I've had the same position and same saddle for the last 3 years. However, last week I've started to experience a sore upper hamstring on my left side...almost seems like its coming from the glute. I feel it most when I extend my leg out when sitting.The more I extend my leg the more I feel it. I was training indoors all winter on the bars (no aero position) and just started back 2 weeks ago outside in aero position. I pushed some hard efforts last week in aero so I'm wondering if this caused it? It's still lingering a week later. The weird part is swimming seems to make it feel almost 100% after I get out of the water. I can run on it but the initial few steps cause a little discomfort. One thing to also note is I noticed that I have some sort of callus on the ball of my foot on the left side too that is somewhat sore when walking barefoot and immediately after I bike. Any ideas what this is or the best way to treat it?
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Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [endurance1234]
[ In reply to ]
See a lot of these in my office.
MOST of the time (not all, your case may be different)....I simply have the athlete lower the seat a little bit to unload the hamstring. Your bike "anatomy" hasn't changed (from the sounds of it), but your mobility/stability/strength of the hamstring(s) may have. As far as running, one of the more common causes of proximal hamstring issues is over-striding...give that an assessment and see if it helps.
You'll get a myriad of recommendations. Try some simple things first.
CB
Physical Therapist/Endurance Coach
http://www.cadencept.net
MOST of the time (not all, your case may be different)....I simply have the athlete lower the seat a little bit to unload the hamstring. Your bike "anatomy" hasn't changed (from the sounds of it), but your mobility/stability/strength of the hamstring(s) may have. As far as running, one of the more common causes of proximal hamstring issues is over-striding...give that an assessment and see if it helps.
You'll get a myriad of recommendations. Try some simple things first.
CB
Physical Therapist/Endurance Coach
http://www.cadencept.net
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [endurance1234]
[ In reply to ]
Seat height. Like he said. I am of the opinion that HHT can take quite some time to develop from a mildly too high saddle.
Last edited by:
FindinFreestyle: May 22, 18 16:49
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [endurance1234]
[ In reply to ]
I would be very careful with this, it sounds like high hamstring tendinopathy. I got it 2 weeks out from my first and only IM, that was about 15 months ago and it's only just started to get to around 100% from 11-12 months after the injury. Although it probably didn't help that I went and got a cortisone shot the week o the race so that I could go do it with the injury.
I agree with trying to deload the hamstring by lowering the seat a touch, however if it's already irritated I think you'll only have minimal success, more likely just delay the inevitable. These are typically chronic injuries, brought about by long term aggravation of the tendon. Typically by placing the tendon under load repeatedly while it is in a stretch position (i.e. like riding as bike).
My advice would be to go see a practitioner experienced with these injuries straight away. In addition to lowering your seat a touch, I would strongly advocate for some posterior chain strengthening by using slow, heavy eccentrics on your hamstrings. Either stiff leg deadlifts or on the hamstring curl machine laying flat.
I agree with trying to deload the hamstring by lowering the seat a touch, however if it's already irritated I think you'll only have minimal success, more likely just delay the inevitable. These are typically chronic injuries, brought about by long term aggravation of the tendon. Typically by placing the tendon under load repeatedly while it is in a stretch position (i.e. like riding as bike).
My advice would be to go see a practitioner experienced with these injuries straight away. In addition to lowering your seat a touch, I would strongly advocate for some posterior chain strengthening by using slow, heavy eccentrics on your hamstrings. Either stiff leg deadlifts or on the hamstring curl machine laying flat.
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [endurance1234]
[ In reply to ]
It sounds like your back.
Can you resist knee flexion without pain?
Can you send a picture of how you look when you sit and feel it the most?
"feel it most when I extend my leg out when sitting.The more I extend my leg the more I feel it."
That sounds like a slump test. That combined with how it got worse with increasing aero position training makes me think of low back more than hamstring. Do not stretch it as this will drive more symptoms.
Can you resist knee flexion without pain?
Can you send a picture of how you look when you sit and feel it the most?
"feel it most when I extend my leg out when sitting.The more I extend my leg the more I feel it."
That sounds like a slump test. That combined with how it got worse with increasing aero position training makes me think of low back more than hamstring. Do not stretch it as this will drive more symptoms.
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [CraigAllenSmith]
[ In reply to ]
CraigAllenSmith wrote:
It sounds like your back. Can you resist knee flexion without pain?
Can you send a picture of how you look when you sit and feel it the most?
"feel it most when I extend my leg out when sitting.The more I extend my leg the more I feel it."
That sounds like a slump test. That combined with how it got worse with increasing aero position training makes me think of low back more than hamstring. Do not stretch it as this will drive more symptoms.
