Well good morning sunshine!! Have you not noticed the increasing number of races requiring qualification? (IMW, IMC, IMH, Alcatraz.....)

But then we'd never have the JohnnyO.

---

____________________________________________________
"don't you know that slow is the new fast? :)" -Turtlegirl
"I'm not a Dr., I just played one with your mom...." Stallion1031

i like the idea of qualifying for an IM race by doing halfs first and what not. Something to really strive towards. But i would hate to see them try and make everyone race an official 70.3 race in order to qualify for an IM. That would suck.

Question for you. What makes you think that the folks that run Ironman are interested in weeding people out and raising the level of competition? The complaints are from the aspiring participants and not the company. HOWEVER, as long as folks lay down the credit card nothing will change. A solution is for you to not sign up, look at ironman.com, or watch it on NBC. Apparantly you are in the minority in your thinking. Otherwise, they would have done this years ago.

Ironman is a business and business is GOOD! Why change a good business?

You said it.

People stopped respecting the distance a long time ago.

---

Matt Amman

I like the idea of qualifying. I would have enjoyed the process of training for and racing a 1/2IM with that goal in mind, knowing that if I wanted Ironman, I'd have to earn it the hard way. As previously stated, there's absolutely no incentive for IMNA or WTC to do this, but from a competitor's perspective, it would make the title of Ironman even more elusive and desirable, for what it's worth.

---

The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

"...should be entitled..."

Here's we're you're off base. No one is "entitled". It's first come first serve and why shouldn't it be?

I think a good business model would somehow give preference to those that are shown to be more competitive as, and I guess here, that those that are competitive are more than likely repeat customers. I would think it might make sense, in order to not piss good customers off, that a qualifing time would get you a registration prior to "open" registration.

Again however there is no impotice or reason for an RD or organization to do this, other than possibly good customer service.

Other than that, every man/woman for themselves.

~Matt

"Do you honestly think someone who runs a 31 minute 5K should be entitled a spot to IM Florida over a someone who goes under 5 hours in a Half IM? Just because he had a better faster Internet connection?"

In a word, yes.

Just like most things in this world, we are not "entitled" to anything. I run a much faster 5K than the person you know, but I don't have $450 to drop on a race. Does that mean I should be "entitled" to a spot even though he has the money to do it? Heck no!

Maybe this person you know will get in train hard and get in good enough shape to compete up to whatever standards you think are good enough. Maybe the person will freak out in the water and quit after swimming 10 minutes. Regardless, it's his money and time and he should have the right to do whatever he wants.

Completing an Ironman means many things to many people. However, it is a business to the people who run Ironman. I am sure that it will remain as is until people stop signing up because of the current structure. Otherwise, the race won't be on the course. The real race will be this Sunday when everyone tries to sign up.

I personally would love to see some requirements put in place for some of the more desireable races (IMLP, IMC) simply because it might increase my chances to get in. :-)

i had an interesting conversation with a fellow Masters swimmer yesterday after our workout. She is 21 and a collegiate water polo player (who swims with us off-season to stay in shape). She also has done a couple sprint tris. She said that she can't envision herself doing an IM simply because of the cost....even though she would like to. And she had never heard of any of the independant IM races that many of us would recommend as an alternative. To her IM and M-Dot races are one and the same. Just an anecdote....but symptomatic of the issue that WTC will be facing as the demographic of IM participants gets older (and wealthier)...there are not a lot of young people entering the sport. When I did IMLP in 99, entry fee was under $200....which then was a lot for me, I was 28 and not making a ton of $$. If the entry was what it is today( i.e nearly $500), I could have not afforded to race.

---

__________________
JP

my twitter feed

That just doesn't make any business sense to put requirements on the races that already exist, when they can keep adding races until they feel a saturation point has been reached. And we don't seem very close to that seeing how Louisville filled up in 8 days.

Now if I get shut out of Registering for IMFL 07 I will come back and revise this post :]

Mark

---

http://www.mctriguy.blogspot.com

Why? They get the $$ up front either way, and have decided they're going to be there until midnight on race night anyway. They've appealed to the masses, and have a more successful business model than most buisnesses dream of. Take your anger to a non IMNA race if you feel that way.

Get off your high horse. If you want a different set of rules regarding sign-up, then get your pro card.

