See, in bike racing you've got a follow car of some kind behind the pack or it's a parking lot crit. The assistance is there.

On a point 2 point tri, the other athlete could be the only assistance for some time.

I see no difference between a criminal vehicular hit and run and this. Adding the incentive of a triathlon just adds selfish motive to not stay at the scene.

We don't need people in these sports who will leave an injured person. Given that, I'd say dole out a year ban.

Incidents involving touches of bodies or wheels happens. Incidents implying fault even. However, those incidents are part of the sport. But.......leaving injured people behind is NOT part of that.

So yes, there is recourse here. Finding out who, then reporting the who to the organization, and asking the organization to do something. Even if they do nothing.

I wouldn't want that person in a race with me. Hitting you is one thing, but they might be the one that leaves you for dead!

Everyone is getting on here and acting like they are a saint.

I call BS on most of you because I have been the one on the side of the road and had dozens of riders whizz right by, who saw what happened with the road painted red in blood and just put their heads down and figured that someone else would deal with the fallen athlete and their race was more important. Almost none of you stop when I rider is down.

Most of the time, I don't really want to stop either. It takes every ounce of my humanity to grow up and realize its a mom/dad/husband/wife that needs help before I can come to my senses...and I've been the victim at the other end and I still have this racing priority when I am in racing mode....that's what makes most of us racers and if you ever bike race, you just leave the fallen/crashed athletes behind. That's bike racing. It just is. The race goes on. Its brutal but its actually part of bike racing. The race almost never stops for a crash. Remember when Fabio Casertelli hit the rock parapet on the Col d'Aspin in the Tour De France 1995. Well the race went on. Casertelli died and left a newborn son.




The next stage was neutralized but the stage that he died in just kept rolling on. The stage after the neutral stage. Team Motorola crossed the line together



Lance was on a mission and took every risk on the descent imaginable to take the race win.



I was in an Olympic tri 2 weeks ago. Multi loop race. A rider went down before I got to a certain point. I'll tell you what I did. I slowed down, but honestly I wanted to keep racing. There was another person (not a rider, I don't know who) tending to the fallen athlete. I went on with my race but at every aid station after kept telling the volunteers there is an athlete down. The people racing around me, said NOTHING. At the far end of the course I stopped and said, "you might want to get an ambulance out there if you have not". Luckily they got the message from other aid stations (not sure if it way mine or someone elses). By the next loop, I arrive to the spot (4x10km loop, so its only 16ish minutes later) and the ambulance is just getting there. No one wants to stop to make room for the ambulance. Everyone wants to keep racing (as did I, so its not like I am some sort of saint).

NO ONE WANTED TO STOP THEIR RACE TO HELP A FALLEN ATHLETE.

and this was at a local Olympic tri. Everyone was more concerned about their time on sportstats than the poor guy on the ground.

I'm sorry, but I am not buying all the saints on here saying they would just subserve their races to give primary care to another athlete. Most people don't in a race. They keep racing and expect the race staff to take care of the other guy.

To Ed, you'll be OK, just move on. I don't think we gain anything by hunting the guy down and asking for the "revenge" that most people on here are asking for (ban him, shame him, whatever), because I BET that if they were in the same situation in the race as the other guy with you, not knowing exactly the extent of your injury, and with adrenaline through the roof, they pick up their bike and move on. What would I do ? I don't know. I don't think any of us can sit here as keyboard warriors and know what we would do. As a keyboard warrior my answer is, "the right thing to do is to look after Ed on that spot". But in the heat of a race, maybe trying to chase "an only important to me top 20 in my age group", I don't think my thought process would be so clear.

I've also been the guy on the ground in an Olympic, taken away in an ambulance. Only one that stopped was my friend. In my case though the guy that caused it was also down and hid bike destroyed and he couldn't go anywhere. But TBH I am glad he was there, because he knew what to do after a crash and he kept me calm until ambulance arrived (injuries were quite bad but no head injury thank god)

I do think there is a difference between someone actually causing a crash, and going down as a result, and walking over to the one you crashed out... and people whizzing by after the fact. I think here he had a responsibility to give up his own race and see that Ed was attended to. I have seen crashes but to date by the time I am there someone else has gotten there and I have no relevant training, when that has happened I notify the next race representative I see.

