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Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3)
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I suppose it's a bit of a stupid question, just slow down is the answer.. but it seems many people struggle with their pacing, totally overcooking it the first 10/12km and then bimbling home. Not just BOP or MOP runners, but decent runners too. I run way too quick the first 10kms, try and bank a few minutes, but have never even come close to negative splitting. I lose a lot of time from 12/13kms - 17/18km. The last few kms I pick up the pace a little, but by then any chance of a PB has long gone. I did a 1.37 recently, it was stinking hot (105F+) so times for everyone were slow, but I still went out too hard. The stupid thing, I'm looking at my km splits, knowing it's too quick, knowing I'm not going to be able to hold that pace, but carry on! I'm racing tomorrow and am in reasonable run shape, I need to figure out a way of staying disciplined through that first 10km.
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Re: Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3) [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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I don't think it's remotely possible to negative split a 105F race, esp as it gets hotter and hotter as time progresses.

I can neg split open HMs but I have yet to neg split a HIM run, although I feel like I've run at least one HIM run that went as well as it could have possibly gone while giving it my all.

It was all about staying on the conservative side for the first half for me. This doesn't mean slacking off - it meant that I gauged my effort by pace, RPE, and HR, and if conditions weren't adverse and I didn't shell myself on the bike, I didn't let any of those 3 indicators go past what I felt would be risky.

I'd say that if you have a penchant for really overcooking HIM runs (the 105F run doesn't count!), you should probably choose a metric to rein yourself in for the first half.

I've also found that for me, if I'm well trained on the bike, even if I go pretty hard on the bike leg, I WILL run too fast at the start of the run if I just go by feel. This seems to happen to pros - I recall Macca during his Kona IM win saying how stupidly fast he was running for the first few miles despite not wanting to. I think it's related to the brain/heart being used to working at a hard bike level to keep up the pace at mile 56, whereas once you switch to the run, that end-of-bike level is too hard for the first few run miles. (This assumes of course you didn't blow yourself up on the bike.)
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Re: Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3) [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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As long as your bike pacing is dialed in and you're fueling properly, just slow down. You cannot EVER put time in the bank early on in a 70.3 or ironman run. The man always comes knocking, and he wants his money. Pace the run like its a 10 mile race and save your legs so you can empty the tank over the last 5k.

Be smart. Keep your ego in check and you will be rewarded.

Toro Performance
Last edited by: jlentzke: Jun 8, 18 16:38
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Re: Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3) [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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Adopt the run tactic of racing against other competitors and not the clock. Do some research and find out who will be near you on the run leg. Pace off them. If too slow, be patience. If too fast, then you need to choose another pace setter. At the 10-11-12K mark, access how you feel. Maintain contact with your targeted pacer or start dialing in your personal pace clock or better, dial in to finish strong for the rest of the way to the finish line. For the first half of the run leg, don't run too hard to trash your body into dehydration on bonking. Get liquid calories, energy bar, Coke, or what-not. For the last half of the run you won't need solids. Focus on fluids, sugars, and caffeine. You'll run faster and still process that into energy. To mentally understand, think about track runners. Even the 400M or 800M world record holders need to pace themselves and their doing 2-4% the distance you need to run for the 70.3. Also, stay relaxed. Easy to read but you need to consistently think to stay relaxed. Focus on loose open hands. That sets the example for the rest of your body to follow. If your hands are loose, then so will the shoulders, face, neck, legs, etc. Focus on smooth form. Quiet running. Less pounding for the first half of the run; less pain, stiffness, cramping for the second half. If really struggling on the concept, think of the 100 Meter sprinters. It's not the quickest that are running the fastest at the end to win, it's the racer's who are most relaxed, keeping form/stride/arm drives going to slow down less than his/her competition.

For extra learning credit, don't freak out in transition. Stay relaxed from bike-to-run. Don't sprint thru T2. You'll not going to miss a podium or qualifying spot in transition but can easily lose out if you set yourself up for overcooked first-half run. Take the first 1-2K of the run leg to stretch out the lower back, torso, neck, and arms. Get into run form from aero bike. Even the butterflys take some time to morph into flying once busting out of the cocoon.

Let us know how you go tomorrow. Good luck.

https://www.palmtreesahead.com/
Last edited by: djmsbr: Jun 9, 18 11:05
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Re: Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3) [jlentzke] [ In reply to ]
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jlentzke wrote:

As long as your bike pacing is dialed in and you're fueling properly, just slow down. You cannot EVER put time in the bank early on in a 70.3 or ironman run. The man always comes knocking, and he wants his money. Pace the run like its a 10 mile race and save your legs so you can empty the tank over the last 5k.

