As long as you only have one gear... it's always the right gear.

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My Blog - http://leegoocrap.blogspot.com

It's just a guess until he tries, and the track can account for 2-3k (Indoor, outdoor, pressure, temp) but I think with 4-6 weeks prep he likely could go about 50k in Canada. Maybe another 1500 meters with many months, and more invested, just a guess though due to so many variables.

Dan mentioned rigging the road machine (Speedmax?) up for fixed gear, I think it has vertical dropouts so to do this he'd have to just get lucky with the gear ratio and chain length. A chain tensioner in an HR is a bad idea IMHO. Maybe they'll do what they did with Jens on his road SpeedConcept a few years ago by just cutting out the dropouts, and having a carbon frame builder put some horizontal dropouts on the road tt bike, that's not that hard to do these days with all the carbon fabrication options that are around.

Most hour records end up averaging 100-105 cadence, I'd guess he'd go a lot lower, I think both of Obree's records were significantly lower. I haven't studied his power profile, but I'm guessing he'd shoot for around 90 rpm based on watching him race tris, which would probably be faster than his normal high-power FTP cadence during intervals. Just something to look at, and another reason why having horizontal dropouts would be important so he could play with a single tooth on the front chainring until he has the cadence dialed in.

Reach-wise he's not so tall, so that shouldn't be an issue WITH the seat in a UCI legal position. I see this likely being the biggest challenge, people who learned to ride in a "tri position" often have big trouble sliding their seat 4-7cm back and producing power there while staying aero. It looks to me like he sits forward, and even was quite forward in his Mt. Lemon KOM attempt on his road bike sitting up higher. People who learned to ride bikes with a 73 degree angle road bike, often have less trouble producing power in a rearward position. Ironically, couldn't that hurdle be solely attributable to Dan with his advent of steep aero bikes?

This guy is a great character, I'm looking forward to him going for it and to follow along. I'm hoping he does a video or two showing his preparations and challenges he encounters along the way. With no triathlon racing on the 2020 horizon, and a record that is well within reach, I think he has more reasons to go for it than not to.

I also don't think dual discs would be a forgone conclusion. Obree broke the record on dual Specialized Tri-spokes (the mold became the HED 3), Boardman broke the record his first time on dual Corima 4-spokes, which I think were aerodynamically significantly slower than the Specialized 3-spokes. I have a set right here, and they look slower!

Boardman did the 56k Superman record on a Mavic io 5-spoke front, and that was over 56k an hour.

I've ridden dual discs on the track and on the road, and even on the track a front disc has a very odd feeling that takes some getting used to. I think it's like a sail and even the broad turns on a 250 meter track, you have to push a little to get it to change direction. It was always surprising to me that even indoors on a velodrome a front disc tracks significantly differently from a 90mm front wheel. I'd recommend he just go with a super-aero front wheel, he'll probably save more in not worrying about it and a more efficient line, than he would by the maybe 2-3 watts saved. Clinchers would be my option too, they just roll faster and you could run much lower pressure. (120 probably, instead of 200psi)

I need to just go ahead and buy a hub kit. My Felt DA has horizontal dropouts with that little set screw in it. Hmmmm.

Somewhere like Milton you definitely want tubulars and high pressure.

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My Blog - http://leegoocrap.blogspot.com

I spent a week once in Manchester with Fitwerx Dean talking aero and racing track, he was running a Zipp disc/808 set up on the track with supersonic clinchers/latex at 120 psi. He had figured the dual Mavic Comete set-up with 200 psi latex tubs would give him ~2 seconds in a 3k pursuit putting him under the world record. A lot of this was based on them being "the standard" for all records, Wiggins hour, pretty much what everyone uses, not any actual data.

He finally talked his wife into letting him snag a set, got them set up, and went to work testing them comprehensively like everything else he's done for 15 years. It turns out they were the same or slightly slower than his Zipps, I think he covers this in his blog on their website. Mind you, this is on a perfectly smooth wooden track where world records are set. It goes to show you just never know, but the conclusion I drew was that the Zipp disc/808 set up is VERY fast with good tires. Way closer than either of us thought!

