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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [davejustdave] [ In reply to ]
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Ya early 90's sometime, Dan would know when exactly as he put the race on!! And the other one was in 87 I think, and to this day it is about as big as I have ever seen oceanside pier break. Literally waves over the end of the pier, it was a sight to behold, and a race for the ages. Just no way a race like that ever happens again, and like I said, even 1/3 of that surf gets race swims cancelled.

#lovetheolddays
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [monty] [ In reply to ]
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monty wrote:
Ya early 90's sometime, Dan would know when exactly as he put the race on!! And the other one was in 87 I think, and to this day it is about as big as I have ever seen oceanside pier break. Literally waves over the end of the pier, it was a sight to behold, and a race for the ages. Just no way a race like that ever happens again, and like I said, even 1/3 of that surf gets race swims cancelled.

#lovetheolddays

That's exactly what I was worrying about. Even if the surf is 3 feet, they would either cancel the swim, or shorten it. As One of those people who's a strong swimmer and crappy Runner, I really hope this doesn't become an excuse to kill the swim
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [TulkasTri] [ In reply to ]
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Things like this that put the "MAN" back into Ironman makes me smile :)
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [TrierinKC] [ In reply to ]
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TrierinKC wrote:
Things like this that put the "MAN" back into Ironman makes me smile :)


Except it’s not an Ironman

And it will result in cancelled swims. Guaranteed
Last edited by: ChrisM: Jan 12, 18 17:09
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [TulkasTri] [ In reply to ]
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Check out Carlsbad Open Water swim group on meetup or TCSD for ocean swims. Several weekly ocean swims are offered.
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [davejustdave] [ In reply to ]
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That's exactly what I was worrying about. Even if the surf is 3 feet, they would either cancel the swim, or shorten it.//

Well it all depends on the RD, not sure who it is. And really no reason to shorten the swim, because if it is too bad to go through the surf, it would just move inside like it has always been. They would just lose the point to point nature of the race and the surf entry, which would be too bad, but as long as they had the old swim at least it is still a triathlon...
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [davejustdave] [ In reply to ]
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Why wouldn’t they just go back to old course? I think that is easier than cancelling it
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [anthonypat] [ In reply to ]
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anthonypat wrote:
There was a warm up area, but hard to get to with all the timed groups lined up.

I guess my information was a bit out of date, I haven't been there since 2005.
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [davejustdave] [ In reply to ]
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davejustdave wrote:
I remember my wave going off right as a set was starting to come in. It was hilarious. After the first 6 footer rolled over my wave, I remember popping out the back, looking left, not seening a single person, looking right, and seeing two other guys, and the entire rest of our wave had gotten washed back about 50 yards.

I was a ocean lifeguard at the time, turned out so were the other two guys that made it through the back of that set.

I didn't do my first triathlon until I was 35 but duck diving waves is a skill I've had since I was a kid... and I'm not even a surfer or waterman, just some random kid who grew up near the ocean. So I'm somewhat less than empathetic when I hear anxiety about the surf... it's something you can learn how to do in 5 minutes.

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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [TulkasTri] [ In reply to ]
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Works for me!

Jimmy
http://www.Riccitello.com
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [ericMPro] [ In reply to ]
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ericMPro wrote:
davejustdave wrote:
I remember my wave going off right as a set was starting to come in. It was hilarious. After the first 6 footer rolled over my wave, I remember popping out the back, looking left, not seening a single person, looking right, and seeing two other guys, and the entire rest of our wave had gotten washed back about 50 yards.

I was a ocean lifeguard at the time, turned out so were the other two guys that made it through the back of that set.

I didn't do my first triathlon until I was 35 but duck diving waves is a skill I've had since I was a kid... and I'm not even a surfer or waterman, just some random kid who grew up near the ocean. So I'm somewhat less than empathetic when I hear anxiety about the surf... it's something you can learn how to do in 5 minutes.

I think it's the fear factor. YOU know it's not a big deal. I know it's not a big deal, but until people experience, actually experience in the real world, how easy it is to get underneath a big wave, it's intimidating.

As you said, you grew up near the ocean. I was the same way. All I can remember is my dad and my grandfather taking me out in big waves.

It's got to be way different for somebody who grew up in a landlocked area.


