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Guns and training
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Has anyone ever carried a handgun while either riding or running? Has anyone ever had to use such a weapon to defend themselves, either by drawing it or actually shooting it at an attacker?

Chris
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Re: Guns and training [crwnikeboy] [ In reply to ]
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I train with 2 guns that are located between my forearms and shoulders.... They work great for self defense...
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Re: Guns and training [GoJohnnyGo] [ In reply to ]
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HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Chris
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Re: Guns and training [crwnikeboy] [ In reply to ]
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Used to occasionally run or skate with a rifle. Looked a little fake with the blue kevlar stock but very real. Then I moved to a place where the definition of winter biathlon is a 5 km run and 1000 m no wetsuit ocean swim so no more rifle.
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Re: Guns and training [crwnikeboy] [ In reply to ]
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I have not and am not sure it would very effective with attackers anyway because you are likely to be surprised and not able to get it when you need it. A carry permit would be required depending on where you are. I am a proponent of armed citizens so don't think I am some anti gun person and dismissing it because of that.

I attended a training on self defense with a tactical flashlight that is perfect for running as it is small and water and sweat proof and always in your hand. The training was conducted by a retired Seal and was is very impressive. The flashlight has sharpened edges around the beam and is REALLY bright which makes it effective to blind your attacker and as a slashing weapon if they keep coming. Once I am able to run again I am going to put myself and my wife through the whole training and get the lights. I prefer to train at night so end up running in the dark other than in the summer so having a light source is helpful. I do not have music in my ears while running at night.
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Re: Guns and training [Brucep] [ In reply to ]
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Brucep wrote:
I have not and am not sure it would very effective with attackers anyway because you are likely to be surprised and not able to get it when you need it. A carry permit would be required depending on where you are. I am a proponent of armed citizens so don't think I am some anti gun person and dismissing it because of that.

Surprise is a function of awareness. The more attention you pay, the less likely it is. Speed of access is a function of carry method. There are many secure methods that allow for quick access.

I carry frequently when running/biking (but not racing, so it's kinda an extra weight training aid), and I've never used it, nor do I ever want to.

Brucep wrote:
I attended a training on self defense with a tactical flashlight that is perfect for running as it is small and water and sweat proof and always in your hand. The training was conducted by a retired Seal and was is very impressive. The flashlight has sharpened edges around the beam and is REALLY bright which makes it effective to blind your attacker and as a slashing weapon if they keep coming. Once I am able to run again I am going to put myself and my wife through the whole training and get the lights. I prefer to train at night so end up running in the dark other than in the summer so having a light source is helpful. I do not have music in my ears while running at night.

One early AM, I got a large, aggressive dog to stop charging me by shining a surefire flashlight straight into his eyes. Every time I turned the light away from him, he advanced. So I kept it on him, and just kept running. He didn't know what to make of it, and didn't follow. Problem solved, luckily without resorting to lead.

All such implements are tools, and can change your odds for the better if you know how, and when, to use them. If you don't, they're pretty much as useful as any other talisman.

--------------
Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard.
http://www.endorphins-for-breakfast.blogspot.com/
http://www.nolimitsendurance.com/
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Re: Guns and training [crwnikeboy] [ In reply to ]
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I have on certain occasions. I work very odd hours in the hospital and sometimes run when I get out. Unfortunately my routes go through the "not so nice" areas of Providence and it is best to at least be as armed as the people around you. I've never been in a situation where I needed it and haven't drawn it on anyone. It's the whole "having and not needing/needing and not having" mentality.

_________________________
I got nothing.
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Re: Guns and training [N. Dorphin] [ In reply to ]
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i used to carry a gun when I went out running. But it was when i worked as a ranger in the bush back in South Africa. I ran in the heat of the day, with the full knowledge that the gun probably wouldn't help me if an animal came around the corner. And if they wanted to nail me, my pathetic human senses certainly wouldn't be "aware" enough to detect them.

Equally, if you run at night, it doesn't matter if you are a full-on ninja - if someone is out to get you a gun probably won't help.

p.s. I'm really glad I live in a place where the thought of a gun for self-defence is ludicrous.

p.p.s. that 357 hand cannon I used to carry in the bush was fucking heavy.
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Re: Guns and training [N. Dorphin] [ In reply to ]
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N. Dorphin wrote:
All such implements are tools, and can change your odds for the better if you know how, and when, to use them. If you don't, they're pretty much as useful as any other talisman.

