My understanding is that you can apply for a retroactive TUE, but you cannot be assured that it will be granted. Therefore if you really want to be safe, it is better to apply ahead of time.

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Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
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I think it depends how cut and dried your TUE is.

In my case (fungal tumour in my lung) it would have been concrete. If you have an acute condition that requires a short dose of a banned substance then it is perhaps not so clear.

Do you have any language in your club bylaws or membership documents regarding doping? I like the idea of informing club members about USAT/WADA rules regarding doping in a general way in the club newsletter/website if that hasn't been done recently.

I also think club members who have expressed to you that they have issues with this member's actions should be encouraged to respond to him directly if he mentions the treatment to them again. At the local racing level I think peer pressure is an important tool to use in trying to enforce racing rules. Of course, the members should be encouraged to be respectful (at least at first) when responding to the guy if he mentions the treatment again.

Considering there are pros out there one TUEs for testosterone...I suggest he jump through the hoops...or should have just stfu about it.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

who

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

Sure about that?

Alternate fact

Starky seems to be convinced.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

who

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

For a 400 member club, especially if there are dues, I feel there needs to be clear policy set and that policy needs to be distributed to all members as well as any prospective members. If there are any exceptions that are going to be made, I also feel that needs to be made public. If you do that, I think your decisions become a lot clearer to make.

Keep in mind that with a group of your size, this is not a one off scenario. I GUARANTEE you that you already have members who are knowingly doping on purpose for competitive advantage, knowingly doping for overall well being and don't take racing serious, or doping without even knowing they are doping. This case is rare to your group because the member disclosed their situation. That's the uncommon part.

That's your response? I keep waiting for you to post something more substantive, but I guess that's not going to happen. I'm convinced you're actually an elephant, so that, too, must be true?

RowToTri wrote:

My understanding is that you can apply for a retroactive TUE, but you cannot be assured that it will be granted. Therefore if you really want to be safe, it is better to apply ahead of time.

No picking on you (RowToTri) in particular, but I need to break in at some point.

All of the information that everybody is guessing/speculating on is available online at http://www.usada.org.

Beyond that.

1. Taking Testosterone is always against the rules for everybody UNLESS they get a TUE before they start taking the drug. Period. It may be like driving above the speed limit in that a person might never get caught, but it is always against the rules without the TUE. The guy in question at the Tri club is a "doper" no matter how fast or slow he is. It may or may not really matter, but he is doping either way.

2. For "non-elite" types of athletes there are some substances where you can get a TUE after the fact if it comes up in a sample. Some kinds of asthma or allergy medicines would fall into that category.
https://www.usada.org/substances/tue/


This checklist is really helpful. It is noteworthy that as a master's athlete who races at master's nationals and even master's worlds I would fall into the group of not needing a TUE for some substances. But I did race at the elite track nationals and if I took any substances that required an after the fact TUE at master's worlds (I don't) I would have needed a pre-race TUE for elites. And in fact I did get drug tested at elites because we set a master's national TP record. I also got tested after breaking a master's 40km record the following week. THEORETICALLY, I could have found myself with the situation where something came up in both samples. The elite nationals test would result in a sanction whereas the masters record test would have been fine and only required a post race TUE. i.e. a doctor's note as to why this medication was required.


DO YOUR HOMEWORK!


Seriously, anybody who is half way serious about their sport should at least spend a few minutes looking at the USADA web site on the off chance they get picked for a random test.


Here is the 2019 banned substances list.


Again, do your homework and save yourself a lot of grief.

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Kevin

http://kevinmetcalfe.dreamhosters.com
My Strava

My post was not about the guy on T but about the fungal infection...

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Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
Instagram • Facebook

As I said, my post really wasn't about you, but the thread in general. You're just the unlucky post that I replied to. :-)

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Kevin

http://kevinmetcalfe.dreamhosters.com
My Strava

He shouldn't be able to "compete" with other athletes but I think he should be allowed to participate if possible.

