Login required to started new threads

Login required to post replies

Prev Next
Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent
Quote | Reply
Last time I was doing much running I owned a Garmin 920xt and the run pace seemed pretty consistent and stable. I’ve recently started running again and am using a Garmin Fenix 3 and the displayed run pace is all over the place, to the point of being useless. On today’s run, I had autolap set for every km, and the time varied by 5 or so seconds per km across the whole run (20km). The speed displayed however would vary by as much as 2 mins per km, so that you actually had no idea what speed you were actually running. This seems totally different to my old 920 which felt fairly accurate. Are people finding other newer Garmin better? Stryd better? On my easy runs I don’t really care about pace, but on threshold/tempo runs I want to know.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
rmt wrote:
Last time I was doing much running I owned a Garmin 920xt and the run pace seemed pretty consistent and stable. I’ve recently started running again and am using a Garmin Fenix 3 and the displayed run pace is all over the place, to the point of being useless. On today’s run, I had autolap set for every km, and the time varied by 5 or so seconds per km across the whole run (20km). The speed displayed however would vary by as much as 2 mins per km, so that you actually had no idea what speed you were actually running. This seems totally different to my old 920 which felt fairly accurate. Are people finding other newer Garmin better? Stryd better? On my easy runs I don’t really care about pace, but on threshold/tempo runs I want to know.

What terrain is in the area. I have a 735XT which struggles in built up areas or where there are lots of trees. Garmin bike computer also is inaccurate in built up areas.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [TIT] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Good point, should have mentioned. I was mostly running in an area with few trees, and mostly single storey buildings set back a bit from the road. There’s a long section (4 or so kms) where I’m running along the edge of a beach, with houses on the other side of the road - probably about as good as you could get in terms of view of the sky, but pace varied just as much along that section. Occasionally you’d pass under 1 tree, but there would only be 1 or 2 every 500m or so.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I had a Fenix 3 and experienced the same. It pissed me off when running some tempo alongside my buddies and my watch were way off and their 720xt was more or less on point with each other’s.

My Fenix 3 should just be within 50 meters of a tree, and it will tell me I run 1-2 mins slower pr k.

It eventually broke. And as cheap as I am, I bought a used 720xt.

Now I’m a happy guy again.

Morten Falk Størling
Blog l Instagram l Facebook
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [MortenFalk] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Yeah, mine was jumping between 6 mins per km and 4 mins per km. Kind of pleased to know that it could just be the Fenix 3 that was crap, though don’t really want to buy a new watch, but will if I have to. May look out for something second hand as well. Pick up another 920 as that was awesome.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I wore a Fenix 3 as my main watch for around 5 years. Most places it was pretty accurate, but there were places where it just coudln't get/keep a good signal, and would have me bouncing all over the place, so of course that woudl speed up what it thought my pace was. Some were places that made sense (busy/dense parts of Hong Kong that I'd run early in the morning), but there's one area that's not that dense but for whatever reason it never got a good signal in.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Are you looking at the 'instant' pace or using the auto lap to give pace ever km / half mile? I found pace with footpod a lot more realistic, and so have one on for whenever I'm doing intervals, but for long steady runs then I just autolap at 1km and that gives me the info I need - Turns out I can be very very consistent in run pace over a km without any interim feedback.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [Duncan74] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Both. The auto lap for pace over 1km is very consistent, the instant pace is all over the place. For long steady runs that doesn’t bother me, just for tempo runs when I find my effort can drift, or I start too fast etc. I did wonder about a footpod - I used one with a Polar 6 or 7 years ago and found it was very dependant on calibration, and I had to calibrate it at the start of every run a maybe my gait changed with fatigue level?
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Garmin footpods work fine for me. They have Auto calibrate which is fine unless the start of your run is on an s shaped boardwalk like mine often was.

There's a good programme that lets you get a really accurate calibration from a few runs.

And the Garmin one is way more sophisticated than the old Polar ones.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I have a Fenix5 and it has the same issues; pacing is all over the place. I'm using a Stryd for pace now and it works extremely well.

ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I use mapmywalk to determine where each mile marker is.

Then I look at my Timex Ironman watch's stopwatch to see how many minutes it took to run that mile.

Super accurate.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I usually map all of my runs and cycling beforehand. Then I use Forerunner 620 or my newer 235. Both of those Garmin's work generally the same in similar portions of my routes. Sometimes just taking it old school to plan out is better.

There are times where you don't have the luxury and have to depend on the garmin to keep a good signal.

The worst results I have had with any device is the apple watch. no matter the app the miles are short and I have gone so far as to wear both watch's to check it and on a 22 mile run I am missing 6 -8 tenths of a mile or close to a mile. frustrating but I expect it now. Sad also because I like to have the feature to call home if I need it etc.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [Duncan74] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
That’s great feedback - thank you. I’ll look into a Garmin footpod, unless people think it’s worth shelling for a Stryd?