I would like to think if I was first on the scene I would stop. But have not been tested

I think the other problem here is we have a sport where people come from different backgrounds:

1. Biking, you don't stop for the fallen.....the race goes on
2. Soccer, it does not stop...unless the ref stops it. You ignore who is down
3. Hockey....ignore who is down tell the play is called
4. Swimming....the scenario is not applicable
5. Running...in track if someone cramps up and crumples in their lane, or in a 1500m get stepped on and spiked, the race just goes on after the bumping, grinding and falling. No one cares about the person who falls. The race goes on. The person who fell, that's their problem
6. Football...play goes on till play ends and ref blows whistle
7. Rugby...same deal
8. XC skiing....the race goes on every time somoene else crashed. They could slam their head into a tree on a 60 kph descent and its just like bike racing...the race goes one
9. Speed skating, short and long track....you keep hammering after the other person crashes.
10. Golf/tennis....not really applicable

I'm trying to find one sport that anyone does competitively where you actually stop and halt the competition if someone gets hurt. I don't think there is a sport where ahtletes on their own halt the competition. The ref either stops the game or the game goes on. This is what most people are trained in as athletes before they even get to triathlon. Its no surprise there is minimal Sainthood out on the race courses. These instincts are hard to break

So if you put athletes from a variety of competitive backgrounds in a worlds race, I actually don't expect anyone to stop, I really don't....If I crash, cross my fingers and pray that someone infoms the next aid station. Heck maybe for all we know the athlete that crashed into Ed went to the next aid station to get help because that's people a more useful thing to do than just stand there and fake like you can render medical support when most of us cannot ( I have my training in the military and can render rudimentary life saving stuff to a mate, but I am no medic....I think most of us are in that boat).

I realize I am taking a position that many of you may both disagree with while finding uncomfortable...I kind of feel like Col Jessop calling it like it is in a few good men, "you want the truth...."

Hey, no movie quotes !

The huge diffeence in virtually all the other sports is that help is immediately to hand from non-competitors , eg doctors/ physios at the side of the pitch at Football, rugby etc.
In cycle racing (at the upper end at least) there's support cars just behind.
Long course Triathlon however you're out on your own, some times in the arse end of nowhere. That places more responsibility on others who are around in the race.

Oh - and I have stopped to help in my 1st full distance race. It cost me 10 mins.
My deal with the guy concerned was it was we would say it was 20+ minutes if my buddy caught me 😁

 
Dev, I a bit surprised at you position on this. And its true it might all stem for your opening sentence:

I think the other problem here is we have a sport where people come from different backgrounds:



The background that I come from is one that I recognize that even at a '70.3 World Championship' event, there are certain priorities that take precedent. Even in the middle of battle, we must remember that the welfare of people is paramount - this is a AGE GROUP race. Its middle aged Athletics, that is just bragging rights.

The individual that hit Ed, knew he messed up. He was off the bike, and yelled that it was actually Ed's fault. With Ed in a heap, and his bike broken, there is no way he did'nt know Ed was messed up, bad. How the hell do you not, as a rational PERSON, not expect him to stay and help. Instead he just leaves....

My Background would not even consider leaving under those circumstances. Anything else is just Criminal.

Dev

I think your comment about it being in the heat of the race is important. It was likely a split second decision that caused the accident and another split decision not to stop. Given the descent, once 5 seconds had passed, stopping wasnt really an option anymore. While I’m not defending this guy (and like to think I would stop!) i agree that context matters and it’s easy to say behind a keyboard with plenty of time to think about it that we would all stop.

I’ve been on the receiving end that resulted in a broken hip. I was pissed, but moved on. Regardless, I hope OP heals well!! It does suck.

He fell too.

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Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
Instagram • Facebook

Hmmm I guess I did read that above, but forgot. Again, not that I was saying this guy was “right” before, but That does change things in my opinion. That’s makes it much more deliberate. Still heat of the moment, somewhat; he may have been stunned, like you. But, he had a clear chance to regroup, look at you, make a decision about his next move. etc. that’s a bit different than blowing by an injured person at 40 mph. Anyways, it sucks for you for so many reasons. And nothing will change that. Speedy recovery!

I'd like to think that would stop in a situation like this but honestly I'm just a different person when I'm racing, not a total asshole but dangerously close. Not proud of it - I haven't been tested yet so hopefully I'll do the right thing.

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"They know f_ck-all over at Slowtwitch"
- Lionel Sanders

I have to wonder if there were other people around that may have been in a better position to help. If not then I'll agree that this offender is just pure bad news.

