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Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike
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with Maurten designed to be mixed with 16 oz, can it be mixed with say 24oz so same calories?? website says not to water it down but looking for a mix with no citric acid as it gives me sour stomach

Hard work is faster then aero
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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I am trying to fuel my next 70.3 with Maurtens
In fact they use a gelling agent and the drink is then rather thick but the texture allow you to digest a higher level of sugar than an isodrink!
They recommend to use the recommended water and not to dilute it or you loose the benefit of higher energy content!
I use 1,5 bag per bottle so 3 bags for two bottles!
The taste is rather mild and easy to drink while biking.
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [ppkestrel] [ In reply to ]
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ppkestrel wrote:
I am trying to fuel my next 70.3 with Maurtens

Sweet. Solid choice.
ppkestrel wrote:
In fact they use a gelling agent and the drink is then rather thick but the texture allow you to digest a higher level of sugar than an isodrink!

The hydrogel serves no benefit. It's just that they have reasonably good sugar ratios that makes it a useful beverage for many folks. (glucoese:fructose ratio)

ppkestrel wrote:
They recommend to use the recommended water and not to dilute it or you loose the benefit of higher energy content!

This is true. Higher energy content is ideal for 70.3 & 140.6 bike legs. If anything, concentrate it and keep one bottle onboard with fresh water to chase the concentrate.

To OP: if you do dilute it to 24oz, you'll have a very hard time consuming 90+ g/hr carbs during your ride. Just too much volume for most folks at that concentration. Won't hurt anything as far as gastrointestinal symptoms are concerned though.

Dr. Alex Harrison
______________________________________________________________________
YOUTUBE | LIFTING | RUNNING | NUTRITION | BOOK | NEWSLETTER
PhD Sport Physiology & Performance
Last edited by: DrAlexHarrison: Jun 12, 21 15:52
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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not really addressing any of the questions, just my personal experience...

i used maurten as directed for my last 70.3 back in nov. it was not hot outside so heat wasnt a big issue in regards to needing to chug water.

i used the drink mix as directed for the bike, then swapped over to their gels for the run. i had zero digestion issues and felt like i was getting plenty of calories in, never had any issues.

i have since used the liquid mix packs for run training when it was hotter out. i knew i needed more water than what was being mixed with their powder and confirmed it.

sooo... to me when its hotter outside im going to have to drink more water along with their mix.

'21 Captex Tri / '21 Lubbock 70.3 / '22 Ironman Texas / '22 Ironman Cozumel

80/20 Endurance Ambassador
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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I have relied on Maurten pretty much exclusively for calories on the bike at Canada Man twice. Had no stomach issues and easy to tolerate the relatively high calorie content. I can't answer to diluting it, but i don't see how that would be a problem unless it just gets to be too much fluid to consume for the amount of calories you aim to intake. Like any nutrition plan, try it in training in similar conditions if possible and if it works for you, you're set. Nutrition is so personal, best to dial it in yourself rather than asking others what works for them. Good luck.
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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Just for reference, this paper (https://europepmc.org/article/med/32079920) was actually sponsored by Maurten. Table 1 provides you with all the information to mix your own drink to whatever volume you want for less than 5euro/kg.
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [TomvdS] [ In reply to ]
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Save money on sodium alginate and get sodium citrate until they can reliably show that the heavily promoted "hydrogel" via alginate does anything useful at all.

I believe this is the second or 3rd study I've seen where sodium alginate inclusion is tested against carbs + water, sans sodium, and then Maurten goes on to claim it's the alginate rather than the sodium. Convenient marketing since they're the only ones using alginate.

Sodium inclusion in the beverage in any form is likely to enhance gastric emptying rate compared to sugar water without sodium.

Don't get me wrong, Maurten is among the very best endurance-focused drink mixes available. Their marketing is absolutely the best. ;)

They're among the best beverages primarily because of their closer to 1:1 glucose:fructose ratio than other endurance products, not because of alginate.

PS. I think sodium citrate is marginally better than alginate due to osmolarity differences. I look forward to future studies on alginate. So far, no (meaningful) dice.

