I've heard nothing but good things about the Hed 3 wheelset. I've never ridden them (I have a Hed Jet front and a Hed Deep rear) but I can't see that it would be any more difficult to control than the Zipp or any other Deep rim front wheel. I don't find my wheelset hard to control. I would look for a used deep rim or Hed 3 and give it a try rather than spring $750 for the Zipp front.

Iv'e used an H3 or a specialized tri spoke for many years and think it is the best wheel in its class.Many bike shops like wheels with better margins of profit.Hed is worth more than they cost compared to others.(zipp,corima,etc.)Just my opinion. Cullen

Wanna save some money Kevin? I believe the Specialized tri-spoke and the Hed are essentially the same wheel. It hasn't changed much since Hed bought it out from Specialized. They pop up on ebay every now and then. Of course you're taking you're chances with going second hand but it's always worked well for me. I intend to get a Renn disc in the near future. Researched it quite a bit and it's by far the most bang for the buck unless you want to take a stab at making your own disc.

I really don't think there is anything more aero than the H3 for a front wheel. Based on the numbers Cobb and other aero tests have shown, the H3 with a rear disc is the most efficient wheelset you can buy. Did you happen to see what US Postal was riding at the tour this year?

ive been looking around ebay.
I am going to see if there are any other shops that sell used stuff. One guy back home is really cool and trustworthy and he has been able to hook up some friends with some quality stuff for cheap, ill try him and keep looking on ebay.

in regards to the making your own disc, the idea crossed my mind. One of my housemates specialzes in studying nomex/kevlar and that kind of stuff, but i dont think i have the mechanical inclination (or time) to construct it.

Cerveloguy, you said that you are around toronto, where do you get most of your stuff...endurosport?

Thanks,



-Kevin

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"Anyone can work hard when they want to; Champions do it when they don't."

"where do you get most of your stuff...endurosport? "

ebay!! Have a tedency to buy second hand. Do use Endurosport and LaBicycletta though.

If you're going to a flatter course (or ride flatter courses in general) I'd say a HED3, if you can handle it. In a x-wind they can be squirrely, but if you are a decent cyclist you should be able to handle it. If you want a bit more versatility and lighter weight (say for a hillier course) go with an Alps or 303/404 front. The new Spinergy Tiliums look promising as well.

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"To give less than your best is to sacrifice the gift." - Pre

MattMizenko.com

i was also considering the tilliums, they look cool, and if they are more comfortable, and almost as aero, maybe that might be the way to go.

Has anyone EVER had any problems with the Hed stuff?

ALso, can you true the h3's? Im not a super light guy (205lbs), so im afraid i may knock them out of true quite easily?

Thanks,



-Kevin

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"Anyone can work hard when they want to; Champions do it when they don't."

Can't true 'em but you never should need to if they were built properly - they're molded. If they ARE out of true then send 'em back. Be forewarned that the rear wheel (if you get one) has a slight wobble on the cassette, due to a shim they use in building them. Not a concern though.

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"To give less than your best is to sacrifice the gift." - Pre

MattMizenko.com

tom, as a bike shop owner, what would say about the h3's?

thanks,



-kevin

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"Anyone can work hard when they want to; Champions do it when they don't."

If you don't mind waiting a little longer you may consider waiting for the new Renn front wheel. I e-mailed the guy and he said it'll be ready for the race season. It may or may not be quite as aero, but it will match and I would assume it comes with the same great warranty as his disc.

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I don't work here, I just live here

Allan,

How do you like your setup? I was also thinking of going with a Hed Jet in front and Hed Deep (90mm) on the back? right now I am riding and training on stock Apollo Fir's on the P2K.

Thanks

-Joe

Hey Kevin .May I ask why this changed from front wheel to hed problems?Just wondering.

culllen,

i was actually trying to refresh the topic on the list. I probably should have used opinions instead. I was trying to imply if people have had problems with heds ever, or if this guy who is telling my this stuff just doesnt like the wheels as a personal thing, and is letting it influence his buisness' decisions.

Sorry for the confusion.

Thanks,

-Kevin

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"Anyone can work hard when they want to; Champions do it when they don't."

