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Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer
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Need help deciding on winter training options and why you'd pick what you did. I have 3 choices listed with my total cost for each
1.New Garmin Vector 3 dual sided power and used dumb trainer. $700
2. New Cycleops Hammer $850
3. New Elite Direto $680
Thanks in advance!
Last edited by: D.O.: Oct 5, 18 6:21
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [D.O.] [ In reply to ]
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I crossed this bridge last year and went with Pedals. Decision was basically that I couldn't buy both, and I wanted to have power on my bike when I took it outside for races.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [lenny07] [ In reply to ]
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Pedals and cheap smart trainer. You can pick one up used super cheap eg tacx flow pedals will give acurate power indoors and the cheap smart trainer will still be fun on zwift for the winter.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [D.O.] [ In reply to ]
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D.O. wrote:
Need help deciding on winter training options and why you'd pick what you did. I have 3 choices
1.New Garmin Vector 3 dual sided power and used dumb trainer. $700
2. New Cycleops Hammer $850
3. New Elite Direto $780
Thanks in advance!

Elite directo on sale $699 and power tap C-1 chainrings $399

Sell your trainer
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [D.O.] [ In reply to ]
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Really depends on what you want to do. If you want to do stuff like Zwift and have it control your trainer, you have to go with a smart trainer. I pulled the trigger on an Elite Direto last December and have really enjoyed...makes training inside fun.

___________________________________________________
Taco cat spelled backwards is....taco cat.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [spot] [ In reply to ]
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Yeah I think the C-1 is a great deal to get into the power game.

BTW where is the Direto available for $680 these days?.
Though the Hammer for $850 is a really sweet deal.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [D.O.] [ In reply to ]
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My vote would be for pedals and a dumb trainer. The pedals would allow you to have power outdoors. Once you start training with power inside, you'll want it outside too. However the V3s and trainer is going to set you back more than $700 :)

Power Meter City
Your Power Meter Specialists
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [PM City] [ In reply to ]
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Don't know about that mate. Retailers in the UK and US will sell you the V3 duals as low as $800/£600. I bought mine for that and so did a few mates.


To the OP. Buy real power meters you can use indoor and out and a dumb trainer.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [trener1] [ In reply to ]
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trener1 wrote:
Yeah I think the C-1 is a great deal to get into the power game.

BTW where is the Direto available for $680 these days?.
Though the Hammer for $850 is a really sweet deal.


All I can find now is $699

https://bikecloset.com/...LEAQYASABEgLq-vD_BwE
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [D.O.] [ In reply to ]
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If those are the only 3 choices then #1; can’t take that trainer outside.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [DFW_Tri] [ In reply to ]
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Buy Favero Assioma instead of Vector and you saved money for smart trainer :)
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [KamilN] [ In reply to ]
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Favero +1
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [D.O.] [ In reply to ]
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Option 1...
Although I went Stages (ridiculous runout deal) and a used set of InsideRide rollers.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [D.O.] [ In reply to ]
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I'd say it depends how much you're planning to ride indoors, and also how likely it is that you'll have budget to add a power meter in another ~6 months if you go for the smart trainer now.

I had a similar decision a couple of years ago. I went for the smart trainer on the basis that I didn't own any kind of trainer, didn't see the point in buying a cheap one that I would inevitably want to upgrade in the near future, and I wanted to add high quality and intensity structured/interval workouts indoors, for which a smart trainer would be much better than a dumb one. Most of my outdoor rides were either solo long, steady efforts or group rides. I figured that using the smart trainer would help me calibrate my RPE and HR to power which would help me stay in roughly the right power zone for those solo rides. And my efforts in the group rides were dictated by what the group was doing, not a power-based plan, so having a power meter would be interesting to look at the data but wouldn't really change the way I ride.

It worked out well for me, I got a lot of benefit out of doing ~2 structured rides indoors per week, really helped both to improve and also structure my outdoor training better even without a power meter since I had a very good idea of how RPE, HR and watts aligned to each other. I then added a set of Garmin Vectors, it's always good to have another data point but I found that on anything below about 105% of FTP they're not really telling me anything I didn't already have a very good idea of. I've spent so much time indoors riding intensities from 80-105% of FTP that I can nail those sort of efforts outdoors pretty easily without needing to look at power numbers. Where I've found the power meter to be really useful is:
- Race pacing, where HR and RPE are a bit skewed by adrenaline of race day plus swim if it's a triathlon
- Higher intensity intervals which I would previously have done indoors
- TSS and tracking overall workload on group rides where the effort can be all over the place. Previously all I really had to quantify those rides was average HR and gut feel. Looking at Normalised Power vs Average Power has been much more revealing in terms of how hard or not I actually rode
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [myjunk] [ In reply to ]
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Favero +2.

Don't get me wrong, erg mode is nice... but assuming you race outdoors not just on Zwift -- get something that can help you racing and training.

If you're cash strapped, go single sided Favero (which maybe leaves you money for a lower end, or used smart trainer)?

Don't feel like you need to go dual sized. Don't get me wrong, I have multiple DS PMs, but single sided is fine if the goal is to track your progress and monitor effort in races. You can also always upgrade to DS later.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [D.O.] [ In reply to ]
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Smart trainer because ERG mode.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [wintershade] [ In reply to ]
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I agree.. DS don't tell me much after the initial - oooo... my left is stronger than the right.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [myjunk] [ In reply to ]
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myjunk wrote:
I agree.. DS don't tell me much after the initial - oooo... my left is stronger than the right.