^^^This. I spent 6 months chasing what I thought was a high hamstring problem, only to find out it was a back problem. I'd see a back/pain management specialist just to rule it out.
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [CraigAllenSmith]
[ In reply to ]
Interesting....I wasn't slumping over like the slump test but just extending my leg out like the slump test. But now when I try it slumped over I feel some soreness in the hamstring (mostly upper) as well as just sitting upright and extending leg. I will say when I'm running I lack power on the hills and can feel it in my hamstrings from it so makes me think hamstring. Would lower back mimic hamstring tightness/soreness?
I've gone back indoors and riding upright to see if it helps. But so far it's not getting better. It hurts the most after biking but not during.I use a adamo saddle and it feels like this is aggravating it. Should I try using my road back with a normal saddle to take some pressure off that area?
How do I go about treating this if it's a back issue? Would running or biking be worse for it?
I've gone back indoors and riding upright to see if it helps. But so far it's not getting better. It hurts the most after biking but not during.I use a adamo saddle and it feels like this is aggravating it. Should I try using my road back with a normal saddle to take some pressure off that area?
How do I go about treating this if it's a back issue? Would running or biking be worse for it?
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [endurance1234]
[ In reply to ]
endurance1234 wrote:
Interesting....I wasn't slumping over like the slump test but just extending my leg out like the slump test. But now when I try it slumped over I feel some soreness in the hamstring (mostly upper) as well as just sitting upright and extending leg. I will say when I'm running I lack power on the hills and can feel it in my hamstrings from it so makes me think hamstring. Would lower back mimic hamstring tightness/soreness? I've gone back indoors and riding upright to see if it helps. But so far it's not getting better. It hurts the most after biking but not during.I use a adamo saddle and it feels like this is aggravating it. Should I try using my road back with a normal saddle to take some pressure off that area?
How do I go about treating this if it's a back issue? Would running or biking be worse for it?
Very common to have some neural restriction and sciatic pain along with upper hamstring tendinopathy. Anatomically they are close in proximity and aren't mutually exclusive. If fact, I find it's more common than not patients have a positive slump test who have an upper hamstring problem. As others have said, go see a medical professional whom specializes in triathletes if the simple changes to your seat height and running stride aren't helping.
CB
Physical Therapist/Endurance Coach
http://www.cadencept.net
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [PTinAZ]
[ In reply to ]
You’re a genius. I was having major sciatic pain like the OP but I was riding a newly built Shiv. My saddle was a little higher than my prior bike. I dropped the seat a little after seeing your post and my sciatic issues have resolved. Thanks!
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [triguy86]
[ In reply to ]
triguy86 wrote:
You’re a genius. I was having major sciatic pain like the OP but I was riding a newly built Shiv. My saddle was a little higher than my prior bike. I dropped the seat a little after seeing your post and my sciatic issues have resolved. Thanks! Awesome to hear man!
CB
Physical Therapist/Endurance Coach
http://www.cadencept.net
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [PTinAZ]
[ In reply to ]
I've had all the same symptoms as mentioned in above posts for almost 2 years now. My saddle -was- too high, and I was an over-strider....no proof that that caused the issues....but I've had HHT, and the glute on that side is visually smaller, and weaker, than the good side.
If it does stem partly from lower back issues, what is the fix?
I have seen physio for a while, but it didn't help much. Getting into the gym and trying to strengthen my hams and glutes has helped some, but 5km into a run I can feel the glute weaken and then the entire hamstring then starts to go...
If it does stem partly from lower back issues, what is the fix?
I have seen physio for a while, but it didn't help much. Getting into the gym and trying to strengthen my hams and glutes has helped some, but 5km into a run I can feel the glute weaken and then the entire hamstring then starts to go...
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [Dgconner154]
[ In reply to ]
When I was having sciatica-like hamstring pain, I was having trouble getting referrals to anyone EXCEPT spine people. MRI negative, Xray negative, lumbar corticosteroid injections not helpful. I ended up going to a great physio who pretty quickly diagnosed the problem as a failure to contract (or inadequate contraction of) the gluteal muscles during both running and cycling. Therapy revolved around consciously activating the glutes in isolation and during all hip extension movements (e.g., walking, stairs). It sounds ridiculous, but the glutes are the largest muscle in the human body and the hamstrings classically have problems when asked to contract in the lengthened position (e.g., at impact during running).
Edit: I will say, it took some time to be pain-free again, but I also didn't do a very good job of resting.
Can you resist knee flexion without pain?
Can you send a picture of how you look when you sit and feel it the most?