I am prettttty confident I'd stop, but as soon as someone with a phone or with expertise showed up I'd be outta there. Not like I'd be of any help medically beyond "pressure on wound" type stuff for a conscious person.

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Too old to go pro but doing it anyway
http://instagram.com/tgarvey4

Obviously I did get help. And pretty quickly. And since I was on my back I could not see if or when he left. But when I asked the people helping me about the guy that hit me, they did not know that I had been hit and they said he must have left.

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Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
Instagram • Facebook

I don't mean to say I'd assume you'd get help and bail. But once I was confident you were getting the best care in the moment and there was nothing I could do to help, then I'd go. I'd just be clutter.

Really unfortunate, and it sounds like the guy was way in the wrong to me. I hope you recover fast and well. Sorry some people suck at this sport.

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Too old to go pro but doing it anyway
http://instagram.com/tgarvey4

In response to devashish_paul

Sailing maybe
“There’s a code amongst thieves out there,” said Ken Read, who skippered PUMA Ocean Racing’s il Mostro team to a second-place finish in the 2008-09 Volvo. “One minute you’re trying to beat the guy at all costs, the next you’re his life raft.”

https://www.wsj.com/...high-seas-1418936913

Back in 2008 I was competing in World Freeskiing Championships here in Alaska. Skiers go in time trial sort of format , though runs are not timed but judged on difficulty, fluidity, aggression etc (kind of like figure skating, but that is another thread topic).

Anyway a skier couple guys ahead of me hits big cliff, lands wrong , tomahawks into outhouse sized rock... lights out, game over for him.

The organizers canceled the rest of the day but everyone voted to go back up the next day and finish event.

This scenario is tangently related to OP but it makes you wonder what the point is , risk vs reward for any of these endeavors. We all convinced ourselves that the guy ‘would want us to finish’ and ‘ he died doing what he loved’.

I’m not so sure about that.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

Sorry to hear this Ed. I was following you Sunday and wondered what happened. Hoped it was mechanical only. Heal up and try to be optimistic about how much worse things could have gone.

There’s no excuse for hitting anyone from behind. Wholly on the closing rider and if u have any knowledge of the course that spot In Carros is not a place for passing.

My wife raced Saturday and had the opposite start position. Last wave:( She is a wicked descender and was obstructed the entire downhill by side by side descending riders. She did benefit that a moto came along and started helping to clear out those blocking.

It is a great course and wonderful venue. Sorry you weren’t able to finish or enjoy your last day or two here:(

I guess only a few of us are willing to admit that we become dangerously close to being assholes while racing, but the reality that I've seen out there, is that the majority once racing turn into exactly that person. You see it all the time in swims with the mass start kicking and punching that never happens in real life! In any case, I don't think its worth judging a fellow competitor based on a split second bad decision in racing. Any of us can turn into that person, even though here on the keyboard, or in a cafe we are all civil to each other (well, minus the obligatory ST forum name calling etc).

At the moment that the guy smashed into Ed, he "felt" Ed was in the wrong. Ed has no eyes in the back of his head so we know that Ed was in the right, but it does not matter what we know now, at that moment he felt Ed was wrong, was angry, picked up his bike and left because he THOUGHT that it was Ed's fault so why should he stick around/ He made that bad decision with adrenaline pumping and with his race being his primary filter. Its not the right thing, but it was his reaction at the time. As DFW_tri said, once 5 seconds (or more like 30 seconds) down the road even if he realized he was wrong, it's too late to go back up.

Ed, my suggestion is to move on and forgive the guy for his bad reaction. He was not thinking clearly. There is no way he wanted to hurt you. None of us want to hurt another competitor (even the person who reacts in the water with a retaliatory punch on account of bodies bumping is just trying to signal to the bumper to get away, not too hurt the bumper). At that moment he was selfishly thinking about his own race, but racing is inherently selfish, so that's the primary mindset that we need to pull our minds out of when someone is hurt. Its harder to do than most on here are making out. If it was easy to do, EVERYONE WOULD STOP FOR A DOWNED RIDER until medical aid come, but almost everyone keeps racing and almost no one goes to the next aid station to ask for help (and slow down their own race).

I liked the sailing analogy that one of you guys brought up. I think it is a great one. I would like to think we can all behave like sailors and one moment try to beat the other person but at the next moment be their first line of medical support. Maybe this is required "pre race briefing" and cultural indoctrination into our sport. Right now, there is no norm for it. If there was I would not keep seeing tons of people keep on racing every time a rider is down (a few times it was me, in many races its others.

