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Official ITU discussion thread...
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Time to start this up. We are approaching half way through the Olympic cycle.

Thoughts on Bermuda?
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]
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ajthomas wrote:
Time to start this up. We are approaching half way through the Olympic cycle. Thoughts on Bermuda?

Not specific to the Bermuda race but it just continues to amaze me that the U.S. with its 1000s of swimmers fast enough to swim front pack in the ITU does not produce more top notch ITU athletes. I mean, to swim ITU you need to go around 15:45-16:00 for the 1650/1500 scm; if you only count the number of guys who go that fast each year, there are probably around 300-400 that fast every yr. (The current AAAA cuts for 18 yr old boys are 16:01 for 1650 and 15:55 for 1500 scm.) In addition to these though, you have the 100s of swimmers who swim middle distance very fast and who could easily break 16 for the 1650 if they swam the event, e.g. i think most guys who can break 1:40 for 200 yd free could go sub-16 for 1650 yd. Thus i would guess every graduating class of college swimmers contains at least 500 if not 1000 swimmers who could swim at the ITU level. Why we don't have 5 or so of those 500-1000 starting ITU careers every year is beyond me. Perhaps they are just burned out on training altogether, they're too big to run well, or they just hate running, etc, but i would think that surely 1% of these guys could do well in ITU.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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You would need to find individuals who have an interest in this type of pursuit. With the popularity of collegiate club triathlon we should really be fostering the NCAA Men's sport along with the Women's as they are doing now.

I look at two younger athletes...maybe even three. Eli Hemming, Jason West, Matt McElroy. Can they swim at the ITU level...yep. Can they run with the best...sure can...ITS THE BIKE that is the issue for these guys.
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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I always believed this to be true as well, coming from someone who is a 4:00 400 LCM guy and who would regularly come out of the water in front in ITU junior races. But once you take that step to the elite ITU level, it's a completely different ball game, where even if I went all out and can put two or three minutes on a Mola or Murray in a 1500 open water, that 28 minute 10k at the end is the true separating factor.

I've had the opportunity to train and hang out with a group of ITU guys this week (including USA's top male finisher at Bermuda) as they are in town for the Richmond CAMTRI this weekend (they're staying in the DC area), and the run speed of these guys is unreal. I'm not allowed to share workout details, but we were on the track two days ago in the middle of the day (93 degrees plus humid) and everything was perfectly paced to hit a 14 minute 5k. My respect for the top ITU guys has exponentially grown after this week. They've also said that there have been major changes to biking in WTS races in the last two years, from a pedestrian pace throughout to a state of constant attacks.

It's been fun hearing some of their inside stories about the top pros from other countries and the state of ITU racing, and I'm considering doing a separate post of some our discussions if there's interest.

The Gram: @agyenis
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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I'll give you a little insight....we do get those numbers coming into triathlon. There are probaly 30-40 "developing" single sport athletes coming into the usa pipeline every year. You guys on ST just never hear of them because they are so low on the race lists that they race in events you've never heard of and/or covered by ST. Or they can't race as elites yet and struggle with getting to the elite level.

http://www.aomultisport.com
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [agyenis] [ In reply to ]
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agyenis wrote:
I always believed this to be true as well, coming from someone who is a 4:00 400 LCM guy and who would regularly come out of the water in front in ITU junior races. But once you take that step to the elite ITU level, it's a completely different ball game, where even if I went all out and can put two or three minutes on a Mola or Murray in a 1500 open water, that 28 minute 10k at the end is the true separating factor.

I've had the opportunity to train and hang out with a group of ITU guys this week (including USA's top male finisher at Bermuda) as they are in town for the Richmond CAMTRI this weekend (they're staying in the DC area), and the run speed of these guys is unreal. I'm not allowed to share workout details, but we were on the track two days ago in the middle of the day (93 degrees plus humid) and everything was perfectly paced to hit a 14 minute 5k. My respect for the top ITU guys has exponentially grown after this week. They've also said that there have been major changes to biking in WTS races in the last two years, from a pedestrian pace throughout to a state of constant attacks.

It's been fun hearing some of their inside stories about the top pros from other countries and the state of ITU racing, and I'm considering doing a separate post of some our discussions if there's interest.


