Login required to started new threads

Login required to post replies

Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter
Quote | Reply
Just wanted to share my experience about something that happened at an event. I want to share because I think the little details for event routes can make a big difference in a person's experience. The names involved are being kept out of it.

I think participants, organizers, and volunteers need to read this.

I've done all manner of events over a few years, and never had a problem. It's always been painfully obvious which way to go. From the pre-event maps, day-of announcements, signage, and volunteers and staff. I've done enough single and multisport events to know my way around. I'm not an idiot. Events with pretty complicated paths also.

To the little details............

At an event I attended I got a DQ for route deviation, rightfully so. Was it my fault? The details matter. And to me, the details say it wasn't my fault. Even if a DQ is the only solution in the instance.

If you:
-study the posted event map
-verify the posted event map at checkin the day-of with staff at checkin
-specifically ask at checkin the day-of about changes or details on certain parts
-follow on-course instruction

Then:
-you should arrive at your destination successfully

The details here that matter are:
-The route posted wasn't updated for changes.
-Staff at checkin did not say there was a route change when asked. Even when specifically asked about details related to the route.
-Staff or volunteer was not on-course at the at the point in the route they changed when I came through. They were jogging back to their place and did not provide sufficient direction and the signage there wasn't sufficiently clear to indicate the change in route. They couldn't, they were about 30 yards away from the route deviation.

I just ask that if you're supporting an event:
-If you're not sure, don't tell a competitor "yeah yeah, that's it". Seek assistance to find out.
-If you change the route, do your best to state the change to competitors at checkin, meeting, email, announcement, or something. Anything.
-Signs blow down. Some pavement markings may wash off in rain. Volunteers may walk off to the bathroom. If you DO change the route from what is published already.......make it painfully obvious which way to go.
-Don't be afraid to use some soccer cones or something to guide competitors. Or tape. Especially if you change something and won't be there to guide people.


It's an embarrassing and hurtful scenario to work for months for an event to get a DQ due to details like this. Please be aware how things like this can affect folks. I did everything possible to do what I was supposed to do in my opinion. I disagree with any assertion that I could have done anything more, anything more would have been almost harassing or excessive. A couple other competitors also had a problem with the route. So, it wasn't a one-off.

We appreciate the effort that goes into events, and know stuff happens, but just know that things like this can ruin something a competitor has worked hard for.
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Were you leading on the bike? Obviously this wasn't your fault, but you said it, the only solution was to give you a DQ since the results wouldn't be fair to everyone else. The race organizer is paying the cost in lost reputation if that happens enough. Usually there are red flags or a reputation of certain races doing these things. You've just got to voice your concern, and not do the race again.
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [ChandlerMyles] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
ChandlerMyles wrote:
Were you leading on the bike? Obviously this wasn't your fault, but you said it, the only solution was to give you a DQ since the results wouldn't be fair to everyone else. The race organizer is paying the cost in lost reputation if that happens enough. Usually there are red flags or a reputation of certain races doing these things. You've just got to voice your concern, and not do the race again.

I did voice my concern and want to keep their name or event private till I get a response.

Stuff happens. I get that. Just sharing so people consider the little things.

It was early for folks returning to finish in the event. Perhaps didn’t expect me back yet? Don’t know. All the easy obvious turns had several staff or volunteers directing. For some reason when I came thru this changed part they weren’t there. They were on the opposite side of the roundabout. The sign in the roundabout appeared to me to direct me the original route. It wasn’t where I’d put one for the change they made.

The majority of folks were directed thru fine. Not sure what the failure there was.

But, you’re right. All I can do is make a decision to ever return or not.
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
This happened to me, when the leadout bike took the lead pack of 4 runners (me included) off course, realized his mistake, took a shortcut back on course, and we finished .4 of a mile short on mileage. All 4 of us were DQed. I was pissed as hell, but kept it to myself. Then it was worth it to see the surprised look on the winner’s face, as he was several minutes back, and had no idea. He had never won before. I kept my own feelings to myself, even though a couple of the others made asses of themselves over it. That evening I got a email from the race director, with a big apology, and a free entry to a much larger, more expensive race. Worked for me, and was happy that I hadn’t made an ass of myself over it.

Athlinks / Strava
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [Dean T] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I had a similar experience last year. It was an Oly. On the swim some people missed a not too well placed cone on the beach going for round 2, luckily i didn't. It was at a recreational park area and transition was a patch of grass. In T1 i stepped on something sharp that made a hole in the bottom of my heel. My foot kept bleeding for the entire race, stains in my cycling shoes and running shoes. Tightened my cycling shoe as much as i could in order to try and stop the bleeding. Didn't work. Bike was 3 rounds, but there were no signs where to get off back to T2. With high speed and a tailwind i had to get to a full stop to ask one of the volunteers where to go. I'm a MOP athlete, but it bugged me that i had to stop and ask for directions. The run they shortened to half the distance due to the temperature, it was 32°C. I was not pleased. They did take good care of my foot after the finish though.
Oh well..... 2 weeks later i had my best race of the season. With my foot still opening up during the run from water to T1, a couple hundred yards on rough pavement, and bleeding all over the place. I had to run carefully because of the foot but crushed it on the bike, totally unexpectedly ending up 7th place in my AG( i expected to be around 20th at the most). That day i was pleased.
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I staff as many or more races than I race... having said that my run and bike(one discipline/event) courses I try to make them as obvious as possible. Soccer cones, cones, spray chalk, signs, duct tape arrows, caution tape, penant line lanes.. I use it all. If I'm not leading the first runner, I'll brief the person that is and the same with volunteers at all corners, aid stations etc. Run and bike course I'll sweep as the leaders come through to be sure we're good as well as giving them a rough timeline before hand... i.e. give them a rough time athletes will be passing them. Have to brief the lead motorcyclist too... seen that one go sideways too with a motorcycle going off course.

