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Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome!
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Did my typical Northern California 2-hr loop yesterday which has a few decent short climbs that it's fun to throw down the hammer on.

Yesterday, I got my doors blown off on these climbs by not one, not two, but three e-bikes. It was impressive - I'm fully aware these bikes are now so powerful that over non-sprint distances they can put up pro+ power (Vegancyclist has a youtube video of his wife easily crushing his 350+ watt effort on a climb) but it's still neat to see it in action. For fun I tried to match one of them once they got ahead of me, and I was still getting dropped at 400 watts, which is about as hard as I can go for a minute. Yowzas!

Sure, it takes a little of an ego check when they just go blowing by you and you desperately scan their BB to look for the bulbous apperance of the e-bike (the high pitched whine also gives it away), but it really is great to see folks out there enjoying bikes, and in particular, enjoying the speed and power of going fast, which you can sort of capture with an e-bike.

Am not sure if those same bikes are speed-regulated so they can't put out gobs of power at 25+mph, as I easily caught all of them on the downhill while barely pedaling.

Best part - all 3 guys were by my guess, 65+, and likely 70+, with one guy definitely 75+. I rode along him after catching him on the donwhill-flat and told him his bike rocks, and asked him how he was finding it (as I'll probably get one when I'm his age). He gleefully said it was the most fun he'd ever had, and dared me to try and catch up on the next gradual incline. I said game on!, and he crushed me again - I had literally no chance at 300watts!

Great to see the seniors enjoying the outdoors, and being able to tackle the big hills as well and HAVING FUN doing it. All 3 bikes I saw were very hard to distinguish from regular road bikes, you had to look carefull to tell. And all 3 of them were loaded up with bags, panniers, mirrors, pretty much killing all the aerodynamics and weight - and I couldn't' catch any of them on the climbs.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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Fortunately we have a fighting chance against road legal electronic-assisted bikes (limited to 250w and 25km/h). I use myself a short-tail e-cargo to bring my 10 year old to school. I still sweat as you just tend to ride faster...

https://www.strava.com/athletes/13873052
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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lightheir wrote:
Did my typical Northern California 2-hr loop yesterday which has a few decent short climbs that it's fun to throw down the hammer on.

Yesterday, I got my doors blown off on these climbs by not one, not two, but three e-bikes. It was impressive - I'm fully aware these bikes are now so powerful that over non-sprint distances they can put up pro+ power (Vegancyclist has a youtube video of his wife easily crushing his 350+ watt effort on a climb) but it's still neat to see it in action. For fun I tried to match one of them once they got ahead of me, and I was still getting dropped at 400 watts, which is about as hard as I can go for a minute. Yowzas!

Sure, it takes a little of an ego check when they just go blowing by you and you desperately scan their BB to look for the bulbous apperance of the e-bike (the high pitched whine also gives it away), but it really is great to see folks out there enjoying bikes, and in particular, enjoying the speed and power of going fast, which you can sort of capture with an e-bike.

Am not sure if those same bikes are speed-regulated so they can't put out gobs of power at 25+mph, as I easily caught all of them on the downhill while barely pedaling.

Best part - all 3 guys were by my guess, 65+, and likely 70+, with one guy definitely 75+. I rode along him after catching him on the donwhill-flat and told him his bike rocks, and asked him how he was finding it (as I'll probably get one when I'm his age). He gleefully said it was the most fun he'd ever had, and dared me to try and catch up on the next gradual incline. I said game on!, and he crushed me again - I had literally no chance at 300watts!

Great to see the seniors enjoying the outdoors, and being able to tackle the big hills as well and HAVING FUN doing it. All 3 bikes I saw were very hard to distinguish from regular road bikes, you had to look carefull to tell. And all 3 of them were loaded up with bags, panniers, mirrors, pretty much killing all the aerodynamics and weight - and I couldn't' catch any of them on the climbs.

In Europe, where power and speed are more regulated, accident numbers of e-bikes go up significantly.
Some of it apparently is attributed to more inexperienced and older riders using these bikes.
I would think in the US, we haven’t seen that yet. But it’s coming.

