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Fall Marathon Training Thread (2011)
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The third week of July typically starts the fall marathon training cycle.

Opening questions:

1. Who has a fall marathon on their schedule?
2. Which marathon are you doing?
3. What kind of training plan are you going with this year?
4. How's your training going?

For me, I'm heading back to New York for my first marathon in 16 years. I've downloaded a couple of plans, but haven't chosen a particular one to follow just yet. Also, I'm not sure if my 47 year old body can handle all those track sessions I've found in these plans.

Please post you progress on this thread.

What I do: http://app.strava.com/athletes/345699
Last edited by: Printer86: Nov 10, 11 13:39
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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I'm training for the wineglass marathon on Oct 2nd, it's my third marathon. Did my first marathon in 2001 and a trail marathon this memorial day. Hoping to run sub 3:05, but I'm really aiming for sub 3. I'm using Higeon's Advanced 1 plan maxing out with 65mpw. The first 2 weeks went good but I got the flu last week and was laid up on the couch from Tuesday till Friday. Hope to get back on schedule starting tomorrow and I hope it doesn't impact anything too majorly. Thanks for starting the tread
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [npage148] [ In reply to ]
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In lieu of a dedicated marathon plan, I've been doing a modified version of the BarryP plan. My typical week consists of 3 easy runs, 2 tempo runs and 1 long run.

I've built my mileage back up into the high 40's after doing some races in May and early June. This past week's runs were 6 miles easy, 9 tempo and 14 long. I may just stick with this plan for a while.

My biking has definitely taken a back seat to my running recently. I need to learn how to balance the two better.

What I do: http://app.strava.com/athletes/345699
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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I'm doing my first marathon, an early fall marathon for me on 9/11 in Pennsylvania. Hoping to qualify for Boston 2012 and go under 3:00. I only have eight weeks to go and am currently around 55 miles per week. I'm also doing AG Nationals on August 20th, so I'm heavily favoring run training and getting in around two swims per week and around 125 miles/week on the bike.

I'm using a modified Jack Daniels plan that I wrote from his book, Running Formula. I needed to include a few tris (including a HIM) in the plan, so my mileage has varied from a low of 38 miles to a high of 65 per week.

The plan has two 'Q' runs each week that usually include some threshold work, and I just logged my first 20-mile run this past week. Everything is going well so far (currently knocking on wood!).

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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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1. Who has a fall marathon on their schedule? Yes
2. Which marathon are you doing? Chicago
3. What kind of training plan are you going with this year? 8-week plan, 55mpw starting after multisport season ends on Aug 7. Basically, I do strength training on Mondays & Fridays, with three 1-hours runs between T, W, TH. Weekends are a 10 mile trail run and a long run ranging between 25-35K, 35K will be my long run. During 8-week program I only run - no cycling or swimming.
4. How's your training going? During multisport season, I run about 25-30mpw, running much faster than build-up for April marathon (Boston) so feeling pretty hopeful.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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1. Who has a fall marathon on their schedule?

I do, two actually, three if you count an Ultra Relay...

2. Which marathon are you doing?
Marine Corps, Philly, and Ragnar Ultra

3. What kind of training plan are you going with this year?

I'm using the Bob Villanueva Training Plan. It goes like this:

4-5 Mile Tempo Run: T, W (Done at lunch)
10 mile runs in hilly course: M, T or T, W
13 mile "Murder Run" at 30 secs faster than race pace: TH
16-20 Mile LR at Race Pace: S
8-10 Mile Backup Run: Sun
Off Day: Fri

Total Mileage: 70 miles on average

4. How's your training going?
Won't start dedicated training until August 15 or so, but fine so far.

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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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I'm planning on doing the Philly race in late November, and started training a few weeks back.

Training so far has been kind of painful.. Some minor nagging hip pain is pissing me off, and I'm finding myself abit unprepared for heavy mileage; basically took last week off as I felt overtrained.

Originally planned to go with the 55 mpw plan in Advanced Marathoning, but might settle for Hal higdons 18week plan. Goal is to go sub 3:20 but its lofty enough that it's a long shot.

