I'm in a similar position in that i brought an aero road bike and added clip-ons (Giant propel) and have done a 2:30 bike split or slightly better in quite a few 70.3's now. The reasons i want to get a tri bike are

1. Better hydration and nutrition integration
2. A better overall position
3. They look cool

And the reason for the second one is purely so i can run faster off the bike, I actually don't expect to go faster on the bike at all by getting a tri specific bike.

I would imagine you'd be better getting an aero helmet (I did) and a disc (I got a disc wheel cover for cheaper)

They just talked about this on the scientific triathlon podcast and basically said, even on the hilliest courses, tri bikes are faster than road bikes due to their more aggressive positions. I'm sure the added aero bars cut into that a bit but there's probably still a significant enough time savings from a tri bike.

https://scientifictriathlon.com/tts338/

Didn't the guest also say that the main reason to get a tri bike, as opposed to riding on a road bike with clip-ons in a relatively agressive position, was comfort?

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"FTP is a bit 2015, don't you think?" - Gustav Iden

Ill have to listen to the show. Overall I am happy with my position and my nutrition. I fill a waterbottle with my nutrition and use the tank for water.

I didn't know there was disc covers as an option haha.

I've never ridden a true tri-bike so I'm not sure how much more comfortable I could be.

If I were to switch bikes I would take a financial hit. I'm not sure what my bike is worth so I would have to sell. Then buy a new (used is fine) bike and cover the cost of a bike fit. I then would be without a road bike as well. I am okay with this, but are the gains I'd be looking at worth all that trouble and money. That's the hard question.

Are you close enough to KQ that a few watts will make a difference? If that's all that's keeping you from Kona, maybe it's worth it. You could save some money by purchasing a used high-end rim brake bike for now.

If not, you have a smoking bike and a reasonable set up right now. Maybe not pretty with the bottle installed, though.

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For the average person, I would highly recommend keeping what you have. Tri bikes suck to ride on for an average training ride unless you live in totally rural area and can just go out and ride. The time in and out of aero, on and off brakes/aero bars (which can be quite uncomfortable depending on how you set them up) is kinda miserable. But, if your interest in Kona is more than a daydream, and you don’t have funds for two bikes, then yes, it’s time to sell and get a tri bike. I can’t imagine trying to KQ knowing you are giving up that much time in the bike. And, yes, you should also look into wheel, clothes, helmet, disc wheel etc.

I don't have any issues about tribikes on the average ride, in fact, I much prefer it compared to a road bike for all except the hilliest terrain because you go so much faster, which is more fun. If your TT bike is set up much more aggressively than your roadie, I could see this, but my bikes are set up with pretty similar position and in fact I have a hard time riding in the drops on my road bike for prolonged periods (the roadie drops are lower than my TT bike aerobars) whereas I can do the aerobars on the TT bike without back issues for hours. No problems at all going in an out of aero and with the brakes.

This is the bike I am riding in Ironman West Oz in December........I might even unhitch the trailer.....That is all..

We’ve seen some people (eg Taylir Knibb) do really well with road bikes and clip-ons, so it’s not absolutely essential to swap, but I know for me personally it’d be devastating to miss KQ by like 2min having ridden a road bike. Maybe try on classifieds and see if anyone wants to trade as a first go?

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Dimond Bikes Superfan

Other bottle set ups on current bike to consider
1-2 BTS
1 (possibly 2 if you wanna get really creative) BTA
1 aero bottle on frame (xlab/elite)

That should be plenty of fluid options for IM and faster than current set up.

Sounds like your budget is really tight. Your really nice road bike is more valuable to you than you would receive on resale. Don't forget, unless you live on the Big Island, once you qualify for Kona its a big outlay to get there and race. You may be able to justify it as a vacation expense and not a bike expense but its still $$$.

Money on an aero helmet is money well spent, even a road aero helmet if you just want one helmet would save you some time, but ultimately a tri bike will be faster.

You could go to a fitter and get a tri-bike fit, then compare the fit coords to your current setup of possible purchases.

The thing is that some folks can achieve the same fit coords probably excepting saddle setback/hip angle stuff between the two..........but the geometry of a road bike is just different with respect to several dimensions that affect handling. Some folks get used to it, but when I did it on a Propel I really disliked the twitchy handling. The fit was "aero" but the bike handled like poo poo for TT purposes. It's a similar analogy to folks using modern large tire capacity disc road bikes for gravel riding. It does work, but the geometry doesn't lend itself to bike handling as well. Same for cross bikes on gravel or gravel bikes on cross courses. There's subtlety that can matter.

I'm a "tool for each job" person, so I tend to tell people not to over-buy on the road bike or tri bike and own each. It's not necessary to train 100% TT bike and some road mileage may make you want to ride more, and more is more for ftp.

The main thing is, Taylor has never done an Ironman. She's fast on her road bike with clip-ons because she's able to maintain a relatively aggressive position - but she doesn't need to stay in it for 5 hours (with a marathon to run off that).

I reviewed the notes from Mikael's podcast again (https://scientifictriathlon.com/tts338/#tab-con-3) and it's clear that the main advantage of a TT bike, from interviewee Michael Liberzon's standpoint, is that you can stay in an aerodynamic position for a long time:

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"FTP is a bit 2015, don't you think?" - Gustav Iden

If you're willing to fuss about with it you could always get an adjustable stem and drop the handlebars pretty significantly. That would get you probably 75% of the benefit of a TT bike, albeit it would be less comfortable as a road bike.