In my affluent neighborhood, a couple 8-10 yo kids ride eMTBs that by my assessment must easily go 25+ mph.
Speed kills.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [windschatten] [ In reply to ]
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I was just talking with my wife about s many pandemic ebike riders out moving at speeds they are not used to because pre pandemic they never rode now they are often riding 35-50kph with way less bike riding and handing experience.

But I have to say you can see how happy people are being out with the motor assist. More happy people on two wheels is good.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
I was just talking with my wife about s many pandemic ebike riders out moving at speeds they are not used to because pre pandemic they never rode now they are often riding 35-50kph with way less bike riding and handing experience.

But I have to say you can see how happy people are being out with the motor assist. More happy people on two wheels is good.


Yes, more slow speed two wheelers on the roads is good. Maybe this will get us to Critical Mass.

50km/h, that's moped territory. Plus better acceleration.
In CA you don't need license/insurance for an ebike up to 28mph (Class-3), only must be 16 yo and wear some sort of helmet.
I think that's crazy.
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Last edited by: windschatten: Mar 30, 21 19:47
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
I More happy people on two wheels is good.

Exactly my sentiment regarding e-bikes. I'm not racing them when I'm out on a training ride so why not see others enjoy cycling in their own way? Hopefully e-bikes continue to drive change in city infrastructure and driver-cyclist awareness.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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I'm not surprised they crushed you up a hill! Someone let me ride their eMTB. He put it on max assist mode. It felt like it was adding 500-600W to my roughly 100-200W. A quick google says that the strongest ones around can put out close to 1000W. Crazy. Also awesome. Completely agree with your sentiments.

Dr. Alex Harrison | Founder & CEO | Sport Physiology & Performance PhD
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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It was really great to see the joy on those riders' faces when they finally got to experience some of what we regular cyclists experience after all that training, to get to feel what it's like to really move on a climb, and really get the wind going when it flattens out. I do think it's game changing for most folks who aren't serious cyclists - those hills I was mentioning in my 2 hr climb aren't particularly daunting to any regular triathlete but are probably game-ending for most folks who aren't seriously riding regularly.

And the more folks who enjoy riding, even into their retirement+ years means a safer and more understanding community for us cyclists down the road. I'm sure there will be a share of conflicts along they way between ebikes and normal bikes as the popularity grows, but I have faith it'll mostly benefit both sides of the equation, at least when it comes to staking out more road rights and safety compared to the prime danger in road cycling which is inattentive drivers.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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lightheir wrote:
And the more folks who enjoy riding, even into their retirement+ years means a safer and more understanding community for us cyclists down the road. I'm sure there will be a share of conflicts along they way between ebikes and normal bikes as the popularity grows, but I have faith it'll mostly benefit both sides of the equation, at least when it comes to staking out more road rights and safety compared to the prime danger in road cycling which is inattentive drivers.
Totally agree.

Dr. Alex Harrison | Founder & CEO | Sport Physiology & Performance PhD
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
📱 Check out our app → Saturday: Pro Fuel & Hydration, a performance nutrition coach in your pocket.
Join us on YouTube → Saturday Morning | Ride & Run Faster and our growing Saturday User Hub
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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DrAlexHarrison wrote:
lightheir wrote:
And the more folks who enjoy riding, even into their retirement+ years means a safer and more understanding community for us cyclists down the road. I'm sure there will be a share of conflicts along they way between ebikes and normal bikes as the popularity grows, but I have faith it'll mostly benefit both sides of the equation, at least when it comes to staking out more road rights and safety compared to the prime danger in road cycling which is inattentive drivers.
Totally agree.

That's pretty much the reason I like e-bikes as well.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [jaretj] [ In reply to ]
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jaretj wrote:
DrAlexHarrison wrote:
lightheir wrote:
And the more folks who enjoy riding, even into their retirement+ years means a safer and more understanding community for us cyclists down the road. I'm sure there will be a share of conflicts along they way between ebikes and normal bikes as the popularity grows, but I have faith it'll mostly benefit both sides of the equation, at least when it comes to staking out more road rights and safety compared to the prime danger in road cycling which is inattentive drivers.

Totally agree.


