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Fit question- what am I missing?
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In starting my quest in search of a new bike, I'm really trying to understand the fit articles on this site, and I think I get most of it. At least enough to be dangerous. I have one question that I can't reconcile in my mind, though. Looking at this diagram that Dan uses in his fit articles:



This all makes good sense and all, but if your hips are at a 90* angle and your shoulders and elbows are at a 90* angle, then your back can't be flat (parallel to the ground) unless your effective seat tube angle was 90*. To my knowledge, nobody rides at a 90* effective seat tube angle, yet everyone talks about getting a flat back. So which is it? Are people really riding at a ~12* back incline (with a 78* eff seat angle) or are people really riding with a flat back and a hip angle of less than 90*? If the latter, what is the most that you can depart from a true 90* hip angle and not impact power output significantly (or does this vary from person to person)?
Last edited by: jkatsoudas: May 12, 03 15:43
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Re: Fit question- what am I missing? [jkatsoudas] [ In reply to ]
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from the way that I understand what Dan is saying, you basically have a square box (3 sided) that is formed by the leg down one side, the back across the top, and the bicepts down the oppisite side from the leg. The leg side of the box is longer because the leg is a longer limb than the bicept. The leg to hip angle is 90 degrees, and the back - shoulder/bicept form another 90 degree angle. The forearms then form another 90 degree angle at the elbow. So the back is always flat, but not necessarily parallel to the ground. You then rotate this solid stick figure forward holding in place at the pedal based on how parallel to the gound you want your back. The variables here are top tube length and seat tube angle. How parallel to the ground you want your back to be will be predetermined by a certain extent by the seat tube angle. Then it is a matter of finding a bike with the right length top tube and/or using a combination of arm pad adjustment and stem length to maintain the shoulder/bicept 90 degree angle.

Of course I could be totally wrong in which case I am open to be corrected.

Mike Plumb, TriPower MultiSports
Professional Running, Cycling and Multisport Coaching, F.I.S.T. Certified
http://www.tripower.org
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Re: Fit question- what am I missing? [jkatsoudas] [ In reply to ]
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What you are missing is that the hip joint is below the level of the back when you are on the bike. The lower part of the back curves down to the hip.
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"flat" not equal to "horizontal" [ In reply to ]
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You can have a flat surface at any inclination to horizontal.

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Re: "flat" not equal to "horizontal" [brider] [ In reply to ]
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That was essentially my question, I guess. Does flat back equal parallel to the ground? I always took it to mean that trying to achieve a flat back meant trying to get the back parallel to the ground. I didn't take it to mean literally not having any curve in the back, since many people have a curve in the back (John Cobb back type 'B') and this is perfectly acceptable and not anything anyone tries to change. Art's explanation seems plausible to me, though, where the upper part of the back can be parallel to the ground but the lower back curves down to the hips. This would allow the hips to be lower than the shoulders and still have an upper back that is parallel to the ground. Is this it?
Last edited by: jkatsoudas: May 13, 03 6:29
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