Wouldnt higher pressure and something like 19mm tires be better on a track?

Compared to the fastest modern clinchers with latex it's a watt or two at most from the testing I've seen. One argument could be a tubular is better to ride out with a flat, but I can't imagine a 150 gram tubular at 200psi would be much better on a wheel than a lightweight clincher, and that's fairly unlikely to happen on a velodrome. Data I've seen and my experience, would be that he'd be much better off running Zipp wheels disc/808 with the fastest tires and latex at 120psi. I think the give and higher volume tire at 120 psi should help overall fatigue too, rather than riding a tire that has zero give, over hundreds of turns. He should also hire/consult with Dean at Fitwerx. All IMHO of course...

:D

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AeroCoach UK
http://www.aero-coach.co.uk

Sanders is still listed as his athlete. Anyone know if Lionel is still working with his coach for all his covid craziness? Between zwifting, the hour record and trying to PB in a 5km, I wonder how much his coach is onboard for.

First video up. Alex Dowsett offered help in the comments section. Hopefully Lionel takes him up on that.

On board for all of it. We talk, he listens, we debate, we plan accordingly and we focus on "low hanging fruit" and keeping it enjoyable for Lionel without getting carried away with too much marginal gain stuff (and thereby losing sight of just training consistently and sensibly).

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David T-D
http://www.tilburydavis.com

Nicely made video, they kept it exciting...Thought he was going to do it on 90 psi gatorskins and deep rims until the last second when he finally mentions double discs!

I was almost at the point of recommending this second hsnd bike on ebay...
https://m.ebay.nl/...wBanner=1&_rdt=1

the guy is an powerhouse would be cool if he gets it!

I suggested gatorskins in case of splinters but he fought me on my wisdom......

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David T-D
http://www.tilburydavis.com

When is it happening and where ?

David - Lionel's bike position in races last year - Los Cabos and Challenge Daytona - looked really good and comfortable. This is completely different - is it in order to meet UCI regs? If you can share...

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DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!

I don't think he has announced when but maybe David can shed a little light on that. I think they have mentioned where but I honestly don't remember. I know it's in Canada.

It is a mixture of the size of the "track converted" Canyon Speedmax Lionel explains history of and UCI regulations.

As for where, when. Milton Velodrome where he is testing is the plan and at some point in next few weeks, scheduling dependent.

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David T-D
http://www.tilburydavis.com

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I am huge Lionel fan, love his videos and behind the scenes look at the build up, but good god it’s painful sometimes watching him experiment with some of this stuff. People have been doing the science behind hour records for a long time, sooo many knowledgeable people out there and just hope he’s talking to some of them and listening to advice.

If track time is limited, do you really need to waste time testing if the red line is slower than the black? It’s a bigger circumference, Longer distance, of course it’s slower! Hell, just pull up video of Wiggins, he did a pretty good job of it. Testing whether head up or turtling is faster? Argh.

Still waiting to get the right gear for training? Lionel, there is a huge track community around here. Quick post on the local track Facebook group and 7,8 people would be rushing down the to track to hook you up and help you out! I bet Veal would be one of the first.

We’re all cheering you on, just please don’t try to reinvent this. Sooo many people that know all the science inside and out would love to help, use it!

I was hoping that was the venue as I live in Milton and I would love to watch this attempt .
Please could you post when you know the date and time .

Isn’t this consistent with how he approaches everything?

You’re right. But, He wanted to ensure he does the right things but knowing exactly what doing the wrong things will cost him. I actually found that to be sound reasoning and perfectly logical experiment that makes a lot of sense.

tilburs wrote:

I suggested gatorskins in case of splinters but he fought me on my wisdom......

The target is 49.431...anything less and Eddy say's its unacceptable






Chris Boardman says 49.431 is not fast enough...its 49.441

DTD can you comment on why he is training to break the hour record on the bike and simultaneously training to break his 5k PR? It seems they would cannibalize each other if truly going all out for both. Also, how’s his swim going these days, he hasn’t mentioned it in a while. If his swim is decent he should be in good shape for Daytona.

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Let food be thy medicine...