That's pretty much the reason I like e-bikes as well.

I think the aid from e-bikes relies on the same goodwill normal pedal-only powered bikes behave in public. If e-bikes largely obey rules and are largely victims to the whole car crew, it will help.

For the US though, the more that treat them as cheapo dirtbikes or a "legal funny business" around no mopeds in certain areas like greenways....that won't help.

Living in Raleigh I'd say so far it's been 50/50. 50% legit commuters and legit users. The other 50% have been unregulated might as well be "dirtbikes" blasting around greenways, neighborhoods, and even delivery businesses. I was crossing the street with my kids this past weekend downtown and this delivery rider going easily 35 in a 25 on an unregulated throttled e-bike flew past us weaving around folks.

That behavior won't win us any victories. Unfortunately, how regulation and rule following in the US goes, it'll wind up being an everyman/woman for themselves deal of the wild west.

So far, I'd say we're not benefiting from it how we could.

I've been to Europe, over there it's a commuter's tool and a holiday explorer's tool. In the US, so far I feel like it's become just another electronic "toy" like hoverboards and "onewheels". Which is sad, as I see the e-bike as a possible savior for the bicycle.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [windschatten] [ In reply to ]
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windschatten wrote:
In my affluent neighborhood, a couple 8-10 yo kids ride eMTBs that by my assessment must easily go 25+ mph.
Speed kills.

I think its the abrupt lack of speed that kills.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [windschatten] [ In reply to ]
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windschatten wrote:

50km/h, that's moped territory.

Isn't an ebike essentially a 'moped'? Ebikes are fine with me but they do not belong on trails or greenways where motorized vehicles are prohibited and certainly don't belong on sidewalks where people seem to want to ride them.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
I was just talking with my wife about s many pandemic ebike riders out moving at speeds they are not used to because pre pandemic they never rode now they are often riding 35-50kph with way less bike riding and handing experience.

But I have to say you can see how happy people are being out with the motor assist. More happy people on two wheels is good.

This^

Life got in the way and I let my riding lapse. 30kg later, sneaking up on 65 and I'm finally back on the bike. A guy flew by on a fat eBike yesterday on the flats. Thankfully I heard him coming. Weaving around, never pedaling and no helmet. But the kid was clearly enjoying himself.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [hobbyjogger] [ In reply to ]
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Ebikes are no worse on multi-use trails than regular bikes assuming they keep to the same speeds. I see a lot of riders on regular bikes blasting along at 20+mph passing families walking and kids on training wheels...it's the speed that's the issue regardless of the type of bike.

One nice thing about Ebikes is they usually have a bright headlight, so when I see the biker catching me and I'm trying to hold them off, my ego can relax a little. I see quite a few of them on my commute around Portland.

We bought one for my wife a couple years ago and she and I could sort of ride together...she'd crush me on the hills but I'd have to take it slow on the flats. She now prefers to ride her gravel bike, so we use it for family rides and my 11 yr old rides it while I ride a tandem with the 9 yr old and the wife on her gravel bike. The 11 yr old can ride away from my wife and will stay with me up to 20mph (where the motor no longer assists).
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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I had a very similar experience with a 70 year old drafting off me while going into a headwind for at least a mile and a half. Then he came around and said... "I have this motor, maybe I should be doing the work". We laughed and he told me the bike has let him do 70-100 mile days and go up hills that his knees just can't take anymore.

Most of my older neighbors have upgraded their MTB's to eMTB's. They've all raved about them. Basically saying the same thing... "this let's me ride for longer with less pain and more fun."

I'm all for them as long as people don't treat them like the e-scooters that popped up in all the major US cities. Riding on sidewalks, blasting by ped's and dogs, & not following traffic signs.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [hobbyjogger] [ In reply to ]
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hobbyjogger wrote:
windschatten wrote:


50km/h, that's moped territory.


Isn't an ebike essentially a 'moped'? Ebikes are fine with me but they do not belong on trails or greenways where motorized vehicles are prohibited and certainly don't belong on sidewalks where people seem to want to ride them.