That's right. Guns don't kill people, the person holding your gun(s) kill people. Unfortunately as the bulk of gun related homicides show it's often not the owner holding the gun at the time. The most recent tragic event is a good case in point. And in a society where you have almost zero qualifications required to own and operate what would in most nations be considered in excess of general military requirements you are bound to have the vast majority of owners fitting into the category of not knowing how or when to use them.

Concealable (i.e. handgun), semi-automatic, automatic and large bore firearms have no place in a modern society. Until that is understood and acted upon the U.S. will continue to have innocent citizens killed needlessly. Statistics continue to show that your gun "laws" are a dismal failure at protecting your population and always will be. Take a look at the countries that surround you on this table. I hope you are all very proud of yourselves.
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Re: Guns and training [crwnikeboy] [ In reply to ]
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i use a hickory stick with a large nail in the end.

Life should NOT be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in an attractive and well preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, covered in scars, body thoroughly used up, totally worn out and screaming 'hell yeah', what a ride.
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Re: Guns and training [NickG] [ In reply to ]
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I used to have to fo most of my runs after 10pm, I carried a small 9mm, before the housing market crashed there were a lot of gang bangers living in the neiborhood, real pieces of shit. I actually got in fights with them on a few occasions. I started carrying the gun because of the pitbulls that these degenerate ass hats couldnt keep on their property. After awhile, these people got kicked out of their houses or lost their minimum wage jobs and couldnt pay rent and moved out, its much better now I hear.
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Re: Guns and training [stikman] [ In reply to ]
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"large bore" firearms are generally for hunting, very VERY few if anybody uses them for anything but hunting. Furthermore, "big bore" firearms are common in many many countries. hell, I have shot a 45-70 in Canada.
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Re: Guns and training [IRONwolf] [ In reply to ]
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I carried a weapon in the military on operation. Thankfully never had to fire it in anger.

I am grateful that Australia has no real threat of violent gun related deaths. Most gun deaths seem to be from domestic violence and quite uncommon.

I have used a pair of 11mm running spikes on dog once (blue heeler). It didn't chase me again.
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Re: Guns and training [rralp9] [ In reply to ]
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Yeah, gun violence sucks, no doubt. I think what so many people seem to miss is that for many many people guns are sort of a sport, not something owned out of desperation for safety. I own lots of guns, I didnt buy them because I was scared, Initially that may have been part of the reason, but it turned into a hobby itself. I would buy them because I liked them or wanted them, not because I felt I needed them.
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Re: Guns and training [crwnikeboy] [ In reply to ]
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Makes me think back to the first "running races" I did in the IDF I recall the obstacle course naturally, I think it was an 800 meter run, the course, and then another 800 meter run. I did quite well. Then , doing Sky Marshall training after the military and having to run 800 meters with an Uzi with 2 clips and see how many bullets you could get in the target. This was in the mid to late 70s and thankfully, save for a brief stint from 1986-1988 reserve duty, never touched these things again. Gun culture/worship sickens me. One reason I live in Canada.

Cervelo R3 and Cannondale Synapse, Argon18 Electron Track Bike
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Re: Guns and training [IRONwolf] [ In reply to ]
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IRONwolf wrote:
Yeah, gun violence sucks, no doubt. I think what so many people seem to miss is that for many many people guns are sort of a sport, not something owned out of desperation for safety. I own lots of guns, I didnt buy them because I was scared, Initially that may have been part of the reason, but it turned into a hobby itself. I would buy them because I liked them or wanted them, not because I felt I needed them.



For fun, I went and read a bunch of posts on gun rights on several gun forums.

The number of individuals there who emphasize the protection aspect of guns is staggering. I wish I could say that I got a positive impression of these people, but honestly, the first thing that came into my mind from reading most of the posts from these pro gun defense people was that of a 6th grader who was intoxicated with the feeling of power it gave them. I'm probably being generous here as well. When you see numerous posts in a row of people claiming that they are so skilled with their hunting rifles that they could easily defend themselves from the US military if it came to that, and not a single person in the thread doubts them (they get reinforced with kudos actually), it starts sounding juvenile quickly - until you realize that these very people are very real people with very real guns.