USADA has a rec athlete TUE, but it's pretty narrowly defined. You can't be a former elite athlete of any kind.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/...eoesophageal_fistula
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)

I really think that this is an approach that is needed in sport today.
So many people have medical issues that require medications that are potentially banned or require the tortuous process of getting a TUE, yet they want to have fun in the sport and participate and the sport itself can be an important part of therapy for that person.
The rules are unfortunately very black and white and don't really separate your elite/pro athlete, FOP age grouper etc to your just wanting to participate athlete etc.
The long term health detriments, from, for example, a low T are potentially very significant in males. It is opening up a can of worms but restoring T to a normal reference range for men in the same age group, as opposed to someone aiming for supra-normal T levels for a competitive edge are quite different scenarios. Yet they are not readily easy to separate with the current rules.
Shades of grey...???

I agree. My take, if a person has a true health issue, they should be able to be on proper medication, but should not take any awards from fellow racers, nor should they end up on the podium. If they do, they should just self disqualify for going too fast. But I see no reason to ban a person from enjoying our sport, if they have a medical condition. The sport needs to be more inclusive, if they think a MOP or BOP should be banned for 4 years for taking medication for a health condition.

Pointy end, record setters, IM qualifiers, top rankings, etc. should follow the doping rules, as they are written,

No you absolutely don't.

I can only speak for myself and the 'grouping' I am in, which is amateur (as opposed to being on a national team over some level - U23, olympic, on the whereabouts programme etc.) I don't know if being British and coming under the UKAD is different from how it is done in the US.[/quote]
Yes, you absolutely need a TUE before you get tested, except in limited circumstances, like emergency treatment or other relatively rare situations.

Yes, you absolutely need a TUE before you get tested, except in limited circumstances, like emergency treatment or other relatively rare situations.[/quote]


Dude, please get your facts right.

https://www.ukad.org.uk/medications-and-substances/tues/


Click on the advance and retroactive drop down menus and it will tell you when you do and don't need a TUE in advance if you are a British triathlete.

Late at the party, but hormone therapy, would you consider a transsexual guy as doping? I know I do...

https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/latest-news/rachel-mckinnon-becomes-first-transgender-woman-win-track-world-title-397473

Welcome to 3 weeks ago, pointless!

In all seriousness though, I am anti-doping and think very little of AG athletes who take their hobby way too seriously and dope to win awards and swag. Come on, get a life. But I also view triathlon as a hobby.. a good one, a sport, an intense recreational activity with healthy competition against yourself and others, but still just something you do for fun. If someone truly has a medical condition that requires them to receive medication that contains a banned substance, I have a hard time telling that person - sorry, you can't compete anymore. I know someone who spent 3 years on and off prednisone for a condition, it's the only thing that got him through those 3 years and during that time he trained lightly and raced for fun because he simply enjoyed it. Do you want to tell that guy he can't even sign up to do something that was for pure enjoyment, because in "real life" he's on a drug that basically kept him alive until his doctors got a good handle on the whole problem?

Perhaps, but where do they sit within that range?
Are they T-supplementing to the bottom of low-normal for their age range, or to the top for their age range, or to their T-level at 20? I don't think there are many who are going to say, "ok, that's enough there".

Having done whereabouts, TUEs, "random" testing and the like for years, I question the need for a 'recreational' TUE, and think that the standards in the Non-National athlete part of USADA are broad enough to apply to all who aren't trialling nationally. If you need to apply for a TUE, don't compete whilst it's being deliberated upon. It it's denied, don't compete. Your life is not your racing, and you're not going to be defined by race x - and it's not your living. The rationale of 'oh, I'm only midpack anyway' is one I hate: so what? You're still not racing as you are.

You said "you absolutely don't." I missed the part about "only speaking for myself."

I think the better term would be "I absolutely don't." Because most people do.

That seems like insane policy though. To get tested, and then sort out what might or might not be legal to use after the fact.

You might want to show him this article.

https://www.usada.org/...pts-doping-sanction/

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Kevin

http://kevinmetcalfe.dreamhosters.com
My Strava