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Re: LIONEL VS JAN. the semi-official race day thread [Adman] [ In reply to ]
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Adman wrote:
BigBoyND wrote:
bluefever wrote:
I feel bad for him [..] to be a performing monkey and stroke Frodeno's ego


That's quite the post you've got there. The saddest thing in this thread is seeing just how miserable some people can get.


Looking likely the Norwegians will be going for Frankfurt rather than Copenhagen so potentially good for Lionel.

I'm assuming you found an article with this. I still see Blum on the start list for Copenhagen at Trirating.com, not in Germany.
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Re: LIONEL VS JAN. the semi-official race day thread [CementBottle] [ In reply to ]
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CementBottle wrote:
The Guardian wrote:
lyla wrote:
Imagine that, professionalism and attention to detail. Frodeno has a physio that lives with him for crying out loud! It is a two gold medalist household! Obsessively scribbling every single workout or doing calculations to the nth degree is not exactly this type of attention to detail. Keeping a manchild as your Bundini Brown may be great for YouTube but is not the same kind of team. Frodeno is a one of a kind and maybe Sanders does learn from observing and though he may not close the gap to Frodeno he can widen the gap to the chasing pack, many of which are aging, and the up and comers like Long. Keeping DTD is a must to maintain continuity and to progress off of that rather than self-sabotage. I wish him luck as he has plenty of prime years.


I think Jan is very unusual in how professional he, and his team, is. In amateur sport it isn't typical to run one's career like a high level business or pro sports team. There are outliers, but look at most endurance athlete vlogs - they basically live and train like college students. It is the rare few at the top of these sports that create a team and a lifestyle that goes beyond just training a lot.

In that regard, I think you are right - this was a huge opportunity for Lionel to realise that his small team can be much more.

I think Lionel is already very good at seeing the bigger career picture - his collaboration with Talbot has been huge and Lionel has been thinking outside the box in bringing other athletes into his videos and promotions.

I was skeptical about the whole tri battle, but seeing that Lionel saw it as an opportunity to network with Jan and also to set Jan up as a bit of a mentor, I thought it was a very shrewd move.


+1 on this. What I said was the BEST thing Lionel could get out of the Tri-Battle would be to see Jan up front and personal, and get a feel for his approach, preparation, his team, his professionalism. Hopefully Jan gave Lionel a few tidbits of advice.

Can't remember what video is was just before tri battle but Jan kinda hinted that Lionel was on the cusp of discovering his potential at the full distance and seemed to know what the missing element was but obviously he's not going to say anything until he retires. Would be funny if Lionel hired Jan as a consultant after he retired.
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Re: LIONEL VS JAN. the semi-official race day thread [WHITEJM74] [ In reply to ]
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WHITEJM74 wrote:
CementBottle wrote:
The Guardian wrote:
lyla wrote:
Imagine that, professionalism and attention to detail. Frodeno has a physio that lives with him for crying out loud! It is a two gold medalist household! Obsessively scribbling every single workout or doing calculations to the nth degree is not exactly this type of attention to detail. Keeping a manchild as your Bundini Brown may be great for YouTube but is not the same kind of team. Frodeno is a one of a kind and maybe Sanders does learn from observing and though he may not close the gap to Frodeno he can widen the gap to the chasing pack, many of which are aging, and the up and comers like Long. Keeping DTD is a must to maintain continuity and to progress off of that rather than self-sabotage. I wish him luck as he has plenty of prime years.


I think Jan is very unusual in how professional he, and his team, is. In amateur sport it isn't typical to run one's career like a high level business or pro sports team. There are outliers, but look at most endurance athlete vlogs - they basically live and train like college students. It is the rare few at the top of these sports that create a team and a lifestyle that goes beyond just training a lot.

In that regard, I think you are right - this was a huge opportunity for Lionel to realise that his small team can be much more.

I think Lionel is already very good at seeing the bigger career picture - his collaboration with Talbot has been huge and Lionel has been thinking outside the box in bringing other athletes into his videos and promotions.

I was skeptical about the whole tri battle, but seeing that Lionel saw it as an opportunity to network with Jan and also to set Jan up as a bit of a mentor, I thought it was a very shrewd move.


+1 on this. What I said was the BEST thing Lionel could get out of the Tri-Battle would be to see Jan up front and personal, and get a feel for his approach, preparation, his team, his professionalism. Hopefully Jan gave Lionel a few tidbits of advice.