Dr. Alex Harrison
______________________________________________________________________
YOUTUBE | LIFTING | RUNNING | NUTRITION | BOOK | NEWSLETTER
PhD Sport Physiology & Performance
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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For IM I only run concentrate bottles nutrition bottles taking sips as I need and swigging on my BTA or just prior to the aid station as I grab water. My BTA is water only as often that is all I feel like or using gels. I maybe run a more suggested dilution for 70.3 or less as I can carry enough calories but still always like an all water bottle.
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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DrAlexHarrison wrote:
Save money on sodium alginate and get sodium citrate until they can reliably show that the heavily promoted "hydrogel" via alginate does anything useful at all.

I believe this is the second or 3rd study I've seen where sodium alginate inclusion is tested against carbs + water, sans sodium, and then Maurten goes on to claim it's the alginate rather than the sodium. Convenient marketing since they're the only ones using alginate.

Sodium inclusion in the beverage in any form is likely to enhance gastric emptying rate compared to sugar water without sodium.

Don't get me wrong, Maurten is among the very best endurance-focused drink mixes available. Their marketing is absolutely the best. ;)

They're among the best beverages primarily because of their closer to 1:1 glucose:fructose ratio than other endurance products, not because of alginate.

PS. I think sodium citrate is marginally better than alginate due to osmolarity differences. I look forward to future studies on alginate. So far, no (meaningful) dice.

i started making my own mix with stuff off of amazon, but strictly for training. one of the trainer road guys posted on insta his ingredients for mock maurten. gotta say, for like 40 cents a bottle i love this stuff. ill still use maurten for racing, but for training im perfectly happy with homemade as i cant really tell any perceivable difference.

'21 Captex Tri / '21 Lubbock 70.3 / '22 Ironman Texas / '22 Ironman Cozumel

80/20 Endurance Ambassador
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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Alex I agree but I have been really put off by the price, it is really mental and to train properly for race day use + fuel for an Ironman means paying literally hundreds of dollars for what is literally little more than water + sugar. Have you looked at the OTE 80g mix or the Skratch superfule 100g mix? Any views on quality? I feel they are both in the realm of expensive but fair.

i do know your views on just using table sugar, I am just a bit lazy and never end up having enough time to buy sugar, use scales to mix citrate and sugar etc hence I just buy off the shelf. thanks!
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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I do not think that you can compare at all sodium alginate with sodium citrate!
Alginate is a thickening agent (coming originally from algae) and it seems that this gelification of the drink is reducing osmolarity issue (water comijg from your body to stomack) usually seen with higher sugar content drink!
Based on the feed back from some users of Maurtens it seems to work and instead of relying with water/iso + gels I can use Maurtens mix on the bike.
Yes it is expensive but it works.
I also have few friends who had hard time to get calories through gels who now use Maurten drinks as well
But nutrition is a personal situation
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [ppkestrel] [ In reply to ]
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ppkestrel wrote:
I do not think that you can compare at all sodium alginate with sodium citrate!
Alginate is a thickening agent (coming originally from algae) and it seems that this gelification of the drink is reducing osmolarity issue (water comijg from your body to stomack) usually seen with higher sugar content drink!
Based on the feed back from some users of Maurtens it seems to work and instead of relying with water/iso + gels I can use Maurtens mix on the bike.
Yes it is expensive but it works.
I also have few friends who had hard time to get calories through gels who now use Maurten drinks as well
But nutrition is a personal situation

I am aware it is a thickening agent.

Dr. Alex Harrison
______________________________________________________________________
YOUTUBE | LIFTING | RUNNING | NUTRITION | BOOK | NEWSLETTER
PhD Sport Physiology & Performance
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [ItaloBritt] [ In reply to ]
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ItaloBritt wrote:
Alex I agree but I have been really put off by the price, it is really mental and to train properly for race day use + fuel for an Ironman means paying literally hundreds of dollars for what is literally little more than water + sugar. Have you looked at the OTE 80g mix or the Skratch superfule 100g mix? Any views on quality? I feel they are both in the realm of expensive but fair.

i do know your views on just using table sugar, I am just a bit lazy and never end up having enough time to buy sugar, use scales to mix citrate and sugar etc hence I just buy off the shelf. thanks!

Me too re: price. You don't need scales. I don't use them. I just measure each time with measuring cups because i vary ratios and concentrations of my drinks as anyone should with regard to their training variables (duration, intensity) and expected sweat rate.