That or people are just generally skittish cowards. I prefer to think it's the former
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [monty] [ In reply to ]
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monty wrote:
That's exactly what I was worrying about. Even if the surf is 3 feet, they would either cancel the swim, or shorten it.//

Well it all depends on the RD, not sure who it is. And really no reason to shorten the swim, because if it is too bad to go through the surf, it would just move inside like it has always been. They would just lose the point to point nature of the race and the surf entry, which would be too bad, but as long as they had the old swim at least it is still a triathlon...

If it all depends on the RD, then I'm hoping the RD has a serious set of balls on him/her, and it's 10 ft with sets pushing 15. Got to maximize my strong points :-)
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [davejustdave] [ In reply to ]
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Actually don’t the lifeguards make the final call in a situation like this? I don’t really know but imagine they’d have a big say.

It’s also one thing for any of us that have done a lot of surf entries, a different animal for guards that’s have to watch out for 2k people with limited resources.

I race in so cal and every beach start has a good share of folks getting pulled out and dragged back on the skid. Even in small surf.
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [ChrisM] [ In reply to ]
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ChrisM wrote:
Actually don’t the lifeguards make the final call in a situation like this? I don’t really know but imagine they’d have a big say.

It’s also one thing for any of us that have done a lot of surf entries, a different animal for guards that’s have to watch out for 2k people with limited resources.

I race in so cal and every beach start has a good share of folks getting pulled out and dragged back on the skid. Even in small surf.

IM has plenty of dough to hire extra water safety. Plus any gaurd worth their salt can cover several thousand trained swimmers.. remember, the oside LGs are trained pros. They can handle it. On a daily basis all summer long those guys and gals cover several thousand people ranging from exepert swimmers to complete non swimmers in all sizes of surf.

IM should be a piece of cake
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [monty] [ In reply to ]
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monty wrote:
SO that is the same swim as the short Tiki swim, thats great. Of course it would be best to have to come back in through the surf, but one way is better than no way. And surf could be 1 ft or 8 ft that time of year. There have been two triathlons over the ages that had some pretty big surf. In the 80's there was the Triterium where the waves were breaking over the end of the oceanside pier. It was a pro/elite race only and still a lot of people did not finish the two lap swim.

And I think one year when Dan brought back the old USTS series they had a swim on the outside and it was pretty big too. Of course don't worry folks, if it even got 1/3 of those old swims it would be cancelled, so good chance it will be a duathlon now. At least in the harbor there was always a guaranteed swim. Guessing they want a one way swim to reduce the bottleneck at that tiny boat ramp. Makes sense to do this one way for sure...

Don't forget Carlsbad Tri. I don't think there's ever been a swim cancelled there and I've gone through easily double-overhead waves there. Not so bad getting out, it's getting in, keeping an eye on what's about to hammer you!

(I so want to get back into Oceanside 70.3, and now with this swim, all that much more.)

Proud member of FISHTWITCH: doing a bit more than fish exercise now.
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [ericMPro] [ In reply to ]
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How to duck dive:
1. Begin dive before the break lands on you

Here's a good video of Superfrog surf entry and you can see some people pushing under and thru the waves, some are trying to stroke thru the wave and others are taking the wave straight in the chest.

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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [TulkasTri] [ In reply to ]
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Nervous too--really have anxiety with surf after getting stuck in a huge shore break in Maui once. Guess I better get practicing soon!
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [TulkasTri] [ In reply to ]
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I think this is a dangerous move and serious risk by the organizer. I have done oceanside 4-5 times and several other 70.3s and IMs but never done a true ocean swim - not in a race and not in practice. While I'm all for making courses more exciting I find it concerning this change is announced less than 3 months from race day, in winter when it will be very difficult for many people to go and learn how to swim in the ocean and navigate the waves. There isn't that much time to go to the coast and learn and some will totally underestimate the ocean entry. I think there is going to be some major discussion around liability when things go wrong.
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [Benv] [ In reply to ]
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Totally agree.. why was this not made public way sooner? It could be a nightmare for those without any opportunity to practice?
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [Jhamlet] [ In reply to ]
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It will be a clusterfuck. Next year the swim will go back to how it was. Giving weak tri swimmers this swim would be like expecting amateurs to descend the crazy Giro courses, or run in Death Valley. Guaranteed some people wouldn't have signed up if they knew the swim course was going to be this.