We have the Brownlee brothers to thank for this. They decided they were going to attack on all three legs of the race and everyone else had to adapt. The bike is the big issue. Cycling, and all of the skills that go into it, do not appear to be a major priority in The States. As I mentioned above...we have guys like Hemming, West, and McElroy who can get the job done on the swim and the run.
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]
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ajthomas wrote:
Time to start this up. We are approaching half way through the Olympic cycle.

Thoughts on Bermuda?

It was a good day for Norway.

Member of Valhalla Racing Team
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [LifeTri] [ In reply to ]
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I’m not so sure about that statement. I think West and McElroy would both say that the swim is where they need to improve in order to get the job done.

It was pretty cool to see Hemming up there at the front in Bermuda. Looks like he has a lot of potential.



https://twitter.com/mungub
http://benmunguia.blogspot.com
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [Halvard] [ In reply to ]
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Yes it was! I am half Norwegian, so I was about half as happy as you.
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [mungub50] [ In reply to ]
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Their times show that they are with the pack on the swim. So you are saying they burn too many matches on the swim which hurts their bike and they are able to recover by the run?
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [agyenis] [ In reply to ]
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agyenis wrote:
I always believed this to be true as well, coming from someone who is a 4:00 400 LCM guy and who would regularly come out of the water in front in ITU junior races. But once you take that step to the elite ITU level, it's a completely different ball game, where even if I went all out and can put two or three minutes on a Mola or Murray in a 1500 open water, that 28 minute 10k at the end is the true separating factor.

I've had the opportunity to train and hang out with a group of ITU guys this week (including USA's top male finisher at Bermuda) as they are in town for the Richmond CAMTRI this weekend (they're staying in the DC area), and the run speed of these guys is unreal. I'm not allowed to share workout details, but we were on the track two days ago in the middle of the day (93 degrees plus humid) and everything was perfectly paced to hit a 14 minute 5k. My respect for the top ITU guys has exponentially grown after this week. They've also said that there have been major changes to biking in WTS races in the last two years, from a pedestrian pace throughout to a state of constant attacks.
It's been fun hearing some of their inside stories about the top pros from other countries and the state of ITU racing, and I'm considering doing a separate post of some our discussions if there's interest.


I would think it is safe to say that would be a significant portion of ST who would be interested in your inside stories. I've heard a bunch of these from guys/girls who were near the top of the swimming world, and they are always very interesting. :)


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [B_Doughtie] [ In reply to ]
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B_Doughtie wrote:
I'll give you a little insight....we do get those numbers coming into triathlon. There are probably 30-40 "developing" single sport athletes coming into the USA pipeline every year. You guys on ST just never hear of them because they are so low on the race lists that they race in events you've never heard of and/or covered by ST. Or they can't race as elites yet and struggle with getting to the elite level.

Very interesting, is there any way to get more info on these guys/girls, like their sporting background, races they're doing, results of said races, etc???


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [LifeTri] [ In reply to ]
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I’m with Mungub - no way is McElroy’s swim where it needs to be yet. I want to see a wetsuit/ flat course race where they all come in together (Yokohama?) to see how he hangs on the run.

Really enjoying these interesting bikes so far. The wetsuit/ flat courses are boring when they are a steady diet.

Heming was impressive at Bermuda. Bummed that Kanute didn’t get in a break. If he’s gonna ever podium, this is the type of course.

Aaron Bales
Lansing Triathlon Team
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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You can look at their continental cup rankings and then you can sort by country. There are a number of Americans there.
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [Halvard] [ In reply to ]
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I appreciate your restraint. I texted a friend something about wanting to ban you from the forum for the next month after that race!

Very impressive, an incredible day for them. Glad their bravery and strength was rewarded.

Aaron Bales
Lansing Triathlon Team
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [LifeTri] [ In reply to ]
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LifeTri wrote:
You can look at their continental cup rankings and then you can sort by country. There are a number of Americans there.

Ah, I see, thanks for this info!!!


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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Bit of weird season so far in the men's, maybe I'm just used to seeing a Brownlee or Gomez dominating, I hope these Norweigens coming through are legit and can do what they did on other courses.

I was starting to think we was going to go into the era of the uber runners, ITU can't get any more boring to me than everyone riding round in big packs and someone winning it off the run.

