Hmmm. Very different bikes. I do like both, but I think the tubing on the Caliente is not as intelligently designed as the tubing on the P2K.

Look at the design of the P2K: Every frame feature has a justifiable purpose. The Smartwall 2 tubing, the wheel cutout, the bottom bracket assembly, the chain stays... Also, the head tube is substanially lower enabling you to achieve a goot aerodynamic posture once you get used to riding that way.

Now, look at the desing of the Caliente. Don't get me wrong, I do think it is a solid bike. I sell them, which means I have to buy them first. However, the frame features of the Caliente are carbon chainstays and bladed tubing not designed the same way Cervelo designed theirs. Also, the down tube is not differentially butted with thicker walls at the side and thinner walls at the leading and trailing edge. Cervelo are, to my knowledge, the only guys doing this right now.

The Caliente is a good bike, but I think it is easier to argue the technological features and benefits of the P2K than it is the Caliente.

I can have any tri bike I want since I own a store that sells tri and road bikes, and right now this is what I have for tri bikes: Guru Trilite, Felt DA650, and a new P3 on the way. I guarantee you, I am a tough person to sell a bike to, and I don't buy by looks.

Good luck with either one!

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

Read Dan's review of the 2004 QR Tequilo. If I buying a new bike, that what I would get. The frame is very similar to the P2K and the bike retails for about $500 less than the P2K. All 3 are great bikes, but with the Tequilo you could buy the bike and have enough left over to buy some decent race wheels or enter an ironman.

John - I'll look at the review of the tequilo. You bring up a good point ...entering an ironman. Recently, while I was in a tri shop looking at a P2K, a shop member told me that a P2K would not be comfortable over the long haul of an ironman. It's best suited for sprints and 1/2 ironmon at best..??..
An ironman is not on my schedule for 2004, but 05 is a possibility if I can get reg'ed before the closing. And being a new dad, it's a good possibility that I'll be on a P2K for a few years. I know bike fit is going to play a major role in the comfort of the bike, but any comments on the P2K not being a comfort / good bike for the IM?

I just got my new P2K yesterday, FIST fitted. It feels great. Only had time for a 15 mile ride though before it got dark. But I did not feel like I was gettting beat up at all on the rough part of the ride. I'm coming from a steel frame not professionally fitted so I guess anything would feel better. Can't wait for some longer rides.

The P2K is plenty comfortable for an ironman. There are hundreds if not thousands of people riding ironmans on the P2K. The "aluminum bikes are harsh" argument is an old myth.

FWIW, I rode a Softride up until late this year. On an identical course and with similar training, I rode 10 minutes faster on my aluminum "hardtail" than on the Softride. Heck, I even cut 6 minutes off of my marathon after riding the hardtail. Most professional riders and triathletes use aluminum and they log way more miles than we do. Don't fear aluminum.

Your shop person is full of crap. The P2K and it's suitability for Ironman has been roundly discussed here many times. Do a search and you will find lots of information.

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clm
Nashville, TN
https://twitter.com/ironclm | http://ironclm.typepad.com

Tom, do you know the weight difference between the 2000 version and the 2004 version? I know "weight doesn't matter v. aerodynamics" but on group rides and hilly terrain it counts. (this is on the theory that my bodyweight will also be optimized ;-)) Thanks.

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Marty Gaal, CSCS
One Step Beyond Coaching
Triangle Open Water Swim Series | Old School Aquathon Series
Powerstroke® Freestyle Technique DVD

Quick, find a new shop as quickly as possible! This is so outragiously false that surely you won't do any further business there for fear of misdirection and wasted $$$!!! I am serious!

Good luck,

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David
* Ironman for Life! (Blog) * IM Everyday Hero Video * Daggett Shuler Law *
Disclaimer: I have personal and professional relationships with many athletes, vendors, and organizations in the triathlon world.

Anyone? Is the 2004 version lighter than the 2000 version, and if so, how much? Is an upgrade justifiable? thanks

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Marty Gaal, CSCS
One Step Beyond Coaching
Triangle Open Water Swim Series | Old School Aquathon Series
Powerstroke® Freestyle Technique DVD

Marty, I believe the weight is essentially the same between the 2 frames. The main difference would be the paint and the headset/headtube. The old paintjobs are more prone to chipping and damage than the new ones. But the new ones don't have that cool red color. The headset is now a 1-inch integrated which means you will have to use an integrated headset. There are arguments for and against integrated headsets.

If I were you, I would stick with what you have until it breaks. You seem to be doing pretty well on it.

Hi John, thanks!

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Marty Gaal, CSCS
One Step Beyond Coaching
Triangle Open Water Swim Series | Old School Aquathon Series
Powerstroke® Freestyle Technique DVD

I have the P2k and am very satisfied over my purchase (although I am still paying for it 9 months later on my credit card . . . but thats another post).

If you go with the P2K, here are a couple of upgrades that will really inhance your experience: 1) Azoto tri gel seat, 2) Carbon X bars, 3) Swap out the brake calipers and levers. These are not necessities. The bike and component group it comes with are great by themselves. I am just real happy with these upgrade decisions.

How it rides: climbing is surprisingly good for a tri bike. The ride is less harsh than my road bike ever was (2002 Raleigh R700). Overall, I love the geometry because of my build (short legs). As stated previously, the head tube is shorter than other bikes. Expect to use spacers if you're body is not used to such an agressive position. I've kept mine and as I gained flexibility and back strength through weight training, I go down one spacer. I like the flexibility too when I switch from long to short races.

Good luck for whatever bike you choose. Just remember, the P2K was such a popular bike there might actually be waiting lists to purchase one.

I have owned a P2K and before that the origonal P2.....my current bike is a Blade. The titanium (IMHO) is far more comfortable than the aluminum. That being said, the geometry of my frames is a bit different.....the Blade being a little more relaxed. That may have a play here also.....

Sam
www.sambean.com

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I shall never misuse Rex Kwon Do
I shall be a champion of freedom and justice

Yesterday must've been a good day. I got my P2K too!!!

Only the frame tho'. Building it up as I go. Some used but much love parts including 8 Speed grip ship aero shifters (stop laughing, I like them). and my beloved Profile Carbon Stryke bars (best bar ever?) and some necessary carry overs from my old bike, for now (wheels)

It's off at the painters right now being turned into a RED rocket (came a horrible blue colour), so I haven't ridden it yet. Sure hope it's comfy for 180km though, since I WILL be riding it in IMNZ in about 7 weeks. I will let you all know :-)

TriDork

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TriDork

"Happiness is a myth. All you can hope for is to get laid once in a while, drunk once in a while and to eat chocolate every day"

The p2k is fantastic. Buy it so I can sit and fume and childishly hate you. It will be fun!

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customerjon @gmail.com is where information happens.