Typical LBS BS. There's no truth whatsoever to what he said.

Specific claims about stiffness as it relates to power transfer are pretty much always pulled out of thin air.

Not "typical" LBS BS, but BS nonetheless. Road shoes can definitely be more comfortable because their closure systems aren't limited to something you can do while rolling down the road, but every tri shoe ever has the same sole and last as a corresponding road shoe from the same manufacturer.

There are definitely more tri shoes out there that don’t lock your feet down as well, which could affect efficiency and power transfer. The idea that flex in the sole reduces power transfer sounds like nonsense.

I prefer tri shoes but fit and closure system are important.

Many shoe companies build their road and tri shoes on the same sole. I would probably ask how "huge" of a difference. It would become pretty evident he has no idea what he is talking about.

You could probably attach cleats to the bottom of flip flops, and it wouldn't be that much difference...

Not sure about shoes. Pretty sure tri socks are faster than road socks though.

FWIW...
Searched around and found this. Basically the guy tested (in a wind tunnel) his PI tri shoe agains a modified (took the laces and tongue out and replaced with elastic) Giro road shoe and came up with a measurable difference in watts: Giro shoe was 4-12 watts faster depending on yaw angle.

https://www.thomasgerlach.com/...es-aerodynamics.html


Which adds nothing to the power transfer argument.

I’ve been thinking of trying that with the Scott Road Rc Lace.

The tri carbons have been fine, and it’s nice to have the boa to tweak the fit after a few minutes, but not having to deal with tigening it up out of T1 has to be worth a few seconds atop the aero benifits.

All depends if you like marginal gains! Race in your Tri shoes if your are 40-44 please :-)

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2024: Bevoman, Galveston, Alcatraz, Marble Falls, Santa Cruz

This is the correct answer to this thread. I have tested rat trap pedals with running shoes vs all kinds of road shoes and at TT/FTP/tri efforts there is zero diff in power.

Pretty sure that unless you ar electing elbows and headbutting one another in a TdF sprint finish like Cav and Sagan, then it would make no delta.

Any discussion on aero is a different story.....but FTP effort power.....zilch

Thank you Paul. I thought I was the only one on the planet who liked old school cages and straps, with running shoes. I've done my share of crude time trials between them and my clipless, and can't tell any difference. At least not at my old guy, 20 mph'ish age group level. But eliminating the shoe change in T2 is priceless.

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Athlinks / Strava

I am that guy quoted above and to add to that I have trained in non-carbon soled mtb shoes. Basically the cheapest MTB pair Shimano makes and I love them. I also use Powercranks on that bike and have never felt at a disadvantage. Total snake oil LBS.

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So much sense on this thread,

"It enables more efficient power transfer" is the standard excuse for selling expensive cranks, shoes, pedals, stiff frames .. you name it. Hear it everywhere. If it was more efficient then you should be able to measure it. You can't.

My club had a hill climb race for members. Forgot my shoes. Rode it in work safety shoes on look keo pedals. Won it easily (the good climbers didn't show up). Absolutely zero power loss.

I'm still inclined to believe that a cyclist in running shoes and cages isn't as efficient as the same rider in clipped-in road shoes. It's simply illogical.

On a similar point:

Why did Ryan Hall (USA's fastest marathoner) say the new carbon shoe craze is a "game changer"? (Armstrong's podcast) Are stiffer soles only advantageous for runners?

The carbon plate in the running shoes, such as the VF4%, isn't there to make the shoe stiffer but to create energy return as it springs back.

Cycling really only involves generating power by pounding down on the pedals with the quads at least at high inertia and high RPM (like 40 kph, 90 RPM). If we are talking low intertia (like 10-15 kph) and low RPM (like 50-70 RPM) like in steep hillclimbing then pulling up has some benefit. But otherwise its really low force pounding down on the pedals....running shoes with rat trap pedals and you're gnerating just as much power as the $500 mouldable carbon shoes. Like I said, those shoes MAY be more aero , but power wise, like another person said on this thread...flip flop SPD system would probably be just as powerful assuming your arches are strong enough (which they should be if you are runner because there is way more instantaneous force each stride through the arch at 180 strides per minute running than there is during 90 RPM cycling).

No difference in power: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=AkMCYYNTWUY

Road shoes tend to have a more secure fit, but tri shoes are easier to get in and out of. For comfort reasons, many pros opt for road shoes (typically w/boa closures) for longer events where lightning fast transitions are less of an issue:
https://www.slowtwitch.com/...t_pictures_5187.html

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
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Plus he gets paid to say that. Let's not forget.

“Power transfer” is one of those BS catchphrases like “laterally stiff but vertically compliant “ or “we're going to build a wall, and have Mexico pay for it”.

If you repeat BS often enough, some people actually start to believe it.

I have never owned a carbon soled bike shoe in my entire life. I also use crappy $40 SPD (mtb cleat) Wellgo road pedals.

Between the shoes and pedals not “being optimized for power transfer” like that, it’s a miracle I can pedal a bike at all.

Or conversely: I’m just a grand in shoes and pedals away from winning the TdF.

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float , hammer , and jog