It is Pogacar.

But yeah, ridiculous numbers.

Some part of me thought the others just let him get away, he was so far back ...

But wow those are impressive #s

Different from 2003, it was not that later on the stage, not on first week, the guys were more fresh and it was a tail wind! all this according with Johan Bruyneel.0
Lots a people may argue that they love the guy, (Johan) but that don't erase his knowledge about the race!
Cheers

Even on the older w/kg table, 6.4 w/kg is listed as being max sustainable for an hour. We are talking about a 25 minute effort, one week into the tour. The old model would predict 20 min effort to be about 6.7-6.8 w/kg, depending on amount of anaerobic contribution. In that light, 6.5 w/kg for 25 does not seem ridiculous.

On the newer w/kg table, the 60-min max is upped to 6.6 w/kg. 6.5 w/kg for about 40% of the duration, one week into the tour, etc? Doesn't seem too out of place. I get it though, that there's elevation effect as well. But the newer table would suggest 20 min effort of 7.0 w/kg or even a tad higher. Take away ~6% for elevation (and this applies only to the top of the climb at 1,600 meters), and we are looking at ~6.6 w/kg for 20 minutes. Right at the edge of what is plausible.

Well he was 6.77W per kilo for his final 10 min at the top of the elevation range, so right there given it was "only" 10 min.

10 minutes is not 20 minutes, is it? For one, the anaerobic contribution is much greater.

I've done climbs where I did the first 10 min at 315 W and the last 10 at 345 W. It would be ridiculous for my to contend that I could have held that 345 W for 20 minutes or even 15 minutes. Context matters. Sure, it's not 10 min fresh, but in no world should it be so facile to say, oh he could have extended that effort for another 50% in duration.

In another race, I had to go hard for the first ~9 minutes (11% avg gradient does that) at 325 W, but I had to dial it down significantly for the last 14 (275 W). No way could I have carried 325 W much longer than 9. The overall average for the entire climb is pretty much in line with what I was expecting for a climb that takes ~20-30 min to climb.

I was actually supporting your point, but realistically the anaerobic contribution happened during his first 17 second surge at over 800W...after that he would have been aerobic anyway, with maybe a surge over the top before the decent.

Sorry, reading comprehension fail on my part

He is also Slovenian tt champ ahead of Roglic.

Pogacar is exciting to watch.

:Links to an article from 2008?

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To be fair, physics and basic human physiology haven't changed much since then.

Physics has not changed at all as this is just Newtonian mechanics, and physiology well we're talking 2008 AD and not BC so its either 12 years ago or 4028 years ago, but either way human physiology in that time span I would guess is identical (DNA wise)...thoughts? What is the time span for transformation of the physiology of our species?

The article has been updated since 2008, but this isn't mentioned.

The 2nd edition of the Training and Racing with PM book came out around 2011-2012, and in that book, the highest was still listed as 6.4 w/kg, supposedly derived from Boardman's hour record attempt (done without PM, but with distance and air pressure known, it was derived therefrom). So 6.6 w/kg is not from 2008.

See this post (from Dr. Coggan himself on the update). Note that Rominger's abnormally high numbers were also brought up

Slight correction. His winning attack of 450 watts lasted 10 minutes.

The 6.5 w / kg was over the whole climb was the 24 minute effort and was 429 watts.

For those curious, here are historical times. Some of the VAM calculations are making this all quite interesting. We haven't seen this kind of skywalking for a while.

Relatively speaking, this was a short and easy mountain stage perfectly set up for a smash up the Peyresourde to complete. In 2007 the same final 141 km were used, but also included before that was another 70km including two more cat 2s and a 3. So, they just bypassed all that excess miles and effort this year, a general strategy I agree with.

He got wild in yesterday’s stage as well. Impressive rider!

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

In the original link Cyclingnews' article mentions the record time partially being a result of Dumoulin's leadout in the first half when Pogecar could ride slightly lower wattage following wheels, in comparison to Mayo vs Vino climb when they were purportedly trying to destroy each other. Not saying that this VAM from 2 days ago from th entire group had no outside assistance (it's all those riders going pretty fast as several beat Vino + Mayo, so if several are enhanced sufficiently it all helps each other), but there was some drafting/wheel following on this group climb vs 2003. I don't remember the Peyseroude stage in 2003.