Can't remember what video is was just before tri battle but Jan kinda hinted that Lionel was on the cusp of discovering his potential at the full distance and seemed to know what the missing element was but obviously he's not going to say anything until he retires. Would be funny if Lionel hired Jan as a consultant after he retired.

Man I'd like to see that video. That would be so cool if Lionel hires Jan as a consultant, Lionel would definitely follow whatever Jan would tell him, that you could put money on.
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Re: LIONEL VS JAN. the semi-official race day thread [CementBottle] [ In reply to ]
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Looks like I didn't hear it myself and was a little off on the details. Either way, Jan gives me the impression he knows what Lionel needs to do better.

post #118 in this thread. I asked for a translation of the German Jan video further up on that page and the person replied to me

"He picked Lionel because he is the one person who can bring the same performance levels in a 1 vs 1 situation as in another race with groups. He also talks about how Lionel has a lot of potential in long distance tri and if and when he figures it out, he will be really dangerous to everyone."
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Re: LIONEL VS JAN. the semi-official race day thread [Lacticturkey] [ In reply to ]
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Once again, I don't know if I should believe everything Lionel said in the video because at times he's just trying to be too Lionel-y.

What stands out in particular is his confession that, since St. George, he hasn't biked at 320 watts (his target IM intensity) or higher. It's because - and this is even more bizarre - he chose to train outside only in Arizona, and it is ungodly hot outside in Arizona (no surprise there).

Fuck me - how are you supposed to hold 320 watts for 4 hours if you never get to 320 watts?

There's a good reason everybody and their mother will tell you heat adaptation shouldn't be the ONLY mode of training you do.

That's why I'm wondering if he's pulling our leg. This guy is obsessive, but he's also intelligent. And if @tilburs is still on board, as he seems to be, this is even weirder.

"FTP is a bit 2015, don't you think?" - Gustav Iden
Last edited by: kajet: Jul 29, 21 13:40
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Re: LIONEL VS JAN. the semi-official race day thread [kajet] [ In reply to ]
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I don’t take anything Lionel says literally, but I take it seriously.

Im sure he hasn’t literally stopped doing intervals. He spends time above 320 w.

I assume he just hasn’t been able to hold 320+ or 330 or whatever outside in 110* Tucson heat on the longer stuff at race hr/rpe.

And he thought he’d get some kind of power boost coming down from heat/ translation where the 305 in Tucson translated to 320 or 330 in good weather. I think he realized that cardiovascular wise— sure.

But there’s a muscular and a KJ cost to 4 hrs at 330 that you don’t train for holding 305 in your IM specific training, heat or not.

That’s what my Lionel decoder ring says, anyways, watching the latest vid.
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Re: LIONEL VS JAN. the semi-official race day thread [kajet] [ In reply to ]
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kajet wrote:
Once again, I don't know if I should believe everything Lionel said in the video because at times he's just trying to be too Lionel-y.

What stands out in particular is his confession that, since St. George, he hasn't biked at 320 watts (his target IM intensity) or higher. It's because - and this is even more bizarre - he chose to train outside only in Arizona, and it is ungodly hot outside in Arizona (no surprise there).

Fuck me - how are you supposed to hold 320 watts for 4 hours if you never get to 320 watts?

There's a good reason everybody and their mother will tell you heat adaptation shouldn't be the ONLY mode of training you do.

That's why I'm wondering if he's pulling our leg. This guy is obsessive, but he's also intelligent. And if @tilburs is still on board, as he seems to be, this is even weirder.


Uh, because if you somewhere else where it isn't 115F you'll be able to push more power.

Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.
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Re: LIONEL VS JAN. the semi-official race day thread [BigBoyND] [ In reply to ]
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it doesn't come across as miserable to me at all. I agree with the post and also feel somewhat awkward seeing Lionel do this stuff where he's obviously not too comfortable. Most of the Lionel fans are fans for their own selfish reasons, they can identify with him to carry own themselves.
He does look wiped out, overtrained and its just a matter of time before he breaks. the Lionel fans will just move on and find another hero.
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Re: LIONEL VS JAN. the semi-official race day thread [Gearup] [ In reply to ]
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Did you read the part I responded to? I cropped it to be clear what I was referring to
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