So I'm sitting here in an arm chair at 4am because it's to painful to lie flat to sleep. I definitely appreciate your point of view, Dev. I'm not the one calling for criminal charges or banning. But I would like to know who it was and get an understanding of how they were riding. Did they get a penalty and were trying to make up for it with an extra-dangerous descent? There were TONS of guys in the penalty tent at the top of Col de Vence.

You've made several posts admonishing me to not seek revenge or punishment, but I don't think I have once stated on this thread that is what I want.

Edit: I know he obviously did not intend to run into me or hurt me. It caused him to crash too and risked his own race and health. He did make a conscious decision to ride recklessly or beyond his capability putting others at risk and for that he can be blamed. And as for leaving, since he crashed it's not like 5 seconds later he was too far down the road. He was standing over me.

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Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
Instagram • Facebook

Dev,


You are obviously a very bright guy, and you add so much to the forum, but your below statement is just plain dumb. If an activity leads to “two life altering accidents” I would hardly consider it “pretty safe.” At least not over the long haul. Racing on a bike designed to go fast is a relatively high risk activity as your (and my) accident record demonstrates.


“Riding outside is generally pretty safe (50% of us will die from a heart attack or cancer before we die from biking) and in my life I have had two life altering accidents (I got run over by a bus last year in a kind of freak accident)....but I still think that if you want to actually do races on real bikes, then you better be riding outside and not spend your time on trainer and show up and be a hazard to everyone on race day....or pack your bike up to your basement and just race in your virtual Zwift world, but please don't show up to a real race.....especially a race with technical descending.”

Hey Ed, another ST thread that took off on its own!!! Hope you are doing better and better, sounds like everything will heal back to 100%, and of course bikes are bikes, just an excuse to replace and/or upgrade your front end!

When I first read your report, it brought back almost exact memories I had in Catalina Island one year, only we were lapping slower riders. I too was braking into a hair pin turn, and out of no where some guy wraps his arms around me and we go flying to the ground, him on top, while I slide on the pavement. IT was such a shock and happened so quick, I had no idea what the hell happened. Thought maybe someone jumped out of a tree on top of me even. But the dude apparently hit a bump, knocked his arms off his bars, so he could not brake behind me, so his survival instinct said to just grab the guy in front to break his fall..

Like you I was pretty pissed at the time, I was able to bend my bars, and ride one legged back to T2, and even hobbled/jogged the run. Figured I might heal a bit better if I didn't let everything real stiff, turned out I had a separated shoulder too..

So not much to add, except the anger you feel towards this guy will fade, and one day it is just a story to tell, when someone asks about that scar..I understand you are not holding some of the vitriol in this thread at this guy, good on you for that, it serves no purpose. I never got to talk to my guys either, he of course had a soft landing and got back and continued on too. For about 10 seconds after I actually figured out what happened, I just wanted to punch him out, but that faded quickly and it was time to just do what I could to get help, and heal...

Biking: actually riders do stop, especially mountain biking, but in my 20 years of mass start racing road, mountain, cross and gravel the rule I have observed is people stop/assist for riders down. And even for flats and mechanicals where the rider is clearly fine- you hear a chorus of "need anything?" going by. I have given up tubes, CO2 ect in races before to people I don't know. Even in Xterra this is common in my personal experience.

In Tri- with the strong "no outside assistance" rule, often very large bike fields, roving moto's ect, it is easy to see how most racers could logically think "Oh they got this covered" whereas the same person in a mountain bike race would automatically check.

While I find Triathletes on average to be terrifyingly bad bike handlers in traffic (lack of practice, nature of TT bikes, red mist of racing, and fatigue probably all play roles), I do not find them any less altruistic. In fact- in pre-race transition I find them to be more than willing to help complete strangers, beginners with a spare set of goggles, water bottle ect.

Thanks for sharing your story. My anger at the guy is already fading but I think I will always be disappointed to not be able to see what I could have done that day. While I certainly was not going to be at the top of the AG, I was having the strongest bike segment I'd ever had, I felt great and I was having so much FUN.

I think the travel has put some extra strain on me as the pain has increased significantly starting last night. Going to the Ortho today and hopefully he'll confirm that nothing serious is wrong.

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Ed O'Malley
www.VeloVetta.com
Founder of VeloVetta Cycling Shoes
Instagram • Facebook