Mostly self-coached (drop in masters swim/track workouts) from MOP to elite over the course of 4-5 years. I read the triathlete training bible a few times and it really helped! Though it was mostly that first chapter that talked about chronic over-trainers, and I felt as though it was a personal attack. It was a good reminder that to take easy days easy so you could hammer the hard days. It also talks about what type of workouts you should be doing throughout the season, and some specifics to help identify and improve your areas of weakness.

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Fourth year Elite.
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Yea before my coach I was in the same boat of overtraining all the time.

Maybe I should take a look back thru the book. I understand how to balance the workload. I'm just confused about how to design the workouts themselves. What works what doesn't.


Edit: hey just realized I follow you on strava /wave

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IG - @ryanppax
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It all depends on your goals, what types of races you are doing, what types of terrain you are targeting and plenty of other factors like your relative strengths and weaknesses with S/B/R. Also your injury susceptibility comes into play. There is a certain periodization in a training cycle that you would need to account for. When it's time to do more "stength" type work (I don't mean with weights, I mean stuff like hill repeats and low cadence power work), vs "speed" type training.

If you are training for short races you would be looking at doing more higher intensity stuff vs someone training for an Ironman where you don't do as much in favor of longer efforts.

Oh and yes it's important not to hurt yourself, which is easy to do if you are writing your own training plan. Especially if you are failure-motivated to improve.

The answer to your question is complicated and best answered by your coach ;)

I am going in the exact opposite direction from you, self-coached, mostly, for 4-5 years and while I am quite a bit faster than I used to be, I want to ensure I can get that extra 5% to be actually competitive.

What I have done to design workouts was mostly trial and error using workouts I find in random articles (and there are plenty of them) from various tri coaches and workouts and some from a group coached team I was on for a year in NYC (I imagine you have quite a bank from your current coach you could save down). Of course, I only tried workouts that were specific to my goals (70.3 distance) and used the overall philosophy of periodization and prioritizing recovery. I ended up mostly having a small library of specific workouts that most people would consider stale (thus why I am going to engage a coach in October) but I am fine with stale, and until the two months leading up to the race, a lot of my workouts were quite general and aerobic anyway so not much thought needed to be put into that.

I think that worked for me as much as I could get out of it but I don't have the knowledge nor the time to gain the advanced knowledge to step up my workouts to finely tune even more.

The only thing I would say in your case is that a year isn't a long time under a coach, if you perhaps do not really like the structure or relationship, try another one but I would be surprised if anyone could learn everything they need to perform at their full potential within just one year.

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808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo

I went self-coaching route alittle over a year ago. I had had it with paying for a coach when I have been an endurance athlete for 20 years+- and I do alot of my own reading, research, etc. I realized I knew more than the coach and I was chronically overtrained/injured training with this particular coach.

I began with reading Joe Friel's books for just a framework of my schedule. I also use Hunter/Coggan resources and I read the book by Chris Carmichael for the time crunched triathlete. Then I just use Training peaks alot. I plan on a 3 weeks on and 1 week off schedule. Then in looking at Friel's books I planned on a TSS or hours plan (though I think TSS is more valid). I pull in some Suffer fest bike workouts and when I ride outdoors I use Hunter/Coogan workouts. I plan on training 6-7 days per week with some days being 2 workouts (morning/evening). Here is what I typically do each week: Swim 3X, Bike 4X, Run 3-4X (recovering from being injured so not so much running yet) and Strength 2-3X per week. Hope that helps!

KK

if you are willing to invest the time ( and $ ) WKO4/5 is a good tool and has free webinar material on youtube.

more than specific workouts my suggestion would be to grasp what you are trying to improve / accomplish. if you get that then design and progression of workouts becomes easier.

the harder thing is being objective with yourself. when to bail or go easy and when to push through. having a sounding board that is detached from the daily ups and downs that one has as a high load / weekly hours athlete is one of the most underrated benefits of working with a coach.

r

My self-coaching workout design has mostly been influenced by a number of books I’ve read on the topic. Each book I’ve read has changed my views slightly, but I try to focus on concepts that seem to be commonly agreed upon and try out the unique concepts to see if I like them and if they work for me.