I ran along an S-shape boardwalk yesterday, but at the midpoint of my run. The first few kms are pretty much straight, whichever direction I go from my house.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
jimatbeyond wrote:
I use mapmywalk to determine where each mile marker is.

Then I look at my Timex Ironman watch's stopwatch to see how many minutes it took to run that mile.

Super accurate.

Which is great if I’m doing a long steady run, but I already know my pace stays pretty consistent so that part isn’t he issue. It’s the instantaneous pace during a tempo run that I’m interested in, and I don’t want to have to only get two markers of it if I’m doing 2km intervals. But thanks for your helpful contribution. As always.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
rmt wrote:
jimatbeyond wrote:
I use mapmywalk to determine where each mile marker is.

Then I look at my Timex Ironman watch's stopwatch to see how many minutes it took to run that mile.

Super accurate.

Which is great if I’m doing a long steady run, but I already know my pace stays pretty consistent so that part isn’t he issue. It’s the instantaneous pace during a tempo run that I’m interested in, and I don’t want to have to only get two markers of it if I’m doing 2km intervals. But thanks for your helpful contribution. As always.


For that type of run, I would do it on a track so I know exactly how many seconds for each segment.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
jimatbeyond wrote:
rmt wrote:
jimatbeyond wrote:
I use mapmywalk to determine where each mile marker is.

Then I look at my Timex Ironman watch's stopwatch to see how many minutes it took to run that mile.

Super accurate.

Which is great if I’m doing a long steady run, but I already know my pace stays pretty consistent so that part isn’t he issue. It’s the instantaneous pace during a tempo run that I’m interested in, and I don’t want to have to only get two markers of it if I’m doing 2km intervals. But thanks for your helpful contribution. As always.


For that type of run, I would do it on a track so I know exactly how many seconds for each segment.

Again, which is great if you happen to have a track near you.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
rmt wrote:
jimatbeyond wrote:
rmt wrote:
jimatbeyond wrote:
I use mapmywalk to determine where each mile marker is.

Then I look at my Timex Ironman watch's stopwatch to see how many minutes it took to run that mile.

Super accurate.

Which is great if I’m doing a long steady run, but I already know my pace stays pretty consistent so that part isn’t he issue. It’s the instantaneous pace during a tempo run that I’m interested in, and I don’t want to have to only get two markers of it if I’m doing 2km intervals. But thanks for your helpful contribution. As always.


For that type of run, I would do it on a track so I know exactly how many seconds for each segment.

Again, which is great if you happen to have a track near you.


I have seven tracks within two miles of my house, so I didn't even think of that.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Wow!! That would make life easier, though in truth I think I’d get bored running round a track for 30mins of tempo when I could be running along beside the beach.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Yep I worked out the autocalibration was mainly the first KM. So if that was wavy then it calibrated your pace assuming a straight line and then the pace it reported was slower than I was actually running by about 20s/km. Yet was spot on when on auto cal and I was running my other default course that started 'straight'.

The garmin pod (and stryd, etc) use accelerometers that measure the stride length, where the old gen 1 polar ones you entered your stride length, which of course did vary. The calibration is pretty minor and accounts for any odd toe flicking / scuffing that you do - it reports stride length.

Having said all of this, what you can also do is for your run intervals is nstead of showing the instant pace, show the average pace of the interval. First 10 seconds may be a bit eratic, but after that then assumign you are running fairly consistently that will give you the feedback to go harder / slower to get the average on track for that specific interval. Just a small tweak to the data field (or add average as another field).
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
rmt wrote:
Wow!! That would make life easier, though in truth I think I’d get bored running round a track for 30mins of tempo when I could be running along beside the beach.

There is a reason to run at a track with only a watch, just like you go to the pool and swim on a pace clock from time to time. Its about tuning in pace and perceived exertion. As you mentioned, your pace will be quite consitent on a 400m with very little feedback. After a while, you should know your pace per lap within 1 second without looking at your watch. Just peak at it at 200m and 400m and you will see how close you are. After a while you know your pace. If you are going by miles, then 8 min mile is 2 min per 400m, or 1 min per 200m or 30 seconds per 100m. I picked this example because it is an easy one, but if you're doing 7 min miles, then its just 1:45 per 400m, or 26 seconds per 100m....you get the picture. pretty soon you know your lap splits by heart for any given pace.

This is also why sometimes you want to ride TT's with your power meter covered over and just go by feel, and later download the file and see what you did. If you do a TT loop enough with and without your power meter, you'll converge on almost the exact power numbers, because this is all your body and brain can sustain.

