Building a bike from scratch

Dec 15, 06 11:55

Post #1 of 20 (3587 views)

Hey Guys,

Was wondering if anyone has done this?

My Dad is a mechanical engineer who is retiring at the end of the year and I think he's probably going to drive Mum to insanity if he doesn't have a few projects to keep him occupied.

I was thinking of commissioning him to build me a custom TT bike. I have a pretty good knowledge of the sort of geometry I want but I have no background at all in material selection, joining techniques (bonding v's welding etc), basically anything that is going to negatively affect the weight of the bike. I know I could send him some drawings and he would have no problem building it right now. My only concern is, he has a habit of over-building things, i.e. they are solid as a rock and about as heavy.

Thought it might be a fun father-son project.

Any recommendations (other than "don't bother") are appreciated.

Cheers,

Alan

trigeek76@triathlontrainingsurvey.net
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Re: Building a bike from scratch [trigeek76] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 11:57

Post #2 of 20 (3582 views)

In for a penny...:

http://www.sheldonbrown.com/rinard/carbon_fiber.htm

"Are you sure we're going fast enough?" - Emil Zatopek

Re: Building a bike from scratch [trigeek76] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 12:09

Post #3 of 20 (3554 views)

If I were building one (and were a triathlete and not under the UCI), I would copy my hooker with 700c wheels...

everything that you see on the P3c, the trek TT, the ordu etc. were incorperated in the hooker....

to itemize:

1) ULTRA THIN aero tubing (not UCI legal)
2) internal cables all around - enter behind stem (copied by trek)
3) rear brake behind BB
4) wishbone rear triangle
5) custom aero seatpost
6) 1" headset for reduced FA
7) SHORT headtube (~5cm!!!) for low aerobars
8) no bondo
9) aero brakes

if I were to make one, I would add a non-sloping, 1" TT, integrated SRM cabling, maybe a narrow BB ala walser and remake the brakes (not to difficult to reproduce).

here is a pic of the naked frame (1606g) as mine is out for a repaint:

g

greg
www.wattagetraining.com

Re: Building a bike from scratch [luckyleese] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 12:12

Post #4 of 20 (3541 views)

Very Cool!

Thanks,

Alan

trigeek76@triathlontrainingsurvey.net
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Re: Building a bike from scratch [gregclimbs] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 12:15

Post #5 of 20 (3527 views)

Thanks Greg.

All good considerations.

Cheers,

Alan

trigeek76@triathlontrainingsurvey.net
http://www.triathlontrainingsurvey.net
Fill out my training survey to receive a copy of how Slowtwitchers really train

Re: Building a bike from scratch [trigeek76] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 12:15

Post #6 of 20 (3525 views)

"Any recommendations (other than "don't bother") are appreciated."

Okay, so I won't say "don't bother." Instead I'll say... I hope your medical insurance is paid, and I hope you're not the type to sue family.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies...

https://triomultisport.com/
http://www.mjolnircycles.com/

Re: Building a bike from scratch [trigeek76] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 12:24

Post #7 of 20 (3506 views)

There is always going to be someone that says do not do it. Just do not listen to them. If everyone thought like this nothing would ever be built and we would still be walking everywhere.

I would say just make sure that you do enough research on the material that you want to use and maybe talk to someone that has built there own frames. I have added a link for a thread on another site where the guys have built a very nice TT frame out of carbon as well as seats, Aerobars and other items.

http://www.signature.fi

I am sure that if you emailed him, we would be a great resource. Check out the writing on the chainstays.

HOME MADE IN FINLAND

Best of luck and post some pictures when you are done.

Last edited by: Bman: Dec 15, 06 12:27

Re: Building a bike from scratch [trigeek76] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 12:31

Post #8 of 20 (3496 views)

You might start out with a round tube traditional bike to get the fixturing, welding and bending worked out before you move onto aero tubing and more complex geometry. A set of round bike tubes is also likely much easier to obtain than an aero set. So your dad has a machine and weld shop at the house? I'm jealous.

Re: Building a bike from scratch [Bman] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 12:36

Post #9 of 20 (3476 views)

Okay, I'll amend my earlier recommendation to say "Pay particular attention to joint integrity".

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Some are born to move the world to live their fantasies...

https://triomultisport.com/
http://www.mjolnircycles.com/

Re: Building a bike from scratch [nickc] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 12:37

Post #10 of 20 (3476 views)

Hey Nick,

Thanks for the advice.

Yeah, he's spent the past 30 years collecting an array of lathes, milling machines, welders, and other things that I have no clue what they do :-)

Cheers,

Alan

trigeek76@triathlontrainingsurvey.net
http://www.triathlontrainingsurvey.net
Fill out my training survey to receive a copy of how Slowtwitchers really train

Re: Building a bike from scratch [Bman] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 12:45

Post #11 of 20 (3460 views)

Thanks BMan.