Be smart. Keep your ego in check and you will be rewarded.

And the interest is steep!

Let food be thy medicine...
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Re: Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3) [jlentzke] [ In reply to ]
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jlentzke wrote:

As long as your bike pacing is dialed in and you're fueling properly, just slow down. You cannot EVER put time in the bank early on in a 70.3 or ironman run. The man always comes knocking, and he wants his money. Pace the run like its a 10 mile race and save your legs so you can empty the tank over the last 5k.

Be smart. Keep your ego in check and you will be rewarded.

Awesome, thanks for the advice guys!

I love that phrase: The man always comes knocking, and he wants his money.

So true and I think you hit the nail on the head - ego. I'm running at a pace that I know I can't sustain, my training and race experience tells me that, but I race that pace anyway, thinking I've miraculously turned into an elite runner! I've changed my goals for the race, goal no 1 is STMFRP - stick to my fucking race plan. Get a good run split with a well paced run. I think if I see fast km splits coming back those first few kms, I'm going to see it as a bad thing, not a good thing, which I previously did. I'll let you know how I go! 70.3 Cairns no #2793 if anyone is interested! Hoping for 1.32 - 1.34. It's going to be warm and humid, so heat will play a little bit of a factor, but not too much. It's not going to be stinking hot.
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Re: Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3) [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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Nice! All the best mechanical luck. Hydrate well on the bike and save it for that last 5k of the run. Enjoy it and make it hurt!

Toro Performance
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Re: Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3) [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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if you talk about banking a few minutes in the run, please be aware of the fact that you’re NOT putting minutes in the bank that you get back for free. this is not how banking business works 😉. what actually happens if you start at a pace that’s too fast is: the bank is lending you some race time to be faster and will take it back with an interest before the race is over.
i have done my fastest run splits or open marathons/half-marathons when not looking at the pace but at the heart rate, so you probably might try that. if you know your threshold heartrate for a certain distance (if not, find out in training runs) go below that for the first half of the distance. then check out the average pace you did so far. now try to keep that pace and towards the end, try to go faster. actually, you will probably not be able to go faster, so not yielding in a negative split, but you will know you went as fast as possible on the given day since every bit faster on the first half would have slowed you down more on the second half.

please note that this is just my personal experience and i’m just a mop’er after all!
good luck with your upcoming race, but due to time zones you might as well be already through it?! would love to hear how it went though.
dan

then someone will say, what is lost can never be saved.
despite all my rage, i am still just a rat in a cage.
- smashing pumpkins: "bullet with butterfly wings"
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Re: Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3) [danny_t] [ In reply to ]
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danny_t wrote:
i have done my fastest run splits or open marathons/half-marathons when not looking at the pace but at the heart rate, so you probably might try that. if you know your threshold heartrate for a certain distance (if not, find out in training runs) go below that for the first half of the distance. then check out the average pace you did so far. now try to keep that pace and towards the end, try to go faster. actually, you will probably not be able to go faster, so not yielding in a negative split, but you will know you went as fast as possible on the given day since every bit faster on the first half would have slowed you down more on the second half.

dan

Yeah I don't really follow HR anymore, primarily because I've got a Fenix5 and the optical HRM is unreliable. Perhaps I should get a strap? Although I think I have a reasonable idea of what my RPE is. Or perhaps it's more of a case of I know how fast I should be running and how fast is too fast. I've struggled to be disciplined about it and as someone pointed out earlier, you got to put your ego to one side, so true. I don't race for another 12 hours (Cairns). cheers
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Re: Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3) [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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best wishes for your race.
actually, when talking about ego and raceplans - maybe try to see it that way: it takes a lot more "ego" (aka confidence in this case) not to speed out of t2 like crazy. everybody can do that. if you want to do something that's really great for your ego, start the run moderate und pass a lot of others on the last miles...
THAT makes a hard race end very satisfying.
cheers,
dan

then someone will say, what is lost can never be saved.
despite all my rage, i am still just a rat in a cage.
- smashing pumpkins: "bullet with butterfly wings"
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Re: Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3) [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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By banking time you're planning to fail. Don't plan to fail.
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Re: Being disciplined with run pacing (70.3) [zedzded] [ In reply to ]
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I run reverse negative splits. I have my whole running career.
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