The first book I read was The Triathlete’s Training Bible by Joe Friel (3rd Edition, though I’ve read bits of the 4th Edition too). This book is fairly comprehensive and is a great place to start. I referenced it heavily for many years to create weekly plans and specific workouts.

I then read Training and Racing with a Power Meter by Hunter Allen and Andrew Coggan. This book is specific to cycling, but it has tons of good workout examples and the concepts translate somewhat to running and swimming.

The Triathlete’s Guide to Training with Power by Phil Skiba is another great book I read. This one is less comprehensive (though does cover swim/bike/run…don’t be confused by “power” in the title), but has good explanations of training concepts as well as a discussion of workout design and example progressions which is quite useful.

The Well Built Triathlete by Matt Dixon is an awesome book. It is almost as comprehensive as the Training Bible, but it presents some unique types of workouts that I hadn’t been exposed to before. It has good example workouts and 2-week example blocks for different phases of the season and a discussion of how to organize a week depending on what else you have going on in life (more time on the weekends, weekends are for family time, etc.). I reference this book most often these days. It’s funny because I’m a data/numbers junkie and Matt is almost anti-data. You won't find anything about power, HR, etc. in this book. However, I really like his ideas and the way he presents them. I feel it is beneficial to have the more data-driven background of the first 3 books as context for getting the most out of this book.

My college triathlon team also had a coach for a year or two (shout out to Bill Martin of SBR Coaching, who I highly recommend if you’re looking for coaching in the Madison, WI area). I learned a ton by following a season plan laid out for us and talking to him about the "whys" of the workouts. I definitely utilize that experience as a resource when creating my workouts and plans.

Other good resources for creating workouts and weekly plans have been reading threads on Slowtwitch on these topics, reading any training plan I can get my hands on (just for more ideas and comparison to what I learned from the books) and listening to training podcasts (That Triathlon Show is great).

In summary, I'd recommend starting with The Triathlete's Training Bible and/or The Well Built Triathlete and branching out from there depending on how interested you are in learning how to design your own workouts and weeks.

Not sure you are ready to be self coached...

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
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I'm not sure how continuing with a coach for longer would help that. Following a plan made by someone else day by day doesn't really teach a whole lot.

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I'll definitely check out those books.

Part of the reason I . exploring this route is that I feel I've outgrown my current coach. First answer would be to get another coach. Locally they are the only one. And I'm not sure about finding someone online, too many choices, and might end up in the same position I'm in.

I'd rather have my success or really Lack of success be my doing instead of another coach. That way the blame rests on me and I can learn from it

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IG - @ryanppax
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That's not what Eric is saying.
Reread what he quoted then what he said

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
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it's also not a particularly helpful comment. Really, no-one who starts coaching themselves (which is a bit of an oxymoron anyway, "coaching" implies that knowledge is passed on in some way from one person to another) is truly ready for it. We've all got to start somewhere. And while planning out the macrocycles can be more challenging, sometimes it isn't. n=1 and all that, but my personal macro planning is really easy. There isn't much. I just get to the pool as much as I can and (in theory) adjust the mix of practices as I get closer to championship meets. The challenge is really at the workout level and making sure that I'm designing those workouts with my end goals in mind, namely to improve middle distance freestyle and the 100 fly.

To answer the OP, I think that the trick is to have a goal for each workout (which will tie into your overall season progression). If you have that goal and know what you want to work on each day, then the workouts can almost build themselves. That, and be a sponge. Read everything you can get your hands on.

For swim stuff, masters is on a break for the summer, so I've been digging through the Finis Set of the Week series for stuff that fits with what I want to do, which right now is base endurance and keeping a feel for the water. There's a link to them on the sidebar at Swimswam.com, or follow this link https://swimswam.com/...ing/set-of-the-week/

There's also a ton of stuff on the USMS site, need to be a member of USMS but it's pretty cheap.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Big fan of Matt Dixon Fast Track Triathlete book and 1/2-full plans.