Good to see the Brit girls all seem to be coming back, Duffy needs a rival don't see where she's coming from though.
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [Jackets] [ In reply to ]
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this doesn't look like the profile of someone who just happens to win a WTS race the old fashioned way:

https://www.triathlon.org/...76434/casper_stornes
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [MI_Mumps] [ In reply to ]
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The race in Bermuda was strange.
During the bike there were four athletes trying to make something happen during the very soft pedaling bike leg. One Dane and three Norwegians. As in cycling it was not the Norwegians job to rain in Casper Storners during the bike leg. But when two of the strongest bike/run athletes are going for it at 32.5k, the rest can just blame themselves for not doing anything.
If Blummenfelt and Iden are going for a break, you should pay attention.
They did not and lost out on a chance to get on the podium.
It was a tactical race and some had better tactic than others.

I do not think we will see a similar race again. But I do think that we will see a lot more of the Norwegians.

I recommend everybody to follow the Norwegians athletes on Strava. They are sharing all workouts, have no secrets and put in a lot of hours.

Member of Valhalla Racing Team
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [Halvard] [ In reply to ]
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the 2 norweigans were actively slowing up the rest of the group so i wouldn't characterize what iden and blummenfelt were doing as "trying to make something happen" (unless you call trying to slow everyone else down so stornes could get as far away as possible). i'm not making excuses for why nobody else rode wide and past those 2 but they executed team tactics on the bike as well as you ever will see in triathlon.
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [mag900] [ In reply to ]
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mag900 wrote:
the 2 norweigans were actively slowing up the rest of the group so i wouldn't characterize what iden and blummenfelt were doing as "trying to make something happen" (unless you call trying to slow everyone else down so stornes could get as far away as possible). i'm not making excuses for why nobody else rode wide and past those 2 but they executed team tactics on the bike as well as you ever will see in triathlon.

At 32.5k Iden and Blummenfelt went for it. This was right before the end of the lap.
The rest of the field just let them bike away.
At T2 the rest of the field had lost 1 minute to Iden and Blummenfelt.

During the bike leg you had four people trying to attack. It was Stornes, Schilling, Iden and Blummenfelt.
The rest just sat there and watches each other.

The way I see it. 4 athletes tried to win, the rest tried not to lose.
This time it paid of to go for it.

Member of Valhalla Racing Team
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [Halvard] [ In reply to ]
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Halvard wrote:
mag900 wrote:
the 2 norweigans were actively slowing up the rest of the group so i wouldn't characterize what iden and blummenfelt were doing as "trying to make something happen" (unless you call trying to slow everyone else down so stornes could get as far away as possible). i'm not making excuses for why nobody else rode wide and past those 2 but they executed team tactics on the bike as well as you ever will see in triathlon.


At 32.5k Iden and Blummenfelt went for it. This was right before the end of the lap.
The rest of the field just let them bike away.
At T2 the rest of the field had lost 1 minute to Iden and Blummenfelt.

During the bike leg you had four people trying to attack. It was Stornes, Schilling, Iden and Blummenfelt.
The rest just sat there and watches each other.

The way I see it. 4 athletes tried to win, the rest tried not to lose.
This time it paid of to go for it.

Agreed. I watched all 10 laps at the top of Corkscrew Hill. I was with a Bermuda police officer who was timing the gap between Stornes and Schilling (first) and then Iden and Blummenfelt (when they overtook Schilling). The gap kept growing. Stornes was racing to win. Schilling tried but failed and no one followed the other two when they broke away.

After the last loop, I walked down to the run course. The Spanish coach was on the course. When Mola passed going outbound, he yelled something in Spanish. The only word I understood was "Blummenfelt" :-).

DeSoto Sports
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]
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The first race I participated in - a sprint in Western Norway 7 years ago - was won by M. Iden (the elder brother who is now a coach). He totally destroyed the rest of us.

The second race I participated in was won by G. Iden (the younger brother and who came in 2nd in Bahamas). He was 15 or 16 at the time and totally destroyed the rest of us.

These guys didn't come from nowhere. They started young and have been systematically training to be best in the world.
Last edited by: Chewie: May 5, 18 11:43
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [Chewie] [ In reply to ]
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i just posted stornes's race history. did you not look at it? he came from nowhere. iden didn't and was 12th in rotterdam last year. point me to one race that stornes ever had done before bermuda that would lead you to believe he could win a WTS race. he was 15th at world JUNIORS 2 years ago.
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Re: Official ITU discussion thread... [mag900] [ In reply to ]
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His race history goes back 5 years. He's not exactly a single sport competitor who has recently discovered triathlon.

Tactics played a significant role in this race. He made a break for it on the bike, and the rest of them let him go. That wasn't very smart of them.
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