I was leading a race and an officer was parked in front of the turn arrow and not directing yet... sitting on a guard rail... sometimes leading races sucks but you have to know the course. Had a lead bike issue too when I was running... so when I'm the run course captain you know I'm doing my best. Stuff happens though... I had a group of volunteers re-cone an intersection once after I'd set it and explained what was happening... two cyclist went through before I got back and fixed it but double DQ for those guys.

I digress, I also review the documents the week of and will provide feedback if something isn't right. I'm definitely about safety and athletes having great races, up to and including not getting lost. That said some people are oblivious... had a cyclist blow through a turn last year, cones, signs, big arrows on the road, athletes making the turn AND a STATE TROOPER standing in the middle of the road directing traffic! Seriously!

There is a lot going on during a race and you have to be very on top of things or some peoples races can get ruined since DQs for more often than not race leaders in these scenarios is just bad.

Sorry to hear about your DQ.
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [xeon] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I don't have this problem. I just hope the second to the last guy in the race is good and I follow them. :)

Not a coach. Not a FOP Tri/swimmer/biker/runner. Barely a MOP AGer.
But I'm learning and making progress.
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
To me, the DQ doesn't make sense if you're not cutting the course (so long as you come back on at the same point you went off.

Last season I made a wrong turn and went off course twice. Both were really my fault, but I never got DQ'd. Seems a bit harsh for riding/running longer than everyone else.

Strava
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [gmh39] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
gmh39 wrote:
To me, the DQ doesn't make sense if you're not cutting the course (so long as you come back on at the same point you went off.

Last season I made a wrong turn and went off course twice. Both were really my fault, but I never got DQ'd. Seems a bit harsh for riding/running longer than everyone else.

Shorter. The parking lot piece was about 45 seconds longer than the other roundabout exit.
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Followup:

Zero response ever from event or from USAC.

I've decided I won't go back. They didn't roll out the podium for the individual race like most series do like crits, so there's no reason to go since I won't sniff the series points.

It's all in how they rolled the points also. It wasn't like 5,3,1 for top points. It rolled down from like 18 to zero. So, there's zero way to miss a race in the series and podium.

That's kinda crappy to me. Most crits at least roll out the podium for each race and toss out some medals and do some photos, then do prizes at the end of the series.

I'm going to target the USAC regional instead. I don't have time to drive 5 more times out there for nothing but a chip time (even if I win).

If I'm going to drive that much, I'll drive to the crit where I can double down on the 4/5 and 3/4 race same day.



Lastly: no idea how you IM and 1/2 IM folks have essentially often one big race per year. I can't imagine how I'd feel given that. I have a couple more shots this year. Big learning is don't put all the eggs in one basket, it even has happened to UCI pros before (of no fault their own).
Last edited by: burnthesheep: Feb 17, 20 12:51
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Good post. I have been at several races where things like this have happened unfortunately. Places where changes have been made or people working the events are making mistakes that causes people to be disqualified. Sometimes routes are horribly marked.

One that stands out to me was the 70.3 in outer Banks. Two or three years ago where the Olympic and 70.3 bike courses split the person's working at the split told almost a dozen people the wrong thing causing people on the 70.3 to ride a portion of the Olympic.
Messed up a lot of people's days.
Mind you erase like that is nowhere near as expensive as some of these branded races where can really be quite frustrating to have spent that money and have someone else's mistake screw up your day.
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I was first out of T1

Biked directly in front of the race director who I waved at and she said hi to me by name

10 or so minutes later I look back and see no one else

Coming out of T1 I turned right but was suppose to turn left. I’m an idiot. 😟

Later asked the race director “Why didn’t you say anything?”

Her reply

“Oh I thought you were just out training.”


😂
Quote Reply
Re: Event routes, problems, and disappointment......the little details matter [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
A few years ago I was leading a 5k when I came up to a police car at an intersection who was blocking the way forward. I turned right as did the next 4 guys (we had a big lead on the lady in 6'th). We followed the course back to the finish (it was a rectangle course so it didn't seem odd). After the race I was talking to the guy in 2'nd and we both thought the race seems about .1 mile short (which is not uncommon around here). Turns out after we turned the police car finished his "work" and left. The 6'th place woman watched it and told the RD. She led the rest of the race to the next right turn .05 miles up the road and then back to the finish. We were disqualified and she won. We were between 2 and 4 minutes faster. Have not gone back to the race. First time I've ever seen a 5k winning time over 21 minutes.

Talk about bad luck - who would have thought a police car (with lights on) would be on the race course in a wealthy neighborhood on a weekend morning and not part of the race...
Quote Reply