--------------------------------
Swim. Bike. Run. Tacos. Not always in that order.
@ryan_hurley
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Macho Grande] [ In reply to ]
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If you are doing a half marathon each week at 30 seconds faster than your marathon race pace, do you normally race a half even faster than that? I always thought the rule of thumb was a :20 / mile pace difference between a half a and full race.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [torrey] [ In reply to ]
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I don't really like rule of thumbs, so the short answer is No. My avg pace in my marathon PR is 7:00, but my half PR is 6:30.

But the point of the "Murder Run" is to run stupidly fast (Last mile is usually in the 5:30 range) and suffer so that you can run faster in your race. It's a bit like the theory of track work (Run fast to run faster) but for 13 miles on a rally hilly course. Since I added these runs in, my Marathon PR has dropped from 3:15 to 3:06. I've simply learned to run faster.

Bob
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Macho Grande] [ In reply to ]
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My best Marathon is 6:54 pace. My best half is 6:24. So basically to do your programme I would need to run a PB half every week? seems a bit extreme.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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I'm doing the Victoria, BC, Marathon, on Oct. 9th. It's my first marathon, I have done 2 halfs and 2 HIM's.
I am using the Runner's World Smartcoach training plan, you enter a recent race time and it lays out the plan with paces for the workouts. Looks like 4days/week, with one day of either mile repeats or tempo runs, building to a max week of 76km. 3 days of slower running, at around 5min/km, with a goal pace of 4:19/km for the marathon, which ends up at around 3:02:xx for the race. I usually throw in at least 4X30 strides in to the slower runs to keep the leg speed.
I'm going to keep up the biking on the Rest/XT days, not sure if I'll add in a 5th day of running with bit of a shorter run.

I ran in pretty humid conditions yesterday and ended up with a blister on my heel, any tips for dealing with blisters with a long run coming? I bought some 2nd skin bandages but I haven't tried them out on a run with the blister yet.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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1. Who has a fall marathon on their schedule? YES
2. Which marathon are you doing? Inaugural Empire State Marathon in Syracuse, NY, Oct. 16
3. What kind of training plan are you going with this year? Hal Higdon's Advanced I program
4. How's your training going? Picking up the middle of the program this week. Just did my last HIM for the season yesterday, and took a couple weeks off of the program to finalize stuff for that race.

This will be my first marathon, and I want to put as much time as possible into the training, so I'm pretty much only running for the next couple months. I do plan on swimming three days per week, and hopefully starting the Finding Freestyle drills during the marathon training.

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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [rhayden] [ In reply to ]
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I'm not saying it'll work for everyone, but it works for me. It could also be that I'm simply not running fast enough in my half's and my PR is much lower.

The point of the workout is to run very fast for a bunch of miles. Sometimes it's closer to MP sometimes much faster. We simply run fast to get fast.

Bob
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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1) Yes
2) New York; shooting for ~2:47
3) A little bit of a hybrid. Kinda follow Pfitzinger, Daniels, sometimes go on my own. Nothing is set in stone, but I try to follow some principles.

- Volume: Between 60-75 miles per week. Not a ton of emphasis on the long run, but consistently running 10 miles a day. Hat tip to JoeO on this one.
- Tempo Run: Try to get in a temp run. Usually warm up 4-5 miles, tempo for 4-5 miles, and then cool down.
- Faster Work: Dont get to the track often, but will do a fartlek with some faster repeats. Will sometimes substitute with hills to ensure strength. Don't necessarily try to fly up the hills, often doing them at marathon race pace, but will do a circuit with 0.25 and 0.45 mile hills. Repeat 4-5 times. Like these workouts because they're tough but I generally recover well from them. Philosophically, I think hills are great for marathons, because I think strength/economy are more important than footspeed.
- Long run: Will get in a 15-20 miler every 2-3 weeks. As noted earlier, if you're running 10 miles a day, the long run is less important. Lots of 10-12 mile runs which put me at ~50% of the time that I will be doing the race.
- Ensure that a sufficient % of my running is on soft surfaces, as well as at a relaxed pace.

