the extra all goes on ball size.

Now that explain everything!!

BBinfinite are just too scary to install... i'm not doing that to my expensive frame. and it doesn't address the problem above.

So no 30 mm for me.
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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Am I missing something here, you have a BBRight frame and you can’t find a 30mm BB?
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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Just so we're clear - BBright is a PF30 variant so the frame shell has a 46mm ID. Which means 30mm spindles are no problem.

As extra for experts - pressed in BBs need to be installed with a loctite that acts as a filler for all the rough patches you see in the carbon of the BB shell. The loctite makes up for the non ideal contact surface and it's an adhesive. The thread together BBs just use grease for install as they don't have the capacity to wriggle in the shell.

Basically you have a heap of options with BBright, just need to balance a few factors and install properly.
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]
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Listen to cyclenutnz, that’s all the info you need to know

I had a BBRight Cervelo and went with a thread together bb from wheelsmfg, worked great
https://wheelsmfg.com/...ontact-bb-black.html
Last edited by: Tifosi01: Mar 24, 19 13:24
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [Tifosi01] [ In reply to ]
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Tifosi01 wrote:
Listen to cyclenutnz, that’s all the info you need to know

I had a BBRight Cervelo and went with a thread together bb from wheelsmfg, worked great
https://wheelsmfg.com/...ontact-bb-black.html

Interesting!

But you need an extra spacer on the drive side with that, right?
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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I had to use an 11.5mm spacer on the driveside with my Rotor 3D+ crank, but that’s nothing to do with that BB, just BBRight in general
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [Tifosi01] [ In reply to ]
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Tifosi01 wrote:
I had to use an 11.5mm spacer on the driveside with my Rotor 3D+ crank, but that’s nothing to do with that BB, just BBRight in general

He probably asked about the spacer because BBInfinite and some of the thread together BBRight bottom brackets are now coming with the DS of the BB extended out to eliminate the need for a thick DS spacer. This also moves the DS bearing out. Essentially widening up to BB386EVO width.
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]
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Yeah, I'm still cramming my Power2Max on a 3D+ crank into my Trek (BB86) and it's not optimal. I change the BB every season; tried ceramic once and in the UK weather it lasted less time than steel! I really should bite the bullet and get a 24mm chainset now I have some Assioma pedals!

29 years and counting
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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benleg wrote:
....

I have a BBright Frame, looking for a short crank (165) and a big gears (53/39)... and there are basically no aftermarket 24mm crank that will work.

...

If your goal is to find a 165mm 53x39t crankset, there are plenty 30mm crankset that will work with BBRight - in fact, BBRight is designed to work with 30mm because it's a variant of PF30. So why insisting on having a 24mm spindle crankset on a BBRight frame (Cervelo)?
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]
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is it me or this is exactly what i'm looking for

https://www.endurobearingsonline.com/collections/torqtite-bbs-for-30mm-cranks/products/enduro-torqtite-bbright-xd-15-bearings


But they are EXPENSIVE!!! anybody else has try those
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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benleg wrote:
is it me or this is exactly what i'm looking for

https://www.endurobearingsonline.com/collections/torqtite-bbs-for-30mm-cranks/products/enduro-torqtite-bbright-xd-15-bearings

But they are EXPENSIVE!!! anybody else has try those


That would work with a 30mm crank. But keep in mind you have to also buy the Torqtite wrenches as they are proprietary. This makes the Torqtite even more expensive. I have used their BB386EVO to GXP conversion bottom brackets in a couple of builds with good luck.

I think the Wheels Manufacturing PF30 screw together bottom bracket would also work for 30mm cranks. It has just enough reach to work with the 79mm wide BBRight shell but requires pressing in half of the BB to get the threads to start.

If you go with a 24mm crankset then both Wheels Manufacturing and Torqtite make BBRight to 24mm conversion bb's with the DS bearing set in an outboard shell. https://wheelsmfg.com/...no-cranks-black.html

There is also the Token Ninja bottom bracket series. These are aluminum screw together shells with delrin plastic rings pressed over the flange areas where they sit inside the bike frame BB shell to allow a bit tighter fit. These BB's typically have to be ordered from overseas as they don't seem to have wide US distribution. The pricing is a lot lower the other options listed above. See the BBRight to BB386 option under this listing: https://www.ebay.com/...Q&frcectupt=true
Last edited by: SummitAK: Mar 25, 19 23:30
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]
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I didn't want to start another thread just to get your info on this, but I've been looking at a Vision Metron Aero crankset. However they are BB386 Evo and I have a Trek Speed Concept with BB86, I can't seem to find much info on the internet if that combination is even possible with certain bearings or spacers or idk what. Could you help me out?
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [Tri_Joeri] [ In reply to ]
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Tri_Joeri wrote:
I didn't want to start another thread just to get your info on this, but I've been looking at a Vision Metron Aero crankset. However they are BB386 Evo and I have a Trek Speed Concept with BB86, I can't seem to find much info on the internet if that combination is even possible with certain bearings or spacers or idk what. Could you help me out?

BB386EVO utilizes a 30mm crank spindle diameter. Trek's BB86/90 uses 24mm diameter crankset spindles. 30mm spindles use 42mm o.d. cartridge bearings while 24mm spindles use 37mm o.d. cartridge bearings. There are limited bearings available that have a 37mm o.d. with 24mm i.d. that will allow fitting a 30mm spindle into a bottom bracket designed for a 24mm spindle, but these have very low load carrying capabilities and don't last long in this application.
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [Tri_Joeri] [ In reply to ]
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As SummitAK said - 386 into BB90 is technically possible if you hunt down some bearings and bodge some dust covers. But you would want to be ordering a lot of bearings for the frequent replacement required (and they're not cheap).
As I mentioned above - 41mm OD with 30mm ID don't last long - cut that OD down to 37mm and it's only going to be worse.

Campagnolo Bora would be better


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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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The Enduro does exactly the same thing as the wheels PF30 for 2.5x the price
I haven't tried Enduro because Wheels going so well for me and my clients. Much better durability than Hawk (lowest friction steel bearings in past testing)
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for the info/suggestion! Those do seem hard to find in 165mm or less though
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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I agree with not running a 4130 BB. That's what I currently have in my Argon18 (with my BB30 PM) and it's awful. It's always making noise and the bearing life if extremely short. I've thought about seeing if any carbon repair places would be willing to modify the BB ID to 42 so it could accept BB30, but I haven't put enough time or energy into that...yet.
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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So look like a big part of my confusion on BBright come from the fact that there are 2 different BBright standard out there.

BBright Direct Fit (41.96mm)
BBright Press Fit (45.96mm)

Not sure why Cervelo made things so confusing... but base on the conservations above i think it's fair to say that Direct Fit and 30mm spindle should be avoided.

Nothing wrong with Press Fit, if properly installed.
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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]
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what grade of loctite are we using to properly seat our BB shells?

cyclenutnz wrote:
Just so we're clear - BBright is a PF30 variant so the frame shell has a 46mm ID. Which means 30mm spindles are no problem.

As extra for experts - pressed in BBs need to be installed with a loctite that acts as a filler for all the rough patches you see in the carbon of the BB shell. The loctite makes up for the non ideal contact surface and it's an adhesive. The thread together BBs just use grease for install as they don't have the capacity to wriggle in the shell.

Basically you have a heap of options with BBright, just need to balance a few factors and install properly.

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Re: BB: 24 vs 30 mm spindle [benleg] [ In reply to ]
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direct fit is only on one frame cervelo has ever made.
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