I often recommend specific grams of this or that but ranges will do just fine. I eyeball everything. In physiology close enough is close enough.

Make your own. It's painfully simple.

Tools you need: teaspoon, measuring cup. I also use a funnel for ease / speed.

If you're cost-concerned at all, and intending to fuel adequately, you should be making your own.

Dr. Alex Harrison
______________________________________________________________________
YOUTUBE | LIFTING | RUNNING | NUTRITION | BOOK | NEWSLETTER
PhD Sport Physiology & Performance
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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DrAlexHarrison wrote:
ItaloBritt wrote:
Alex I agree but I have been really put off by the price, it is really mental and to train properly for race day use + fuel for an Ironman means paying literally hundreds of dollars for what is literally little more than water + sugar. Have you looked at the OTE 80g mix or the Skratch superfule 100g mix? Any views on quality? I feel they are both in the realm of expensive but fair.

i do know your views on just using table sugar, I am just a bit lazy and never end up having enough time to buy sugar, use scales to mix citrate and sugar etc hence I just buy off the shelf. thanks!


Me too re: price. You don't need scales. I don't use them. I just measure each time with measuring cups because i vary ratios and concentrations of my drinks as anyone should with regard to their training variables (duration, intensity) and expected sweat rate.

I often recommend specific grams of this or that but ranges will do just fine. I eyeball everything. In physiology close enough is close enough.

Make your own. It's painfully simple.

Tools you need: teaspoon, measuring cup. I also use a funnel for ease / speed.

If you're cost-concerned at all, and intending to fuel adequately, you should be making your own.

Thank you for your thoughts on this.. where can I find a recipe/method pleasew?
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [Pmswanepoel] [ In reply to ]
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Pmswanepoel wrote:
Thank you for your thoughts on this.. where can I find a recipe/method pleasew?
Quick summary:
https://www.trainerroad.com/...8?u=dr_alex_harrison

Detailed how-to guide for intra-workout fueling: (scroll to near bottom)
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...t=last-7444621#first

Really spelling it out: HOW TO:
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...t_P7452851/#p7452851

Savings calculations for fun:
https://renaissanceperiodization.com/...intra-workout-drinks

Dr. Alex Harrison
______________________________________________________________________
YOUTUBE | LIFTING | RUNNING | NUTRITION | BOOK | NEWSLETTER
PhD Sport Physiology & Performance
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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DrAlexHarrison wrote:
Save money on sodium alginate and get sodium citrate until they can reliably show that the heavily promoted "hydrogel" via alginate does anything useful at all.

I believe this is the second or 3rd study I've seen where sodium alginate inclusion is tested against carbs + water, sans sodium, and then Maurten goes on to claim it's the alginate rather than the sodium. Convenient marketing since they're the only ones using alginate.

Sodium inclusion in the beverage in any form is likely to enhance gastric emptying rate compared to sugar water without sodium.

Don't get me wrong, Maurten is among the very best endurance-focused drink mixes available. Their marketing is absolutely the best. ;)

They're among the best beverages primarily because of their closer to 1:1 glucose:fructose ratio than other endurance products, not because of alginate.

PS. I think sodium citrate is marginally better than alginate due to osmolarity differences. I look forward to future studies on alginate. So far, no (meaningful) dice.
This is a good comment for several reasons.

Purposely or not you highlight the fact that Maurten doesn't even have "carb superiority" like what you should have if you use vitargo over a glucose/malto:fructose mix. Also, no need for a thickening add-on with vitargo.
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [Thorax] [ In reply to ]
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Anyone have an issue with purchased Maurten clogging bta bottles? I feel like it’s always a struggle to actually drink it out of my bta bottle and I’m wondering if it’s the mix or the bottle choice or user error?
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [damon.lebeouf] [ In reply to ]
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damon.lebeouf wrote:
DrAlexHarrison wrote:
Save money on sodium alginate and get sodium citrate until they can reliably show that the heavily promoted "hydrogel" via alginate does anything useful at all.

I believe this is the second or 3rd study I've seen where sodium alginate inclusion is tested against carbs + water, sans sodium, and then Maurten goes on to claim it's the alginate rather than the sodium. Convenient marketing since they're the only ones using alginate.