There is no way you should get bored running around a track for 30 minutes if you're running with purpose, and tuning your pace into split times and staying on top of those 30 min should go by in a flash. If you said 90 min or 120 min, OK, I see your point, but then even repeating a pyramid like 400m, 800m, 1600m, 3200m, 1600m, 800m, 400m with 100m jogging in between each interval and you did 10km at the track totally tuned into pace. Bring your GPS on the run for fun, but you can just focus on time and track distance and ignore GPS instantaneous pace going all over the place and pissing you off (yes, I have Fenix3 and 735 and its just annoying hoping those devices give anything meaningful)
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
devashish_paul wrote:
rmt wrote:
Wow!! That would make life easier, though in truth I think I’d get bored running round a track for 30mins of tempo when I could be running along beside the beach.

There is a reason to run at a track with only a watch, just like you go to the pool and swim on a pace clock from time to time. Its about tuning in pace and perceived exertion. As you mentioned, your pace will be quite consitent on a 400m with very little feedback. After a while, you should know your pace per lap within 1 second without looking at your watch. Just peak at it at 200m and 400m and you will see how close you are. After a while you know your pace. If you are going by miles, then 8 min mile is 2 min per 400m, or 1 min per 200m or 30 seconds per 100m. I picked this example because it is an easy one, but if you're doing 7 min miles, then its just 1:45 per 400m, or 26 seconds per 100m....you get the picture. pretty soon you know your lap splits by heart for any given pace.

This is also why sometimes you want to ride TT's with your power meter covered over and just go by feel, and later download the file and see what you did. If you do a TT loop enough with and without your power meter, you'll converge on almost the exact power numbers, because this is all your body and brain can sustain.

There is no way you should get bored running around a track for 30 minutes if you're running with purpose, and tuning your pace into split times and staying on top of those 30 min should go by in a flash. If you said 90 min or 120 min, OK, I see your point, but then even repeating a pyramid like 400m, 800m, 1600m, 3200m, 1600m, 800m, 400m with 100m jogging in between each interval and you did 10km at the track totally tuned into pace. Bring your GPS on the run for fun, but you can just focus on time and track distance and ignore GPS instantaneous pace going all over the place and pissing you off (yes, I have Fenix3 and 735 and its just annoying hoping those devices give anything meaningful)


Exactly!

I used to run with Leslie White, who was the D2 national champion in the 5K and 10K.

We would regularly do 20 x 1/4 miles on the track at 75 seconds with 15 seconds rest between each. You get to the point that you know exactly what the time will be by peaking at your watch once or twice during the lap.

We were also humbly watching Mark Conover running on the track with us and he was doing 1/2 miles in 136 seconds over and over and over. (For those who don't remember, he won the US Olympic marathon trials in 1988.)
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Which is all very well if you have a track nearby. But we’ve just turned a 1hr training session into a 2 1/2 hr session. And maybe I was exaggerating when I said get bored, but since there is absolutely no actual benefit to running on the track, I’d prefer to run somewhere with a great view. I’m aware people train for different reasons, and some may prefer to do sessions on the track, but personally I’d prefer to do them nearer to home where possible.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
rmt wrote:
Which is all very well if you have a track nearby. But we’ve just turned a 1hr training session into a 2 1/2 hr session. And maybe I was exaggerating when I said get bored, but since there is absolutely no actual benefit to running on the track, I’d prefer to run somewhere with a great view. I’m aware people train for different reasons, and some may prefer to do sessions on the track, but personally I’d prefer to do them nearer to home where possible.


There actually is a benefit to running on a track.

You get to feel what a specific pace feels like and it becomes very easy to replicate on the road.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Which is entirely academic, since I don’t have easy access to a track. And In terms of what I’m trying to achieve with my running, there will be zero benefit to doing the sessions on a track, even if for some people there may be a benefit.
Quote Reply
Re: Garmin Fenix 3 run pace VERY inconsistent [rmt] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
rmt wrote:
Which is entirely academic, since I don’t have easy access to a track. And In terms of what I’m trying to achieve with my running, there will be zero benefit to doing the sessions on a track, even if for some people there may be a benefit.

Although after this thread you are getting atuned to going around in circles.... ;-)

I have a track that's free and about 400m from my office. I do use it probably twice a month in normal situations, more when recovering from injury. But I also have some other routes where there's markers I use for intervals - mainly time based intervals where I have a letterbox/driveway that's the target for a 7/10 effort in 2 mins, then there's the roadsign further up the road when I'm at 8/10, etc.

I think this is one of those things where once you've done this for a while you do have that feel. But the footpod is a great tool to be able to teach yourself that feel, and that's why some are saying 'not needed' but others are saying it it is handy. If you've done hundreds of hours on the track in the past, no need. If you're fairly new to structured pact training then the tools available now are fantastic and replace the team coach stood beside teh track with the stopwatch yelling at you.
Quote Reply

Prev Next