If your goal is to get faster, a tri bike is the direction you should go.

This GCN video has some info about wind tunnel tests of different setups -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hd0fXhDkH84.

I think they find that the difference between road bike + clip-ons and TT/tri bike is on the order of ~30 W at 45 kph when the same attire is used for both. Assuming that's something like ~10% of power, that would be equivalent to a 10% change in CdA, which would translate to around a 3% faster bike leg. If you're at a 5-hour bike split that's around 9 minutes.

The question then becomes: how much is that worth to you? And, critically overlooked by most of the thread responses here, do you have 9 minutes of cheaper low-hanging fruit elsewhere? (Nike 4% shoes for the marathon? Form analysis and coaching on the swim? Transitions?) It's a triathlon and you should weigh time improvements that cost something against each other across all three (four) disciplines, not just within the bike leg.

If you're really invested in improving the bike split or still think that's your best area to gain time, then you should try to do some aero testing and see where your cheaper improvements might lie (Do you have a power meter?). Body position is obviously king, so you would probably benefit from posting a picture of you on the bike in aero position, and testing tweaks in positioning to optimize CdA. That gcn video also concludes that aero clothing + helmet is worth far more than wheels, and represent big savings regardless of your bike setup. So do shaved legs according to multiple sources. I don't know what tires, tubes, and inflation pressure you're running, but those are also much cheaper areas for marginal gains than a TT/tri bike.

Finally, if you're talking about doing that many races and traveling to Kona if you got a KQ... I have to imagine a nice cheap used TT bike from the pros closet would not break your bank. There's stuff on there routinely that looks pretty good in the $2-3k range or even under.

A road bike with clip ons and shallow wheels worked ok for Nikola Spirig recently.

if you are in size 58 near san diego ill trade you my tri bike (2012 felt b12, 60/90 carbon wheels) straight up for yours. your bike will allow me to do road/crit races and tri's. my bike sits hanging on the wall all year except for 5-10 days. your bike is probably also worth more but i figure if its such a dream of yours put the offer on the table. buddy of mine brought one of those high end shiv's but doesnt fit him right and is slower than me (we are same ftp).... so put that in perspective

Do a timed half IM distance on your road bike, along with a 10k run off the bike (timed) at best effort.


Rent a bike from your local Tri shop for a weekend, set it up for a comfortable ride.
Do exactly the same on the rented Tri bike, including the run.

Easy decision.
Compare.

ps get a wheel cover. fast tires and latex tubes before the test.

Some great information in the responses here thank you guys for your information and time.

As far as where I am at. This is my second season doing this. Last year I placed 20th in my AG with a horrific run. If I didn't have bad cramps I think I would of placed 9th or better. Even in this scenario I wouldn't of qualified but I'm still learning alot. Every season I get faster and work out kinks.

As far as budget, it's not as if I'm broke. But I am trying to understand the cost/benefits rather than just throw my kids college funds at the sport hoping for results.

My weakest disipline is running. But there isn't much upgrades I can make there (financially) I'm just putting in the work.

My next race is Mont Tremblant on 8/21, so for this to happen, it would need to be right now which might be tough unless I get very lucky.

My current setup has me using a power meter and my clip ons have di2 buttons that allow me to stay aero for the entire event. However they are not very adjustable as far as position. If I were to get a new bike a good power meter is a must. My kit is considered fast (castelli sanremo)

I'm leaning towards the disc covers (do they make versions for disc brakes, any recommendations?) And a new helmet. I have a wonky aero helmet right now. Then upgrade to a new bike in the fall.

The swork tri bars I have don't really accommodate a bottle, but perhaps I could fabricate something if my current tank is costing me time. Or I could change out the whole bar system, but at some point it makes more sense to replace the bike.

Only thing I see wrong about your bike.. no forward seat post

I think if you sold that nice bike you'd regret it in the future. Keep doing what you are doing and get the aero helmet and a rear disc cover or rear disc. Start putting away some money now for a bike in a year or so. What's your occupation? Can you get any bonuses or tutor or do extra work?

Ask for cash for presents to set aside. Work at a bike shop...that's how I got my first bike, and wheels, and helmet!

With a bit of luck and patience you can trade that road bike for a great 2nd hand tri bike without taking a financial hit. The additional cost pales in comparison to a Kona trip.

Alternatively you can improve your current set up with deeper rims/ rw cover, faster helmest, suit and shoes. You can also mitigate the penalty of a road bike vs. your competition on a tri bike by picking the most technical and difficult IM course you can find for your KQ attempt.

There is not universal benefit of tri vs. road bike in terms of comfort or running ability, it all depends on the individual fit. I'm equally comfortable on both my bikes and run equally well. On public road I prefer the road bike, because it is much safer around traffic and going through towns and it lets me ride with friends. Tri bike only comes out for a few preparation rides close to the race and on race day.

Which brings me to another point for you to consider. If you can find a tri bike that allows you to get close to your road bike fit you might as well look into renting a tri bike for your KQ attempt.

Out of interest, how far are you from a KQ, what sort of gap are you looking to fill?

side note, but i towed a BOB Yak from vancouver to toronto, years ago, and then zurich down to montenegro, and then zurich up to manchester. god damn i love that thing. of all the bits of kit i've ever owned, it's one of the absolute workhorses - it just does its job, day in and day out, with bugger-all maintenance.

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https://lshtm.academia.edu/MikeCallaghan

http://howtobeswiss.blogspot.ch/