Sodium inclusion in the beverage in any form is likely to enhance gastric emptying rate compared to sugar water without sodium.

Don't get me wrong, Maurten is among the very best endurance-focused drink mixes available. Their marketing is absolutely the best. ;)

They're among the best beverages primarily because of their closer to 1:1 glucose:fructose ratio than other endurance products, not because of alginate.

PS. I think sodium citrate is marginally better than alginate due to osmolarity differences. I look forward to future studies on alginate. So far, no (meaningful) dice.


i started making my own mix with stuff off of amazon, but strictly for training. one of the trainer road guys posted on insta his ingredients for mock maurten. gotta say, for like 40 cents a bottle i love this stuff. ill still use maurten for racing, but for training im perfectly happy with homemade as i cant really tell any perceivable difference.

Do you mind sharing your recipe?
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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DrAlexHarrison wrote:
Pmswanepoel wrote:

Thank you for your thoughts on this.. where can I find a recipe/method pleasew?

Quick summary:
https://www.trainerroad.com/...8?u=dr_alex_harrison

Detailed how-to guide for intra-workout fueling: (scroll to near bottom)
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...t=last-7444621#first

Really spelling it out: HOW TO:
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...t_P7452851/#p7452851

Savings calculations for fun:
https://renaissanceperiodization.com/...intra-workout-drinks

Alex, (or anyone) can you clarify this for me? Say I wanted a 500 ml bottle (running vest)with ~300 calories and 1000g sodium.
your suggested ingredients would be ~80g of table sugar(sucrose), but how much sodium citrate? Can't seem to find the sodium(g): Sodium citrate(g) ratio.

Additionally, do you have any concern for the other big electrolytes, chloride and potassium? Say in a 100 mile race that will take 24 hours, is sodium citrate enough on the electrolyte front?
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [ADabs] [ In reply to ]
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Sodium Citrate has about 1000mg sodium per tsp. Table salt is about 2000mg sodium per tsp.

Sodium alone (via sodium citrate) appears to be sufficient. Sodium is all that I've seen good evidence for mattering. I've heard rumor of other stuff via podcasts etc... but until I see literature reporting anything else mattering, I'll assume it does not. Very anecdotally, my experience confirms this, as has that of a few hundred of my clients and readers online. If anything else "matters" it is utterly trivial by comparison to sodium.

There are tradeoffs of adding other things too. (osmolarity)

Dr. Alex Harrison
______________________________________________________________________
YOUTUBE | LIFTING | RUNNING | NUTRITION | BOOK | NEWSLETTER
PhD Sport Physiology & Performance
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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DrAlexHarrison wrote:
Pmswanepoel wrote:
Thank you for your thoughts on this.. where can I find a recipe/method pleasew?
Quick summary:
https://www.trainerroad.com/...8?u=dr_alex_harrison

Detailed how-to guide for intra-workout fueling: (scroll to near bottom)
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...t=last-7444621#first

Really spelling it out: HOW TO:
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...t_P7452851/#p7452851

Savings calculations for fun:
https://renaissanceperiodization.com/...intra-workout-drinks

Bumping this older thread to report that I have been using your recipe for a couple of months with very good results. Took a week or so to get used to the sweetness, but now I’m adjusted and enjoy the flavor. I’ve been able to up my carbs from approximately 70g/hr to nearly 100g/hr without any gastrointestinal issues. The savings to the bank account are nice as well! I appreciate you sharing your recipe and expertise here.
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [Parkland] [ In reply to ]
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Very cool! Glad to have helped.

Dr. Alex Harrison
______________________________________________________________________
YOUTUBE | LIFTING | RUNNING | NUTRITION | BOOK | NEWSLETTER
PhD Sport Physiology & Performance
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Re: Maurten Drink mix during IM Bike [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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I'll add that I discovered all the "homemade Maurten" threads after needing an affordable alternative for majorly extended weekly mileage...The last three weeks have been incredible. I do better with this mix than any other product.

I was also concerned about the sweetness and found the flavour of the recommended Gatorade a bit much especially longer sessions. I have cut the sweetness by adding some (real) lemon juice.

Thanks!

Group Eleven – Websites for Athletes / mikael.racing / @mstaer
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