so then LA could come out about 1999 this year right? Would he have to wait until '08 to come out about 2000 and so on and so on?

Thankfully, there's no statute of limitations on being considered a dumbass, though.

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Dan DeMaio
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Life is like riding a bicycle.
To keep your balance you must keep moving.
- Albert Einstein

But I think the TdF has the final say. The irony is that if they strip the TdF from Riis, the winner will be the person who finished 2nd that year (obviously). And I'm sure he is clean. (I wish I knew where my "pink" font was)

I would reserve "dumbass" for someone who does something without thinking - ya know stupid-like.

Dopers are cheaters and shitheads who claim to love the sport but then do the exact thing that will kill it.

but you are right - Thankfully there is no statute of limitations on cycling fans perceptions of racers - dumbass or shithead.

Ullrich kind of comes off as a dumbass to me, but Riis definately appears to be a shithead ;)

There is for fans too...
Virenque's fans were ready to hang him in 98 and he was applauded when he came back
all clean and ready to show you didn't need to dope to win in cycling and won Paris Tours...

i start liking that pink, helps the slow thinkers

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CAMPAGNOLO GRAN FONDO NEW YORK

Well, who would they give it to? Laurent Dufaux? Riis doesn't really lose anything because it's past the 8 year mark. That Mr. 60% doped has been an open secret for years.

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"Can’t I just start alone? I don’t need a team. All I need is a mechanic and a car!"-Jens Voight http://velonews.competitor.com/...lgem-and-more_108891 "

huh...that was what I wrote in the OP...

I'll elaborate on my post. Legally he's past the 8 years (as you said.) But the TDF (re:NJSteve's post) would have to seriously think before stripping Riis of his title because they would be looking at years of arbitration to determine who was clean. Bad publicity...

In the court of public opinion he was already a doper (albeit only allegdly until his admission.) Anyone who hired him would have already known the repution Riis was bringing with him, so Riis' admission doesn't really change anything except confirm what everybody already knew.

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"Can’t I just start alone? I don’t need a team. All I need is a mechanic and a car!"-Jens Voight http://velonews.competitor.com/...lgem-and-more_108891 "

So if Riis gets stripped, Ullrich gets the title? WTF?

Ironically, the woman who was charging Jan Ullrich has dropped the charges because it's now clear that it was not something of one man but an organised doping at Telekom and then T-mobile...

If Ullrich gets the title, I'm gonna puke.

How about Lance?:P

OK, so lets say Jan gets the title Riis holds now..... then Lance decides to come clean..... wouldn't that make Jan, the Boy Blunder, the winningest TdF rider ever?

ALLEZ JAN!!!!!!!!

I'm curious, Francois...where do you fall out on Riis's suggestion that the past is in the past and we ought to accept that it happened, and move forward...

I think I agree with him. 1996 happened. We can't undo that result...and what would be the result of undoing it? Who then? I say, simply accept it happened (and it happened before that...has happened since then...and continues to happen). Open the vault on cycling. Then let's sort out what the policy ought to be. It's too hard to talk about the issue when there is a huge amount of material that simply can't be discussed because of the secrecy.

The doors will REALLY start opening when the DS and other management community comes forward with these revelations. When Godefroot or, heaven forbid, Guimard come out about what they supported (or enforced) then we'll see a wholesale cleansing.

Despite the holier-than-thou attitude of some internet posters everwhere, I think the public is ready to get it in the open and have REAL discussion about it.

Then again, maybe the public is just apathetic on the subject.

I'm not saying anything about Lance in 1999, but from 2000-2005 he was the most tested athelete on the planet. There are stories of the UCI Vampires finding him on vacation and requesting samples. After over 80 in competition and 250 "random" tests over those years, there would be something showing.

Of course the tinfoil hat conspiracy theorists would say that Lance was using some super duperm super secret doping regime and formula that utilize unkown chemicals and combinations to haul his ass to the top. How about, just maybe, he used a Texas size potion of whoop ass and took it out on his fellow riders?

Of course Lance is clean. He is the greatest talent ever and doping is not helping your performance.... It must be that way since he crushed all dopers such as Ullrich, Basso, Hamilton, Mancebo, Heras, Landis and so on.

I'm not saying he is or is not clean, but before we allow supposition and Frankie Andreu's wife's testimony convict him, shouldb't we have hard proof like, I dunno, a positive drug test?

Bob

I agree 100%, but remember that Ullrich and Basso never tested positive during competition either.

He is the greatest talent ever and doping is not helping your performance.... It must be that way since he crushed all dopers such as Ullrich, Basso, Hamilton, Mancebo, Heras, Landis and so on.

While I know you are being sarcastic and joking, that is the alternative to the conclusion that Lance did dope.

Quite the conundrum, eh? Perhaps, the all time worlds' greatest cyclist conducted his career right before our very eyes, and we never recognized it as such because of the masking provided by the dopers.

Or not.

While I don't think that there is a Deep Throat around that can provide direct evidence of doping in Armstrongs' case, I do think, to the collective relief of the doubters, that given enough time, and if Armstrong did dope, someone, somewhere, someday will come out with the story and evidence. It is just too hard to keep that buried forever, I think. On the other hand, for the Armstrong believers, either Armstrong and his immediate camp were just incredibly on top of everything and extremely loyal for nothing of any significance to come out of the woodwork in the last ten years, particularly in light of the bumbling efforts of other riders in the last few years, or else there really isn't anything there.

That, or just good ol' American ingenuity to get the job done and get it right, as compared to the bumbling efforts of riders from the "Old World" like France and Germany.

There, I think I have said enough to piss off just about everyone and get one hell of a flame war going. (Even if everything I said is legit.)

;-)

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Behold the turtle! He makes progess only when he sticks his neck out. (James Bryant Conant)
GET OFF THE F*%KING WALL!!!!!!! (Doug Stern)
Brevity is the soul of wit. (William Shakespeare)

from the nytimes today:

If Riis were to turn in his yellow jersey, the recognized winner normally would be the next highest finisher. But that was Ullrich, who was implicated in Operation Puerto. The third-place finisher in 1996 was Richard Virenque, who was the leader of a team that was kicked out of the 1998 Tour de France after a team car was found to contain large amounts of banned drugs.

Lance was a great cyclist but the greatest sorry dont think so look at the records of Mercex, Hinault and Coppi, Lance always claims Mercex to be the greatest.

If Jan and Pantani are de-classified from '98 TDF,

What does that make 3rd place man Bobby Julich?