"feel it most when I extend my leg out when sitting.The more I extend my leg the more I feel it."
That sounds like a slump test. That combined with how it got worse with increasing aero position training makes me think of low back more than hamstring. Do not stretch it as this will drive more symptoms.
^^^This. I spent 6 months chasing what I thought was a high hamstring problem, only to find out it was a back problem. I'd see a back/pain management specialist just to rule it out.
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https://connect.garmin.com/modern/profile/domingjm
Edit: I will say, it took some time to be pain-free again, but I also didn't do a very good job of resting.
Dgconner154 wrote:
CraigAllenSmith wrote:
It sounds like your back. Can you resist knee flexion without pain?
Can you send a picture of how you look when you sit and feel it the most?
"feel it most when I extend my leg out when sitting.The more I extend my leg the more I feel it."
That sounds like a slump test. That combined with how it got worse with increasing aero position training makes me think of low back more than hamstring. Do not stretch it as this will drive more symptoms.
^^^This. I spent 6 months chasing what I thought was a high hamstring problem, only to find out it was a back problem. I'd see a back/pain management specialist just to rule it out.
---------------------------------------------------------------
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/profile/domingjm
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [SBRcanuck]
[ In reply to ]
Like I mentioned above, (and I'm not saying you're doing anything wrong) my problem was that I wasn't contracting the glute effectively. I was very strong in the "glute exercises" but the movements were being accomplished by muscles other than the glutes. I know it sounds ridiculous, and I wouldn't have believed it a year ago either, but it's possible that you're relying on hamstring/hip flexors/quads to do the work of the glutes.
If it does stem partly from lower back issues, what is the fix?
I have seen physio for a while, but it didn't help much. Getting into the gym and trying to strengthen my hams and glutes has helped some, but 5km into a run I can feel the glute weaken and then the entire hamstring then starts to go...
---------------------------------------------------------------
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/profile/domingjm
SBRcanuck wrote:
I've had all the same symptoms as mentioned in above posts for almost 2 years now. My saddle -was- too high, and I was an over-strider....no proof that that caused the issues....but I've had HHT, and the glute on that side is visually smaller, and weaker, than the good side. If it does stem partly from lower back issues, what is the fix?
I have seen physio for a while, but it didn't help much. Getting into the gym and trying to strengthen my hams and glutes has helped some, but 5km into a run I can feel the glute weaken and then the entire hamstring then starts to go...
---------------------------------------------------------------
https://connect.garmin.com/modern/profile/domingjm
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [SBRcanuck]
[ In reply to ]
SBRcanuck wrote:
I've had all the same symptoms as mentioned in above posts for almost 2 years now. My saddle -was- too high, and I was an over-strider....no proof that that caused the issues....but I've had HHT, and the glute on that side is visually smaller, and weaker, than the good side. If it does stem partly from lower back issues, what is the fix?
I have seen physio for a while, but it didn't help much. Getting into the gym and trying to strengthen my hams and glutes has helped some, but 5km into a run I can feel the glute weaken and then the entire hamstring then starts to go...
Can't speak for what your "physio" entailed, but it does sound more complex than typical. If you are having visible atrophy, it may take some deeper assessment. Don't mean to be vague. Search around for a PT who sees runners/triathletes on a regular basis and who has a rep for being thorough and detailed in their assessments....surprisingly hard to find.
CB
Physical Therapist/Endurance Coach
http://www.cadencept.net
Re: High Hamstring/Glute Sore after biking [PTinAZ]
[ In reply to ]
Thanks. It may very well be a bit complex....I was diagnosed via two MRI's (one without contrast, one with) as having CAM/FAI in that hip. No labral tear. And bad posterior glide in that hip.......hip wants to move forward when leaned over a bike. And via Xray I do have a curve near bottom of spine, and shoulder on bad side is a bit lower than good side.....
I'm an assymetry mess....lol.
Surgeon that ordered the MRI's said deal with it, its all because of the hip. All the reading Ive done seems to point to strengthening the glute. I've been doing various exercises trying to work the glute, not sure what else to do...
Thx
I'm an assymetry mess....lol.
Surgeon that ordered the MRI's said deal with it, its all because of the hip. All the reading Ive done seems to point to strengthening the glute. I've been doing various exercises trying to work the glute, not sure what else to do...
Thx
I've lowered the saddle just a bit but still having issues. It's not getting worse but its not getting better either. I notice that when I was slipping my shoe off as I was pulling up on my leg to get my shoe off (wearing boots so tough to get off) I could really feel it my hamstrings. Also, notice I have to alter my stride when I first start to run but once I get going it smoothes out.