I agree it is damn good business and would give back the prestige to Ironman races b/c frankly, if a 31 minute 5K guy is doing an Ironman, Ironman loses it's prestige, competitiveness, and reputation for being a race for a fit triathlete

Okay, I'll bite: how does a 5k time indicate *anyone's* level of preparedness for an IM?

This 31-minute 5k guy---is that the only race he's ever done?

I like the discussion, however, how come whenever this topic comes up people keep bringing up the "it's a business" stuff. Yes, it is a business - I think we all "get" that!

Let's talk about solutions and not "it's a business".

I like the idea about giving preference to prior IM participants / finishers. Just give these people a 1-2 hour head start when online registration opens...then open the gates to all-comers. Seems only fair. The repeat IM racers, shall I say, the hardcore racers, should be taken care of. The "one timers" can still get their shot too.

I have not done an IM yet, but I did do a 1/2 this summer, and I am planning on beating a path to IMFL reg with the rest of the hopeful.

I like the idea of qualifing for IM distance races as a way to keep some of the luster on them, but agree witht he others that as long as WTC is a for profit company you will more likely see the trend in the other direction - more races, slower overall times, and an open invitation from WTC that says "got $500 come be and Ironman!" The likely direction is going to be more coddling, more crowded races and higher profits for RD's bike/componant companies and the rest of the supporting crew. None of the people involved in the sport want to make it for exceptional athletes. They want to make it available to EVERYONE.

If you really want to make it easier to get into races, I think you woudl have more luck waving the banner for more races across the country. If there were 20 IM distance races across the US and Canada I would think that everbody tat wanted to race MDot coudl get into a race. Now if you must race at a given venue, be prepared to take a sick day to sit in front of your computer screen with everyone else.

-Added- What I would really like to see is a system that allowed for people to drop out (for whatever reason) and for those slots to be reopened to the public. That way you might have a chance of not having to plan for a full year ahead. Call it a waiting list, or re-open a second regestration day.

---

This is your life, and it's ending one minute at a time. - Fight Club
Industry Brat.

I still don't know if what you are proposing makes sense from a business standpoint. I remember reading an article addressing this issue when it came to running marathons. The complaint was that marathons have lost their mystique because you have many people who take 6-7 hours and walk the whole thing. What the author found was that the majority of elite shooting for Boston runners loved that more people did the races because that meant more exposure to the sport and more prize money for them. I don't know for sure, but many elite triathletes probably feel the same way.

I disagree with you that WTC has a large enough pool to start turning people (and their money) away. The Ironman WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP just happened and I can't see it on television until December during one of the crappiest times to air a television program (Saturday afternoon). Our top pro athletes stay at budget motels while a 3rd string football player can afford first class.

Triathlon is a rapidly growing sport, but it's not mainstream. It's not football or baseball. Heck, it's not even as big marathon running! WTC knows this so they probably should keep things the way they are for now.

"Let's talk about solutions and not "it's a business"."

How can you talk about one without the other. Simply "providing ideas" does no good if the likely hood or feesibilty of implementation is useless. The point of these types of discussion is to try and come up with a reasonable solution. You can't come up with a reasonable solution if you ignore one or more of the major influencing factors. In this case oen fo the major influenceing factors is MONEY. Unless you can come up with a reason for the RD's that the "Solution" will not effect or will enhance the bottom line, what point is there in discussing it?

~Matt

Our top pro athletes stay at budget motels while a 3rd string football player can afford first class

According to the new MLB player's collective bargaining agreement, the new minimum salary for a MLB player is $380k/yr, increasing to $400k in 2009.

Crazy, huh?

---

__________________
JP

my twitter feed

..........meanwhile they have a program for the Chicago Tri where they ask people to house pro triathletes because they can't always afford a hotel room.

And there are some of us who want to make Ironman more exclusive????

You said it : triathlon is a race

but -> Ironman is a business



respect the distance

"According to the new MLB player's collective bargaining agreement, the new minimum salary for a MLB player is $380k/yr, increasing to $400k in 2009."



And from an email I received yesterday from the RD of the Musselman tri:



"Through our "Adopt-A-Pro" program, you can opt to spend $25 (for
one night) or $50 (for two nights) toward accommodations for a lucky
yet cash-strapped professional triathlete. You will be paired with an ITU
Pan American Cup competitor who has agreed to stay with you at the Athlete
Village, and you can ask all the questions they can handle on what
makes them go so darn fast. Your adopted pro is not required to stencil your
name on his tri-top, though of course he is welcome to do so."