There is no doping in sport. Carry on...

but wait I thought USPS was the world's most sophisticated drug ring in history?-:)

on a serious note, this really does show the scale of it doesn't it? My money is not a name gets released. Not one. Well at least, not one from any sport that makes real money like soccer or tennis. Some CAT2 roadies will be outed I am sure. But otherwise no one gets outed.

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@rhyspencer

This is where the drug manufacturers have to be held accountable, just like the opioid crisis. Doesn’t any drug enforcement agency ask why so much of a drug is being produced and sold compared to the number of patients who are actually the ones the drugs are for? It is a fundamental rule of business to find out who your end users (for better marketing, product development, etc.), so I find it hard to believe that manufacturers can’t do anything to combat the easy access to their products.

lol did any of those responsible for the American opiod crisis really suffer any ramifications that are worth a shite?

A respectable viewpoint, but much of the contraband is produced by illegal producers...so hard to label manufacturers as the ones in the wrong.

None.

Quote from the UK Telegraph
“ At least 250 athletes in sports like cycling, triathlon and motor cross, in Spain and across Europe, bought the drugs.”

So the first two named sports are our own. Another obvious example that current drug testing isn’t effective and the demand for drugs are high.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-purdue-pharma-bankruptcy-factbox-idUSKBN1ZS1H3

This will probably go like the other situations in Spain, a headline and then.....silence..maybe a court case and then 'oh you can use those to identify anyone' rinse and repeat.

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"see the world as it is not as you want it to be"

“ At least 250 athletes in sports like cycling, triathlon and motor cross, in Spain and across Europe, bought the drugs.” //

I really really hope we get the names this time. But unfortunately probably a lot of soccer players on that list, and they seem to have an unusual power over Europes drug testers. If they have to bury all of the others in lesser sports to protect them, then that is what likely will happen. And 250 seems about the right number when you consider the shipment they caught. About 3 doses per person, if they indeed went to to all on the list(probably not though)


A lot of shades of operation Puerto here though, get the goods on a lot of folks, but then it suddenly the names that go with the blood disappear. I know we got a lot of inferences from that bust, but never really a full accounting. I think I remember because of the code names and such, they let it go somewhat. But all they really had to do was some dna testing, and they could have matched every single person. Think they just matched Ullrich and Basso. I found this paragraph about the case interesting, in case anyone was wondering how Spanish justice is handled in these cases;


"In January 2013, the Operacion Puerto trial went underway, and Eufemiano Fuentes offered to reveal the names of all the athletes who were his clients. Julia Santamaria, the judge presiding the trial, told Fuentes that he was not under obligations to name any athlete other than the cyclists implicated. Fuentes stated that he supplied athletes in other sports with drugs and said: “I could identify all the samples [of blood]. If you give me a list I could tell you who corresponds to each code on the [blood] packs.”[31]
On the 30 April 2013 Fuentes was found guilty and given a one-year suspended prison sentence. The judge also ruled on a request to hand over blood bags to the Spanish Anti-Doping Agency. The judge ordered the blood bags destroyed, but the anti-doping agency has appealed.[32] Additional appeals were filed by the Union Cycliste Internationale, the Italian National Olympic Committeeand the World Anti-Doping Agency, as well as by the prosecution.[33] On 14 June 2016, the original verdict against Fuentes was overruled and he was cleared of all charges. However, 211 blood bags from his laboratory are set to be handed over to anti-doping authorities for investigation.[34]"

Five-and-a-half years of prison is fairly legit.

Maybe not relative to say, other drug traffickers with 20 and 30 years sentences. But still.

Good. Like it says though a rare moment. He will come out rich too. Those fucks should be hung, but I digress.

Nothing much will come of this. Just like Aderlass. We Europeans protect our criminals quite well it seems.

I have no hard numbers to back this up but my gut tells me that 850 doses is a very, very small drop in the bucket compared to how many legitimate doses are used by cancer patients each year. So no, I don't think that the quantity of drugs used illegally in sport registers anywhere on anyone's radar.

Probably true, and I don’t think Amgen had any idea that EPO was being illegally used by cyclists.