If it was as simple as my right being stronger than my left it would be fine, problem is that I'm seeing left:right ratios anywhere between 50:50 and 45:55. With a single-sided power meter that just doubles the left power, that would give me up to 10% variation in reported power numbers. That's a big enough discrepancy to make it unusable for testing or racing purposes. If I see an improvement of 4% in my FTP I don't know whether it's really 4% or whether I was just having a 49:51 day on this test versus a 47:53 day on my previous test.

With the data I'm seeing, I'm very glad I shelled out the extra for 2-sided power.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [cartsman] [ In reply to ]
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Depends on how often you use your bike outside.

My bike has only been outside once since June, for a race. I have the Powertap C1 chainrings - just received my fourth unit, still not - and own an elite direto.

I'd 100% go for the direto over the powermeter, but thats only because I ride 100% inside. If you ride more than 60% outside, go for the powermeter.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [D.O.] [ In reply to ]
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For me, it's a no contest.

Smart trainer >>>> powertap or power pedals any day.

I use the smart trainer 3-5x/wk, sometimes more.

I ride outdoors like 1x/wk, 2x max.

I've also found power on race day to not be as helpful as I thought. Lots of unexpected things pop up that you have to factor in for, like heat/cold, unexpected swim fatigue, etc. - my worst race rides have been when I tried to peg a particular %FTP power I had decided for beforehand, and not allowed as much race-day compensation.

I actually trust my HR more than my PM on race day. Plus, my PM didn't catch on to my Garmin on 3 different races, so I was racing by feel and HR, and it went really well - better than my PM races (although granted, it's helpful to have the retrospective PM data.)

You could take my powertap and I'm not sure I'd even replace it. You take my Kickr away, and I'm getting a new one next week.

I've also done the dumb trainer + powertap thing - it's not bad, but I much, much prefer the Kickr. Especially if I'll be on it 3-5 hrs/wk.
Last edited by: lightheir: Oct 9, 18 7:48
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [trener1] [ In reply to ]
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trener1 wrote:

BTW where is the Direto available for $680 these days?.
Though the Hammer for $850 is a really sweet deal.


I just picked up a Hammer for 799. No tax and free shipping. Best deal out there I could find
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [Etip] [ In reply to ]
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I got it from the Bikecloset.com, but just checked their website - looks like the sale is over and it's back to $1,199.

Bummer
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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I am actually running into the same problem as the OP. Little background I live in Chicago, will be biking indoors using TR 3-4 days/week (never ride outside; efficiency and safety). My current set up is an older used road bike, dumb trainer, and no power meter. I qualified for duathlon worlds so want to put in some quality indoor sessions to get in peak shape for that. I only compete in sprints and olympic distance duathlons for now. 70.3 may be in the cards in 2020.

My options/thoughts (working with limited cash flow under ~$1k):

A) Smart Trainer (Wahoo Kickr Snap) - so I can get some quality indoor sessions since I will not be riding outside other then for the 4 races a year I do (used HR/RPE in the past)
B) Favero Assioma pedals (Uno/Duo) and dumb trainer - so I am able to have them for indoor sessions and also bring them with me to race abroad on a rented bike

Any thoughts/comments/opinions would be greatly appreciated. I have jumped back and forth for the past few weeks and training starts in 1.5 weeks so need to make a purchase soon.

Thanks fellow STers!
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [pkeys00] [ In reply to ]
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pkeys00 wrote:
I am actually running into the same problem as the OP. Little background I live in Chicago, will be biking indoors using TR 3-4 days/week (never ride outside; efficiency and safety). My current set up is an older used road bike, dumb trainer, and no power meter. I qualified for duathlon worlds so want to put in some quality indoor sessions to get in peak shape for that. I only compete in sprints and olympic distance duathlons for now. 70.3 may be in the cards in 2020.

My options/thoughts (working with limited cash flow under ~$1k):

A) Smart Trainer (Wahoo Kickr Snap) - so I can get some quality indoor sessions since I will not be riding outside other then for the 4 races a year I do (used HR/RPE in the past)
B) Favero Assioma pedals (Uno/Duo) and dumb trainer - so I am able to have them for indoor sessions and also bring them with me to race abroad on a rented bike

Any thoughts/comments/opinions would be greatly appreciated. I have jumped back and forth for the past few weeks and training starts in 1.5 weeks so need to make a purchase soon.

Thanks fellow STers!

I would go with option 1. In using HR/RPE in the past I would continue to use that on race day and us the trainer to build your fitness and power. I bought power based pedals and love them. However, I did an IM this year and paced off HR/RPE not power. I haven't used the numbers from the power tap pedals enough to accurately pace myself.
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Re: Power Pedals vs Smart Trainer [pkeys00] [ In reply to ]
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In your case I'd go for the smart trainer especially since you are already training mostly indoors.

I'm from the burbs and train mostly indoors for your exact reasons. I bought my kickr 4 years ago and then a PM (vector 2) a year after. I went from a dumb trainer to a smart and absolutely loved it especially with TR. I would not be on my trainer as much if I continued to use my dumb trainer with a PM. I got the PM mainly for racing.
My friend who rides mostly outside, thinks of trainers as a necessary evil. For her, a PM would be best.
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