I will definitely drop him a line.

Sweet looking ride!!

Alan

trigeek76@triathlontrainingsurvey.net
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Fill out my training survey to receive a copy of how Slowtwitchers really train

Re: Building a bike from scratch [trigeek76] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 12:45

Post #12 of 20 (3460 views)

A little off your topic but I always have thought it would be fun to take one of the frame building courses at the United Bicycle Institute in Ashland, OR. They have Aluminum, Steel and Ti courses that each last two weeks and you leave with a completed frame that you built during the class.

http://www.bikeschool.com/

Re: Building a bike from scratch [trigeek76] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 13:07

Post #13 of 20 (3437 views)

There is a lot of information on his web site if you want to go the CF route. If you want to go the route of aluminum, Ti or steel there are a lot of resource available. I think there is a site somewhere about hand built bikes and there is a show in San Jose on March 2nd - 4th, 2007. Might be interesting for a father son trip. I bet you could get a lot of information there.

Re: Building a bike from scratch [Bman] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 13:12

Post #14 of 20 (3425 views)

Thanks Bman,

Dad lives in Aust. so the show might be a little tough but I will check into the websites you mentioned. He's worked with CF before but I'm sure he'd be more comfortable going with Aluminum (or aluminium as Aussie Dad calls it). I might try and twist his arm a little though. That signature bike looks pretty sharp.

Alan

trigeek76@triathlontrainingsurvey.net
http://www.triathlontrainingsurvey.net
Fill out my training survey to receive a copy of how Slowtwitchers really train

Re: Building a bike from scratch [trigeek76] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 13:16

Post #15 of 20 (3414 views)

Here is another link to some of the things that he has done. It just blows me away that he does this at home.

http://weightweenies.starbike.com/...iewtopic.php?t=10778

His seats that he makes are 71 grams and supposedly fairly comfortable.

Re: Building a bike from scratch [trigeek76] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 13:21

Post #16 of 20 (3406 views)

you can buy the aluminum project 96 tubes (looks like what cervelo has on the original p2). Contact james frames as he knows how to get them.

Dan
www.aiatriathlon.com

http://www.aiatriathlon.com

Re: Building a bike from scratch [dtreeps] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 13:38

Post #17 of 20 (3384 views)

Thanks Dan!!

Alan

trigeek76@triathlontrainingsurvey.net
http://www.triathlontrainingsurvey.net
Fill out my training survey to receive a copy of how Slowtwitchers really train

Re: Building a bike from scratch [gregclimbs] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 13:42

Post #18 of 20 (3376 views)

In Reply To:

If I were building one (and were a triathlete and not under the UCI), I would copy my hooker with 700c wheels...

everything that you see on the P3c, the trek TT, the ordu etc. were incorperated in the hooker....

to itemize:

1) ULTRA THIN aero tubing (not UCI legal)
2) internal cables all around - enter behind stem (copied by trek)
3) rear brake behind BB
4) wishbone rear triangle
5) custom aero seatpost
6) 1" headset for reduced FA
7) SHORT headtube (~5cm!!!) for low aerobars
8) no bondo
9) aero brakes

if I were to make one, I would add a non-sloping, 1" TT

I'm with you on the non-sloping part, but assuming we're still talking aluminum here I'd stick with the oversized top tube. The early 'one off' Hooker frames lacked this feature, and those that rode them report a disconcerting lack of stiffness. I therefore view the overside top tube as a way of preventing the bike from folding in half despite the ultra-narrow down tube.

Re: Building a bike from scratch [trigeek76] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 14:32

Post #19 of 20 (3327 views)

How do you feel about just giving your dad a clean sheet of paper and letting his creativity take hold. There are a lot of non standard designs out there that work as tt bikes (Titanflex, cheetahs, softrides, Kirk precision etc.)
. Maybe, with your father not immersed in cycling, he might come up with a unique design.

Las Vegas NV | IM KY 07

Re: Building a bike from scratch [softrider] [ In reply to ]

Dec 15, 06 14:45

Post #20 of 20 (3311 views)

I don't know if I trust the old guy that much. :-)

While, I agree that I have some pre-conceived notions of "what a bike looks like", I'm a little worried that his pre-conceived notion might involve a step through frame, a pannier rack and a basket on the front :-)

It would be interesting though. Maybe I'll try it for a laugh. You never know....

Cheers,

Alan

trigeek76@triathlontrainingsurvey.net
http://www.triathlontrainingsurvey.net
Fill out my training survey to receive a copy of how Slowtwitchers really train

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