Check it out

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http://www.TriScottsdale.org

Read. A lot. Not just triathlon specefic training books, but running/swimming and cycling specific training books. Whether it be reading a training guide by a coach or an anecdote of an athlete and his training and racing even if the goal of the book is more so to entertain and not to teach. All will be helpful and that's because one book wont have all the answers. Some books might be geared to different kind of athletes with different experiences or have anecdotal evidence on how one training method worked for a certain athlete. After awhile you will see patterns in training and then you can work on identifying what is wrong/right with how you approach training

I guess that brings up a bigger question. With a massive amount of information available sometimes it feels contradictive. Every week should supposedly have some high intensity, but then how does that get along with periodization? Maybe these questions will get answered after reading the mentioned books.

If I go this route I think I'd jump on tower 26. Being an adult swimmer I don't think I'd be ready for building my own swim workouts so soon. Seems very valuable for $75/mo

There's plenty of plans out there to buy or get for free. I've considered just getting some of the pay for plans in the TP catalogue. Matt Fitzgerald's ranked plans sound good. Is there resources out there that shows a written plan, with an explanation of why you're doing what you're doing?

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IG - @ryanppax
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Now that the OP asked this question Eric's response is all the more relevant. It's full of guidance and seems extremely helpful.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

Maybe. Depends on your goals and where you are in the season. Hell, I'm pretty much a pure swimmer and the longest race I take "seriously" is about 4 and a half minutes long, and I'm not doing much in the way of true intensity work right now, since Nationals isn't until May. Now's the time to just do basic aerobic conditioning, work a bit on technique and off-strokes, and build general strength.

If you're focused on Ironman or 70.3, I'd argue that intensity is WAY overrated (except in the swim, but that's only because most triathletes don't do enough to begin with).

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

so, the guidance is to get a coach?

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Basically you said you understand the macro planning then you asked about periodization. What Eric beat you to was the fact you're not sure about the macro planning given the questions you asked in your last post.

There are multiple ways you can bake the cake, and yes at times they seem contradictory. Ultimately though one of the hardest decisions is which way you choose to bake your cake. Do you do it with vo2 work early or late or not at all and for how long and how much and what type of intervals for example?

I think the T26 route is a good route.

IDK if there is something out there showing the why's behind the what. I'd say you should go back and read a lot of Gordo's stuff about a basic week, finding a structure that works with your life, just rolling with it week after week with some performance tests so you can see when it's time to reduce or increase the heat in your oven.

But first you need to decide which recipe to use. Then you can worry about the day in day out.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

Not even close to what Eric said.

The OP said macro planning was more simple than day in day out planning.

How are you going to have a day in day out plan if you've not planned what you need to do & when you need to do it?

That's what Eric was saying as I understood it

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

How active of a participant are you in your current coaching plan?
Do you understand why the coach is giving you what they are? Do you ask and discuss going into training blocks (and coming out) what was the motivation / and what worked what didnt?

I know some coaches like the "jump" / "how high" model. But many are happy to have these discussions .

This year I started using a program called TriDot and have really enjoyed it. It's an online platform that gives you a workout calendar that will make adjustments for you based on how you are doing in the workouts. They have subscriptions from $9.99 all the way to $200+ based on what you want. Obviously if you pay more you get more attention from their actual coaches. But I've found the $30 platform to be plenty sufficient and many of my training friends are happy on the $9.99 level.

I tried it out because I just can't justify the price of a coach as an amateur triathlete. But I was exactly like you, looking for just a little guidance while I mostly took care of it myself. 8 months in and my swim endurance is up, FTP is up, and run paces are up. You can check it out at Tridot.com

I’m not really sure how you got that from Eric’s comment, which was (paraphrased) that the OP isn’t ready to coach himself.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Brian is exactly right, and so am I. The OP doesn't know what he doesn't know. Because he thinks that workouts are hard and macro is easy, which is the opposite of reality, he's not ready. So, as coaches, instead of answering the question he asked, we're answering the question he needs answered. Brian's being more direct, while I'm actually using the Socratic method, which some people take offense to...

The dirty truth is that coaching is 90% getting people out of their own way... the workouts are the easy part. Brian is right to suggest Gordo's stuff to the OP. Or in Brian's terms, the ingredients are easy if you know what cake you're building, how many people you're serving, how hot the oven needs to be, and how long it needs to bake.

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

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