*this*

The legitimate use of EPO for hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of cancer patients globally vastly outweighs the amount used as PED no matter how big the PED problem is.

I for one have had vials of EPO in my fridge, purchased legally from a pharmacy, for my mother in law and her liver cancer treatment.

I can say I was not tempted in the least as I have a blood clotting condition already and value my life over cutting another 20 minutes off my Ironman time.

Really hope they release all the names this time.

And this is the convenient justification that will continue to allow manufacturers not to take any responsibility for the use of their products. Oh, and vigilance would be expensive and could raise the price of cheap and affordable drugs.

And yet... The stigma of doping is so high, and not wanting to be even associated with it, means that a friend of mine with cancer, based in Brisbane, Australia, is not on EPO (or equiv) because he cannot find a doctor willing to prescribe it, even though it is legal for him to use, and would significantly decrease the time it takes to bounce back from the chemo.

Sure, Australia is a different place than Europe or the US, but the possibility to impropriety means that my friends quality of life suffers.

How is this a convenient justification?

The responsibility for NOT using legitimate drugs that are banned as PEDS begins with the user of the drug. How would an effective system of vigilance work, at any cost? I realize that Slowtwitch users are mostly US based so you may not be aware that in many, many jurisdictions around the world what are prescription drugs in the US are more widely available without a physician and licensed pharmacist, making it next to impossible for drug makers to verify legitimate use. This is not the drug manufacturer's fault; the relevant authorities should reflect on the trade-offs of better control of dangerous medications.

In Taiwan, I find it super convenient that I can refill my "prescription" contact lenses simply by visiting the Costco or any eyeglass store and telling them what I want no prescription required. When I was completing my masters back in Canada, I broke my glasses and needed to pay $300CDN to an optometrist to get a prescription that was identical to what I already knew that I required. So there are advantages of a less regulated medical system too.

I think to place the blame on EPO manufacturers is not the core of the problem related to PEDs. I bet that for knowledgeable people with simple facilities, it may not be that hard to produce EPO, but that is only my speculation.

Absolutely agree with you on this. I refused to go buy it for my wife because of that stigma too. And whenever I relate the story, I always get the nudge nudge wink wink from fellow athletes even though I am COMPLETELY anti doping and totally clean. Not fast enough to be tested, but every time I check in at Kona it's my dream that they think I'm suspicious cause I'm so fast. Hasn't happened yet! :)

How would an effective system of vigilance work, at any cost? //

It is actually very simple, and would add almost no more cost to the drugs. And it is something that has been asked of the drug companies, but thus far, doesnt seem they care. So maybe that market off the books is bigger than we think, because all they would have to do, is to put a marker in the drug. Something that does not metabolize, and stands out like a beacon in a drug test. Do that, and then you just have to deal with illegal manufacturers, which probably is a very small % of the sports abuse of these drugs.

But you can’t say because it’s difficult we will give the manufacturers a free pass. Amgen and other EPO manufacturers are billion dollar, very profitable companies. Are they funding efforts to reduce illegal use of EPO? I think it’s great that there are so many people helped by EPO, and if the manufacturers were government or non- profits then there could be a legitimate trade-off. But these are companies who are allowed to be void of any responsibility for a product that they profit from every dose sold, whether legal or not.

I normally like to stay as civil as possible here. But....what the hell is wrong with you? My wife gets prescribed EPO, I'm getting her the damn EPO. If one of my cycling buddies sees me with the prescription, mis-interprets, and reports, me, I'll fucking deal with that. My wife's health is more important than that nonsense.

It was for her mother in law. And in fairness, you have to sign some forms in Chinese and while I speak fluently, I don't read well. My wife is also a senior medical professional, so she knows what she is doing to when it comes to this. There were some decisions that needed to be made at the dispensary about the size of the vials etc. But...yes...my wife would fully fully support you on this! :)

But I did go get it for her the second time once we got that straightened out...and I truly felt like I should have been wearing a disguise, especially when they read out the conditions which I needed to agree to in order to pick up the prescription. Not to mention convincing them that the white guy standing in front of them is related to the Taiwanese woman for whom the prescription was ordered. :)