Most of those same folks on the forums claim that their gun is a crucial part of self-defense for them several times per year. I'm not sure where they're living in where you NEED to draw a gun several times a year and be fully willing to fire on a human being to defend yourself, but I strongly suspect that their self-satisfied determination what constitutes a gun-worthy situation is highly skewed given that they say it happens so frequently to them.

I wish I could say these were fringe players making up <.1% of the population, but it's clearly way higher than that, and likely a significant percentage of the gun toting population in the US. Scary, actually.

I frequent a road cycling forum as well, and it was amazing to me there as well when a "packing heat on the ride" thread came up, that more than a few vigorously defended carrying a pistol with them on their training rides, and most of the logic was "well if you consider that a car is a potentially lethal weapon against cyclists, I'm going to respond with equally lethal force against that threat if I'm threatened on the road." WTFFF.
Last edited by: lightheir: Dec 21, 12 2:07
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Re: Guns and training [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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I agree, the mall ninja factor on lots of gun boards is through the roof, In defense of some gun forums though, that talk dosent really fly there and gets smacked down quicker than it does here on ST.

there are lots of amateur hour gun forums out there though. I can completely respect that a person dosent want to have a gun, I dont care if they do or they dont its their choice and honestly, If guns were banned, I would be pissed but it wouldnt be the end of the world ( I also wouldnt voluntarily turn my guns in though).
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Re: Guns and training [IRONwolf] [ In reply to ]
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IRONwolf wrote:
I agree, the mall ninja factor on lots of gun boards is through the roof, In defense of some gun forums though, that talk dosent really fly there and gets smacked down quicker than it does here on ST.

there are lots of amateur hour gun forums out there though. I can completely respect that a person dosent want to have a gun, I dont care if they do or they dont its their choice and honestly, If guns were banned, I would be pissed but it wouldnt be the end of the world ( I also wouldnt voluntarily turn my guns in though).


Sadly, on 4 of the gun forums I've frequented, there was no moderator smacking down those vigilantes. It was actually the norm of the culture there, to present arguments how Afghanistan was a great model of how a single person with a rifle could withstand the US military, and how that was relevant to living in the States with a gun. And a lot of macho talk about how bad the police are about defending anyone in the States and how anyone outside of a major city really needed a gun for protection.

I could count on one hand the number of reasonable, rational posts I saw about guns on the "gun advocacy" portion of those forums, and this was the one that stood out the most, and to the forum credit, was put forth by the moderator of the forum after a lot of people were creating a lot of noise about how the Connecticut shooting was akin to a clarion call for them to buy up guns and ammo ASAP before the gov't could take them away:

"If the first thing that went through your mind after hearing about the Connecticut shootings was 'Oh no they're going to take my guns away!', you have failed as a human being.'

Unfortunately that excellent quote went nearly completely ignored for the rest of the thread as I recall.
Last edited by: lightheir: Dec 21, 12 2:50
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Re: Guns and training [stikman] [ In reply to ]
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Concealable (i.e. handgun), semi-automatic, automatic and large bore firearms have no place in a modern society.

Mayor Bloomberg from NYC thinks 24oz Soft-drinks have no place in modern society either. Neither does salt, tobacco or fried food and he is advocating for these things to be restricted. I think when you go screwing around with the 2nd Amendment you open the doors for further intrusion of individual rights. Even A.G. Eric Holder was talking the other day about how we: 'need to have a discussion about the responsible use of our rights.' And he was not only talking about the 2nd Amendment.

So who is going to decide what rights are worth protecting and how our rights should be used? I hope it is not a bunch of people like you.

And since you are certainly doing something that I feel has no place in modern society you'd better hope it is not a bunch of people like me.

You should read the attached article: "Why Liberals Should Love the Second Amendment."

http://www.dailykos.com/...the-Second-Amendment#


**All of these words finding themselves together were greatly astonished and delighted for assuredly, they had never met before**
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Re: Guns and training [crwnikeboy] [ In reply to ]
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To answer your question directly: When I am out riding around the backroads here, I typically carry a very compact LCP .380. I have had to pull it once to convince a driver to stop harassing Wife and I. It got the point across very quick. I also carry "Halt" and have used it several times on dogs.

