Login required to started new threads

Login required to post replies

Cat ranking for mop itu athlete?
Quote | Reply
What category is a mop itu athlete on the circuit probably going to be ranked in? 1? 2?
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [%FTP] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Category 5. You have to win/place high consistently to move up in rankings. (Except from 5 to 4, that just takes 10 mass starts).

John



Top notch coaching: Francois and Accelerate3 | Follow on Twitter: LifetimeAthlete |
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [Devlin] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I think he was referring to ability. While they have to start in Cat 5 like everyone else. I'd say most are ranging from cat 3 to cat 1. I'm a mid to front end Cat 3 guy and have raced (on the road) with ITU guys that I'm faster than, and one that I'm most definitely slower than. Of course, that doesn't take into account how skilled they are in USAC style racing...I'm commenting only on their power/fitness. Mid pack ITU = Cat 2 or 3 level. Front pack ITU cat 2 or 1 (for whatever my wild ass guess is worth).
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [%FTP] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Different skill set. I'm sure their "FTP" is likely high (Cat 1/2), but like many triathletes, lack explosive power and a sprint (compared with other Cat 1/2/3s especially). A definite downward right slope if you are familiar with Allen & Coggan's book/description. Forget team tactics, race "smarts", etc. With their likely super high FTP, they would likely be fine hanging in a Cat 1/2/3 pack easily, but would likely finish just midpack if in a field sprint.

____________________________________
Fatigue is biochemical, not biomechanical.
- Andrew Coggan, PhD
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [%FTP] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Kinda off topic, but im always surprised with some of the pretty overweight dudes who do relatively well in Cat racing considering their power to weight.

What would it take to blow away a cat 4/5 field off the front? No attacking, just straight power 100% of the time.
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [SpencerDC] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I'd say 3/4. I remember a local ITU guy showed once in a while at local crits a long time ago and he'd do all level in one night as a training session, but he was a good biker. On the other hand, I'm a shitty time trialist and have beaten one or two in a tt (for a tri), and I can win the local 4/5/no-cat crit on occasion which has a people from 3-5 in it.

The good ITU guys are definitely going to be on the level of local pro bikers at the least.
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [Rhymenocerus] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
From my experience an AP around 240w and a NP in the 280 range. That is what it took for me to ride away from a small Cat 5 field in the rain.


Twitter @achtervolger
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [Rhymenocerus] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Rhymenocerus wrote:
Kinda off topic, but im always surprised with some of the pretty overweight dudes who do relatively well in Cat racing considering their power to weight.

What would it take to blow away a cat 4/5 field off the front? No attacking, just straight power 100% of the time.


Yeah, but those guys only come out on the flat courses. Throw in a hill you have to hit 6 times and they are cooked by the third time up ;-)

Off the front the entire time? Well, 4/5 races are usually pretty short - like 40 miles or so, but way over 1 hour. Since you would have to kill the entire pack (even 4/5s can get a pretty good double paceline going). Each guy pulls an easy 300W for a few secs, need another 30% more power alone, so 360W but this is for 1 hour, so for 1.5 -2 hours, maybe an FTP of 375-380W? Reality is that both attacker and pack rarely pulls that long - there are all kinds of spikes, esp after corners, over RR tracks, etc. and lulls in the action, etc. So probably a LOT less once the pack gives up and also what region of the country said pack is in ;-)

____________________________________
Fatigue is biochemical, not biomechanical.
- Andrew Coggan, PhD
Last edited by: rroof: Mar 22, 11 17:58
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [Logan D Dog] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Ok, seems somewhat reasonable. I just always hear stories of hardcore guys coming along and having to compete in cat 4/5 due to the rules and just blowing away the entire field solo.
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [rroof] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
The terrain around here is all hills and it always makes me chuckle to chase guys on the flat that are cookin pretty good, but then once any hill comes up, they totally eat shit. I guess there are plenty of advantages to being 150lbs soaking wet.
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [Logan D Dog] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Then you got lucky as they were obviously disorganized which is, admittedly, fairly typical for 4/5 races but still.

Accelerate3 Coaching https://accelerate3.com/
Moxie Multisport https://www.themoxiemultisport.com/
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [Rhymenocerus] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I just relooked at the data. After I left the pack with a teammate, my AP was around 280w and NP was a little north of 300w. I forgot to note that I was with a partner for all but the last lap.


Twitter @achtervolger
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [James Haycraft] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Oh I assure you it was not strength nor skill that got me off the front. We were just willing to ride harder in the rain than the others were.


Twitter @achtervolger
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [Logan D Dog] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Also, "out of sight, out of mind" is very applicable in a lot of those sorts of situations.

Accelerate3 Coaching https://accelerate3.com/
Moxie Multisport https://www.themoxiemultisport.com/
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [James Haycraft] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
James Haycraft wrote:
Also, "out of sight, out of mind" is very applicable in a lot of those sorts of situations.

Absolutely. I love rolling hills and lots of curves - easier to get out of sight and eventually "forgotten".

____________________________________
Fatigue is biochemical, not biomechanical.
- Andrew Coggan, PhD
Quote Reply
Re: Cat ranking for mop itu athlete? [%FTP] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Triathletes, ITU or otherwise, have big engines and minimal skill (the vast majority of the time).

I've raced as a CAT 1/Pro on the road and mtb and have been a pro triathlete for 10 years (currently I am a cat 2 cyclist and pro/open for cross). There are a lot of guys out there with huge engines and lots of potential, but even ITU is very tactic/skill absent. So, if we are talking a technical crit in a strong state like CO, CA, or the like most of the mop ITU guys will be hard pressed to remain middle of the pack of the CAT 3s.

However, they will probably finish feeling frustrated and physically fine. LIke I said, big engine, minimal skill.

I would love to see this change and the ITU to come up with technical and physically demanding courses rather than flat out and backs with 90 and 180 turns. Even the supposedly technical courses aren't technical by cycling standards.

So, just to be clear, so nobody gets pissy. The athletes are very strong, but their skill is never tested so they have no reason to improve.

...and that's the guys, the women are a totally different situation. But, so is women's cycling.

JImmy

Jimmy Archer
Pro Triathlete/Coach/Freelance Writer
http://www.jimmyarcher.com
http://www.dirttri.com
Quote Reply