4) training is going well, except for a little crankiness in my left leg.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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Anyone using the Hanson's training plans? (http://runningtimes.com/...aspx?ArticleID=4447)

Been thinking about starting this within the next few weeks after an early August Tri.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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Printer86 wrote:
The third week of July typically starts the fall marathon training cycle.

Opening questions:

1. Who has a fall marathon on their schedule?
2. Which marathon are you doing?
3. What kind of training plan are you going with this year?
4. How's your training going?

Chicago Marathon. I have never used a training plan, I just kinda follow a basic pattern. Training in earnest doesn't really start until the second week of August. Very little cycling or swimming for me in August or September. Just running.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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i'm doing the san antonio rock and roll marathon on November 13th. I start my training next week. it will be my first, i'm hoping to finish in under 4 hrs. Not sure i should even be posting this, ya'll are running sub 3 hr marathons.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [sabot] [ In reply to ]
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sabot wrote:
i'm doing the san antonio rock and roll marathon on November 13th. I start my training next week. it will be my first, i'm hoping to finish in under 4 hrs. Not sure i should even be posting this, ya'll are running sub 3 hr marathons.

i'm using a training plan out of Runners World magazine.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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New York Ciy. I am using Pete Pftzinfgers 35-55 mile plan. I am starting week 3 and have hit all workouts per schedule. Looking at a sub 3:30. Feeling good........
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Dufflite] [ In reply to ]
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Yes I'm giving it a try, I'll find out how it works in early September.
I admit I am cheating a bit on the plan...my mileage is a bit higher and I don't take a rest day. Been putting in 60-65mpw. Longest long run has been 16. This differs from my other marathon training (this is my 9th one). The past few years I have been running 75-90mpw while training for Ultra's in addition to marathons. basically all the miles at an easy pace with a LR from 20-30 miles. So we shall see how less mileage with faster runs works out. I might not be a good test subject since I have good running base.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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1) Does 12/5 count as a fall marathon?
2) CA International in Sacramento.
3) Going to use the Pfitzinger 18/55 plan but start a few weeks into it to get through tri season and summer biking.
4) With a 12/5 race the plan officially starts 8/1.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Dufflite] [ In reply to ]
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I am using their plan for a race October 9 (Towpath near Cleveland) and am 4 weeks in. I really like it so far. To be honest though, I am not racing any tri's the rest of the year so running is 90% of my workouts. I hope to BQ-3:15.
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [shaka999] [ In reply to ]
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This is a great start to the fall marathon training thread. Everyone should try to post something each week to share how their training is progressing or how they've had to adapt along the way.

For me, I still have an Olympic Distance tri in August and a 1/2 Ironman in September. So, I still need to keep up with the biking and the swimming for 10 of the next 16 weeks.

Good Luck All.

What I do: http://app.strava.com/athletes/345699
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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [Printer86] [ In reply to ]
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I'll be doing the Scotiabank Toronto Waterfront in October; it'll be my first. I've got several 1/2 marathons, a HIM (Muskoka), and Around the Bay 30k successfully behind me. I'm starting into week 4/16 of Furman's Run Less, Run Faster plan. Three runs/week: long, tempo, and track intervals. It worked well for me in the past so I figure if it ain't broke...
It's great for multisport because the "cross-train" days called for are there on our schedules by default.
So far training's going well & I'm hitting my times.
It's funny, we know we shouldn't set time goals to our first efforts at new distances, but my predictors via MacMillan and Furman both point to the BQ time range, so I am using that as a carrot until such time as my 52 yr old knees tell me to re-jig my hopes.


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Re: Fall Marathon Training Thread [snail_male] [ In reply to ]
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My running went to a new level when I ditched the Furman 3x a week program and started to run every day. Perhaps your knee issues prevent you from running more frequently, but I don't think there's any correlation between how frequently people run and how frequently they get hurt. I used to do the 3/4 week thing and was hurt all the time. I run pretty much every day (maybe a couple off days a month), probably around 70 mpw now, and I feel better than ever and recover from runs more quickly. YMMV.
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