It’s all fun and games until people abuse the privileges with serious consequences.
There is already talk banning them from certain multi-use trails, similar to Europe. I think everything stronger than Class-1 should be treated as motorized vehicles (insurance), and not be allowed on multi-use trails.

Otherwise I predict that by the time I can’t ride my regular bike anymore, it likely will be impossible to ride any assisted two wheelers on public trails.
Last edited by: windschatten: Mar 31, 21 14:53
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [windschatten] [ In reply to ]
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In 5 to 10 years 99% of bikes sold will be e-bikes, e-bikes will only get lighter with more range and power and handle better, people will be riding them at speeds faster than pro cyclists (excluding technical descents), and pro racing will disappear because no one will want watch them riding slower than the average Joan/Joe on their e-bikes.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [Geraldaut] [ In reply to ]
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Geraldaut wrote:
Fortunately we have a fighting chance against road legal electronic-assisted bikes (limited to 250w and 25km/h). I use myself a short-tail e-cargo to bring my 10 year old to school. I still sweat as you just tend to ride faster...

For giggles, I want to take our Urban Arrow (one of the big dutch front loaders) up a real climb at some point. Even with assist, I'm guaranteed to get a good workout (the bike empty is ~100lb).
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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lightheir wrote:
when they just go blowing by you and you desperately scan their BB to look for the bulbous apperance of the e-bike (the high pitched whine also gives it away)

I have decided that everyone who passes me up hill, is on an ebike.. so I don't need to look.. </pink>

mostly they are older folks, which as you say is great, love to see it.

really starting to think about an ebike for the commute to work, should that ever happen again.
Biking to work means 3 showers a day which is ridiculous - one going, after lunchtime workout (run/gym/swim), one coming home.

There are homebrew kits to make any bike an ebike, probably will go that route just for the fun of tinkering..
Bafang BBSHD 1000 Mid Drive Kit - IN STOCK! (lunacycle.com)
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [doug in co] [ In reply to ]
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did anyone notice that strava now has ebike category? with kom/qom segments - the whole 9 yards. what is next strava for cars - is there something like that already?
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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synthetic wrote:
did anyone notice that strava now has ebike category? with kom/qom segments - the whole 9 yards. what is next strava for cars - is there something like that already?

What's next? Strava for supershoes!
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [OV105mover] [ In reply to ]
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OV105mover wrote:
In 5 to 10 years 99% of bikes sold will be e-bikes, e-bikes will only get lighter with more range and power and handle better, people will be riding them at speeds faster than pro cyclists (excluding technical descents), and pro racing will disappear because no one will want watch them riding slower than the average Joan/Joe on their e-bikes.

With that logic, no one would ride conventional bicycles because we can ride mopeds. But many ride human powered bicycles.

In 10 years, e-bikes will have more battery endurance and more power. That will just making pedaling redundant and they will be the equivalent of completely motorized.

But there will always be a market for 100% human powered bikes just like humans go for runs because its just hard exercise. Humans can get around on paddleboard faster than swimming, but they also swim because it may be slower and not as fun (for most people), but people just swim.

Human powered bikes will not go away. The good news is the random motorist can't tell who is on electric power and who is on human power. But there are more two wheelers on the road. More two wheelers on the road is good for us relative to 4 wheel motor powered vehicles.
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Nearly 1/2 of all Americans can't swim. How many do you think can't ride a bike?
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Re: Got crushed by 3 ebikes yesterday and it was awesome! [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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It will definitely be harder to get non-ebikes. I think there will still be lots of options for non-ebikes under $2000, and I still think you'll be able to buy team replica DA/Red spec. bikes for $8000+. But for the $4000 bike, Ultegra vs. an e-bike with 105/tiagra, I think people will go for the e-bike 99% of the time.

Sadly, I think the mountain bike is going this way. Singletrack climbing trails have popped up in a lot of places, but for riders lacking the power, they really tire you out compared to doubletrack that has been worn in.

I enjoy watching car trips replaced by e-bikes and e-cargo bikes but a lot of time, the boomer crowd who criticized younger generations for participation trophies and instant gratification is just using e-bikes to cover more ground after driving to the greenway, going at speeds which are inappropriate for such congested pathways.
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