Well, I can tell you that I have sold a good quantity of Hed wheels and also own a set of H3s myself and we have not experienced problems. I recommend them.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

Kevin, I have used all of the HED products, HED DEEPs, Alps, H3s, Disc and J2s. I have not had one problem. I am a firm believer. There are a couple of factors you should take into consideration when buying a pair of go fast race wheels:

1) Cost Benefit: Is a $1200 Mavic Disc going to give you that much more Aero benefit over a HED Disc $700? (Cullen makes a good point regarding the LBS profit margins)

2)Aerodynamic Benefit: Aerodynamics do not come into play until you exceed 25 mph. if you cannot average at least that over a 40k, then aerodynamics should not be that much of a concern. The H3 has been tested as one of the most Aero wheels, only being surpassed by a disc.

3)Rim / Braking Surface Material: There are a number of differences between a light weight all carbon rim (ie Zipp 404s) and a aero rim with an aluminum braking surface(ie HED). An all carbon rim will always be lighter than a rim with an aluminum braking surface. Some Carbon rims require wheel specific brake pads, (ie Corima), in addition to specific brake pads, some people I have spoken with complain that wet weather on carbon rims ware down the brake pads quickly (just an observation / no empirecal data to back up).

In case of a pot hole expirience aluminum braking surfaces can be removed from the carbon rim and replaced, as where a carbon rim would have to be completley replaced.

4)Type of race course: if the courses you are going to be racing on are in mountains, or very hilly, a lighter wheelset would be prefered. You are not getting any Aero Benefit when climbing at 12mph.

In summary, for a strong, larger person, I believe the H3s are bar non the best choice. For someone not as confident on the bike and lightweight I believe the Alps are a good choice. The difference being the lateral wind effects.

These are just my personal expiriences and opinions, check out Cobbs site, I'm sure there is plently of data provided there.

thanks for the info

i would consider myself a larger, stronger person (football and hockey background).

I think i may wait at least for a while though before i take the plunge and actually drop 800-1000 dollars for race wheels, if not more :(

Thanks for all the info though, and i didnt think the Heds were bad, hell, lance uses them...they cant be too bad!

i think im going to have a talk with this bike shop owner and maybe set him straight!

Thanks again guys,



-Kevin

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"Anyone can work hard when they want to; Champions do it when they don't."

I've had my eye on the H3's and think that when I do buy race wheels they're what I'll try out. I'm about 5'10", 190lbs so I feel like I probably fit into the larger category as well.

Does anyone know if the Hed website is up-to-date regarding the closeout products? They list a pair of 700c H3's for $780 (I think) which seems like a good value coming directly from the company.

Today, there was a high wind advisory in Charlotte, where you live, Kevin. I took my H3 front, Renn disc rear out on the road. Yes, I got blown around, and I wouldn't want to ride that combo in Kona, but, it is rideable. I weigh 182. I had some of the original Alps, and they weren't as susceptable to the wind...I imagine the 404's would be similar in handling to the Alps. At 200+lbs., if you are a decent bike handler and have a properly setup and fitted bike, you should be able to run an H 3 on the front in most weather conditions.

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Quid quid latine dictum sit altum videtur
(That which is said in Latin sounds profound)

HED changed the 'Closeout Specials' page in October/November after IM Hawaii. But the product pages seems not to be updated regulary. I can't find the Kona Cost and the H3D was not there for quit a while (when tri shops had it already in their shops).

Also Renns website www.rennmultisport.com seems not to be updated regulary. You can't find anything about the new front wheel they are working on and the Link page is still 'coming soon'. And as much as I know the Disc cost know $339 (add in Triathlete). But on the website Renn writes '$319.99 suggested retail '.
I wonder every time why Renn Multisport has pictures of bikes without the Disc (the bikes are equipped with 3 Spoke and deep rim wheels but not Renn Disc) on their webiste. I would at least put on pictures of a bike with my product.

But I prefer a company with good and reasonable priced wheels over a company with a great website but not so good wheels/products. Because I'm responsible for two websites (personal, children group) I know that keeping a website updated is quite some work.
HED and Renn products have a very good reputation. The words spreads without a great website.

Felix

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http://www.weilenmann.ch.vu

Frank's been too busy building wheels- that's why he hasn't updated the website.