I surf so I don't care. But some people will find themselves at the mercy of waves unable to get out of it. It will all depend on surf that day.
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [Benv] [ In reply to ]
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Thankyou. I completely agree. I live in a landlocked area and while I can swim in a lake or river, I've never swam in an ocean. I talked with several about the Oceanside swim before signing up, and was reassured it was a protected swim in the harbor. So-- my husband and I are making a vacation of it. Flying out to SD for a week, rental car up to Oceanside; bike coming by tri bike transport... only to find out now I have to swim in the surf??? Suddenly now I am worried, and need to find time to get down to Florida (8 hour drive) to practice.... I'm so disappointed. Yes I'd like to embrace my fear and conquer the ocean swim. But now I'm also aware I may DNF if the surf freaks the shit out of me.
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [monty] [ In reply to ]
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monty wrote:


And I think one year when Dan brought back the old USTS series they had a swim on the outside and it was pretty big too. Of course don't worry folks, if it even got 1/3 of those old swims it would be cancelled, so good chance it will be a duathlon now. At least in the harbor there was always a guaranteed swim. Guessing they want a one way swim to reduce the bottleneck at that tiny boat ramp. Makes sense to do this one way for sure...


I remember the USTS Oceanside race (in 1999?) waiting for my wave to start and seeing the 8 foot sets rolling in. Having grown up playing in the surf at Huntington, Bolsa Chica and Seal (about 60 miles north), I thought, "This will make it interesting".....The guy standing next to me had traveled from Wisconsin and had never seen the ocean before. About a minute before we were going to go he said, "Screw it", walked back to the transition area and left. Getting out was a little rough. but it was fun coming back in

The variability and what the day may bring are part of the fun of triathlon, but I understand that safety of participants has to be considered.

I was at IM Utah in 2002, when the cancelled the swim in the middle of the swim. The wind swell made it feel like you were trying to get out past the break the entire time you were in the water. Sighting was terrible because of the swell, buoys were blown out of position and you couldn't tell where to go. I was in the water for almost an hour because I didn't want to get in a rescue boat for fear I'd be DQ'ed, and I ended up swimming back to shore. There was a fatality that day, and resulting changes to swim safety protocols.

Given today's safety environment, I would expect that if it's over about 3 feet that day, the swim would be canceled or moved back to the harbor.

The thing is, everyone is coming from a different set of experiences and situations. For those of us living near the ocean, an ocean swim is no big deal. If you haven't ever been to the ocean, I could understand how it could be intimidating.


If it came down to it, I would not be interested in a 2100 (or 4200) yard pool swim, 56 (or 112) mile trainer ride, and 13.1 (or 26.2) mile treadmill run. It would be really safe though....;)
Last edited by: ibjeff: Jan 15, 18 6:22
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [Dilbert] [ In reply to ]
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Dilbert wrote:
It will be a clusterfuck. Next year the swim will go back to how it was. Giving weak tri swimmers this swim would be like expecting amateurs to descend the crazy Giro courses, or run in Death Valley. Guaranteed some people wouldn't have signed up if they knew the swim course was going to be this.


I'm signed up for Oceanside and I'll swim in whatever. I don't care.

My concern is this decision could lead to a swim cancellation or shortened swim. I hope their contingency is to go with the old course if necessary.

I'm not an experienced ocean swimmer, with my only similar experience really being IMFL 2x, but I'm up for anything. That stated, it's pretty shitty to spring the ocean swim on people less than three months from race day. A friend of mine is also doing the race and I don't think this news was much appreciated by her at all. She's going to worry about it and my guess is that she would not have registered for the race had this been the swim course of record at the time.

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Last edited by: The GMAN: Jan 15, 18 6:30
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [LuckyLo] [ In reply to ]
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I hate the ocean. I've done plenty of ocean swims and have gone through waves many times. That doesn't mean I like the ocean. So, hearing the news makes me very nervous.

Watching this video, though, gives me some peace of mind knowing that I'm not as bad as they are at getting through the waves.
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Re: Ironman changes swim course for IM 70.3 Oceanside [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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The setup logistics would not (IMO) allow for a morning-of race day call to move the swim into the harbor. Maybe, but doubt it as it’s quite controlled and has to be set up.

If the surf is big(ish) the swim will cancel
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