Here is a wikipedia entry from 2003's stage. It looks like Vino gapped Lance and Ullrich and put 40 seconds on them before the finish. At the end of the stage Vino was in 3rd, 18 seconds down on Lance and 3 seconds down on Ullrich:

Stage 14[edit]
20 July 2003 — Saint-Gironsto Loudenvielle-le-Louron, 191.5 km (119.0 mi)[1]
The second day in the Pyrenees, the 191.5 km stage had two category two climbs and four category one climbs spaced throughout the route. The toughest climbs were the Col de la Core at 67 km, Col de Menté at 118.5 km, the Col du Portillon at 156 km and the final climb and descent of the Col de Peyresourde at 180 km. The route included the second category Col de Portet d'Aspet, where Fabio Casartelli was mortally injured in 1995.
Just 162 riders started the stage. There was a very early break of seventeen riders, including Richard Virenque, Gilberto Simoni, Jakob Piil and Manuel Beltran. The group steadily increased their lead over the US Postal led peloton in the early part of the race. By the first category two climb they were over nine minutes clear, by the Col de la Core over twelve minutes. When the deficit hit almost fifteen minutes the teams of USP and Euskaltel joined together at the front of the peloton, later they were joined by Telekom and then Bianchi. By the Col du Portet d'Aspet the lead was reduced to around eleven minutes and on the Col de Menté the leading 17 were showing signs of fatigue and began to drop riders, a group of twelve being led by Virenque over the summit.
The tour then entered Spain for a few kilometres before the climb of the Col du Portillon, where the leading group broke up with a trio of Dufaux, Simoni and Virenque leading the peloton by seven minutes over the summit. The trio remained ahead up the Col de Peyresourde as the field behind them split under repeated attacks, while Armstrong stuck close to Ullrich Vinokourov broke away. Dufaux, Simoni and Virenque kept their lead; they were joined by Peron and fought out the finish, Simoni winning the sprint. Vinokourov led in two others was 41 seconds down and Armstrong and Ullrich came in 1' 24" later.

Were temps much cooler this year as it is later in the year?

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Let food be thy medicine...

It's 2008 BP. ie Before biological Passport

With a worldwide pandemic going in, ongoing testing of athletes seems to be way down the list of things to do, especially if it’s using any critical healthcare items in low supply. Enjoy the show and spectacle these warriors are putting on for us... but it is a show, right? I think it’s the disc brakes, that are making the peloton brake less often, and they go faster because of it (last sentence in pink).

https://www.cyclingnews.com/...-coronavirus-crisis/

viruses?

this radiolab podcast discusses how they discovered viruses causing genetic transfers resulting in instantaneous evolution leaps :
https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/radiolab/articles/infective-heredit

devashish_paul wrote:

Physics has not changed at all as this is just Newtonian mechanics, and physiology well we're talking 2008 AD and not BC so its either 12 years ago or 4028 years ago, but either way human physiology in that time span I would guess is identical (DNA wise)...thoughts? What is the time span for transformation of the physiology of our species?

Cadel Evans was considered a once-in-a-generation athlete at the AIS in Australia, setting records for Vo2 & w/kg power. He won the Tour de France, and could/should have won it a couple more times. His threshold - rested & not at altitude - was 6.0 w/kg.

Pogacar's best 20 mins was 6.5w/kg, when adjusted for altitude, is more like 6.7-6.8, after 8 solid days of racing, on the third tough climb of the day (he averaged 370 for 20 mins on the first, and 380 for 45 mins on the second).

Those "Marginal Gains" are really adding up!

Depends on the intensity of the selective pressure, and I would guess how "easy" it is for a genetic change to have an effect. Lactose tolerance has spread throughout a large chunk of the human population in only the last several thousand years or so. But I believe that is a mutation in one gene. I'd be surprised if there is a single gene that has a huge effect on endurance performance.