Why carry a gun? I would rather produce a gun and scare the shit out of a person/people than try a fist fight. It's just the world we live in. People don't understand honor any more because we are have been impeded from understanding the difference between right and wrong. I expect a bunch of kids to make fun of each other. But adults proactively chasing down others out running and biking because it's fun? Yeah, fuck that. I never go to the parts of the city that don't like people like me. However, in the other more rural parts, you get your occasional asshole who wants to be funny with his buddies and hits you with a fucking shoe (yeah, happened to me). Would I shoot someone over that? A better question would be: what if that shoe hit me in the head and caused me to fall and cause severe brain trauma or death? At that point, what's the difference? A projectile is a projectile.

Oh, that's right, turn the other cheek. No. That's fine for rational people who understand that and become remorseful after they injure you. But the world does not operate like that anymore. You have to instill within them a sense of understanding of why they are idiots for picking on people. It's like the proverbial high-school bully. He or she keeps beating on you because you are small and week. Then one day, you have had enough, you pick up a stick, and knock some fear into them. Works like a charm. One of my drill instructors was found of saying "the body will comprehend what the mind does not."

Here is an example from Knoxville: http://www.wbir.com/...ter-sideswipe-attack This story is not about me, but a local guy really into biking. He was ran off the road and then had his face busted up. Just because.

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Re: Guns and training [IRONwolf] [ In reply to ]
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IRONwolf wrote:
I agree, the mall ninja factor on lots of gun boards is through the roof, In defense of some gun forums though, that talk dosent really fly there and gets smacked down quicker than it does here on ST.


there are lots of amateur hour gun forums out there though. I can completely respect that a person dosent want to have a gun, I dont care if they do or they dont its their choice and honestly, If guns were banned, I would be pissed but it wouldnt be the end of the world ( I also wouldnt voluntarily turn my guns in though).


what strike me the the most in those forums is that every member seem to be a well trained Navy Seal that has a killing ratio of 1:1 on real life situations /sacarsm

btw: would hard for me to run or bike with a shotgun lol


The entire event (IM) is like "death by 1000 cuts" and the best race is minimizing all those cuts and losing less blood than the other guy. - Dev
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Re: Guns and training [KnoxVegas] [ In reply to ]
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you need to move to a safer area to live in.

It is laughable people train whilst carrying guns.

Cmon man!

I can tell you now, the aussies are saying 'typical yanks'.
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Re: Guns and training [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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lightheir wrote:

Sadly, on 4 of the gun forums I've frequented, there was no moderator smacking down those vigilantes. It was actually the norm of the culture there, to present arguments how Afghanistan was a great model of how a single person with a rifle could withstand the US military, and how that was relevant to living in the States with a gun. And a lot of macho talk about how bad the police are about defending anyone in the States and how anyone outside of a major city really needed a gun for protection.

Really? Afghanistan is brought up as a positive example of anything? That makes sense. Western society has so much to learn from that hellhole. I'm not saying western, capitalist society is the absolute shiznit, but to to use Afghanistan as a counter example, especially where violence is concerned, is just so damned sad it's note even funny.

Citizen of the world, former drunkard. Resident Traumatic Brain Injury advocate.
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Re: Guns and training [coates_hbk] [ In reply to ]
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If I lived in an area where I felt i needed to carry a gun to feel safe while training I'd either move or see a psychologist. I can barely tie my shoe proficiently while in the middle of a run let alone try to shoot a boogie man
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Re: Guns and training [coates_hbk] [ In reply to ]
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Why should I move? I am the law abiding citizen. Life is not without risk, but why wear a helmet, or seatbelt, or any other type of safety device.

To say something is laughable is somewhat odd, considering that is of a personal opinion. I don't proclaim that something you are doing is laughable, so why attack me? Is it because of the ability to be anonymous or perhaps geographic separation? I'd give you nickle if you accused someone of a laughable act in person.

As to the aussies or anyone else in the world: I've been around long enough to understand that most, if not all, "western" countries have less than positive thoughts about the US. I don't care. When you start worry about yourself and not what others think, especially those who have no bearing on your life, then your days become better. And if some aussie or whoever wants to prove a point or enforce a thought, then by all means, let them do so. I laugh at them in return.
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