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Aha moment in running? Injury free?
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Looking for the collective wisdom of ST.

Has anybody gone from perpetually (or at least chronically) injured to injury free / injury resistant?

I have tried many many things but without much success.

The only potential exception is treadmill running...

Thanks in advance

PS: in case relevant. I am a FOP 43 yo male, with a 1.32 to 1.37 HIM run; around 4.30 for a flat course HIM
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [ejd_mil] [ In reply to ]
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Combining Barry P with Dr. Maffetone heart rate training. This kept my ITB at bay and allowed me to complete my first full marathon with a BQ.

I’m trying the Phitzinger ~85 mile per week plan. So mixing in some speed work now. But all other runs are at MAF HR.
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [ejd_mil] [ In reply to ]
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I have struggled with shin splints, knee pains, hip pains, ITB inflammation, groin pulls my whole life. It was constantly several different pains at any point in time resulting in several weeks on and several weeks off. This last year was the first year things started to disappear. I don't have any pains at this point. A couple things I changed was my diet and training speeds. I went LCHF and from running 7:30 average pace to 8:15-8:30 average pace. What is your training run pace? I am not going to get into LCHF here but to say I believe the inflammation I had previously played a part in my issues. Having weak supporting muscles was the biggest contributor though. Do you have a local run coach that can help you with proper form?

http://www.sfuelsgolonger.com
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [ejd_mil] [ In reply to ]
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When I realized I never truely listened to my body’s clues before injuries happened .. the signs were always there, I was just an idiot

Edit: And not acting on those clues such as strengthening my hips for IT band
Last edited by: randomtriguy: Dec 22, 18 18:26
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [ejd_mil] [ In reply to ]
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run more, run slower eventually leads to running more, running faster
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [ejd_mil] [ In reply to ]
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I use to heel strike and also suffered regular leg injuries (knee pain, ITB, achilles, etc). I watched this video and changed the way I land and I haven't had a serious injury since. Could be, but I don't think it's just a coincidence.

If the link doesn't work, just search Ryan Hall foot strike.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82ghOr78FcU
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [bpdupre] [ In reply to ]
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bpdupre wrote:
I used to heel strike and also suffered regular leg injuries (knee pain, ITB, achilles, etc). I watched this video and changed the way I land and I haven't had a serious injury since. Could be, but I don't think it's just a coincidence. ...
Ryan Hall foot strike.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82ghOr78FcU


that's all true of course - BUT I would argue it's explained kinda backwards.

1. Foot strike is a symptom of your running posture. So foot strike is a result, not a root cause.
2. Where the foot lands, starts with the position of the pelvis over your femurs, and your core strength over your pelvis.
3. Alignment is huge & imo the priority (in all of triathlon). Alignment is efficiency. Alignment is reduced injury. And ultimately speed over distance.

Coach Timo Limo's posture is like wow and has such an amazing run stride:
<

If you are "bent" and muscle your runs, you are not going to be efficient (use of tons of energy), distance will be short and increase risk of injury. When I started running in 2012 I was a mess. OMG my quads and legs would hurt so bad. Then the over-striding/loading injuries.

Training Tweets: https://twitter.com/Jagersport_com
FM Sports: http://fluidmotionsports.com
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [ejd_mil] [ In reply to ]
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I feel like consistent frequency (6 runs/week, BarryP-ish style) + rotating 2-3 different pairs/models of running shoes helped me out in this area.
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [ejd_mil] [ In reply to ]
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I can comment on just the opposite. Never injured to the point of no running. 40 years of running and still going.

1. I rarely run in the same shoe two days in a row. It’s easy I work in the shoe industry so my shoe cost is much lower but the fact remains I rotate multiple shoes with multiple different stack heights and midsole offsets daily.
2. I run frequently and also walk 3 hours a week with the dog.
3. I rarely run on the track. Speed work is done on grass or trails.
4. Drills and strides two to three times per week.
5. Keep my weight down. Right now I’m the heaviest I’ve ever been and I can feel it.
6. Know when to say enough is enough. If it doesn’t feel right to go run I have learned to skip the run. I can feel when my alignment is bad and don’t hesitate to go see my doc. I never try to make up a run I skipped.
7. I choose to run outside all the time. Easy because I live in So. Cal but that was also true living in Germany and when I travel which is a great deal. This year I’ve run in NYC, Boston, London, Rotterdam, Rome, Beijing, Shanghai, Kona, Waikiki. In some of those it would be easier to run the treadmill but I don’t, I go outside.
8. Hill repeats year round.
9. 15 minutes of Yoga every day. Started that in 2018 and it’s the best thing I did this year.

Does running ever hurt? It sure does sometimes it hurts a great deal. I know I’ve been on the cusp of injury often. Either I’ve been lucky or simply smart I’ve known where that red line is and know not to cross it.

Dave Jewell
Free Run Speed

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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [ejd_mil] [ In reply to ]
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I’d say the number one thing is listening to your body. I’ve had several ITB and Achilles injuries over the past ten years and the majority of them were exacerbated because I didn’t stop immediately when something felt a little ‘off.’ There are often signs at or before an injury that we need to listen to. Often as type-a athletes folks want to finish a workout or push through a little pain. I’ve learned that’s just stupid and leads to lots of lost training after an injury develops.

I’ve also had several of my injuries when I was being coached and kind of felt that I had to finish a given workout - I’ve learned that’s foolish and I’ve been a lot less injury riddled as a self-coached athlete when I’m accountable to myself.

Blog: http://262toboylstonstreet.blogspot.com/
https://twitter.com/NateThomasTri
Coaching: https://bybtricoaching.com/ - accepting athletes for 2023
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [natethomas] [ In reply to ]
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Give the book "Running Rewired" by Jay Dicharry a read...then follow the concepts. Great tool for running performance and injury prevention.

CB
Physical Therapist/Endurance Coach
http://www.cadencept.net
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [STJ_2028] [ In reply to ]
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STJ_2028 wrote:
I feel like consistent frequency (6 runs/week, BarryP-ish style) + rotating 2-3 different pairs/models of running shoes helped me out in this area.

That's what worked for me too.

The point is, ladies and gentleman, that speed, for lack of a better word, is good. Speed is right, Speed works. Speed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [solitude] [ In reply to ]
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the guy who said run more, more often, and run slower and then you will run faster. speed with no enough base is the killer. 10-15 of your mile at the MOST can be above z2. I have won my AG in several IM's with 10-12 miles total above z2 in the 12 week build up the race. Z2 is not easy when you are good at it.

Be patient and run 5x a week at a z2 HR, test yourself with 5 miles on a TM or track at Z2. Until you top progressing on that test, don't even bother with any speed. And at that point it does not take much.
Last edited by: DBF: Dec 23, 18 16:05
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [SharkFM] [ In reply to ]
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I'm sure you're right, that better posture and alignment are what is ultimately keeping me injury free. But running form is a bit like a golf swing for me, where if I have too many mechanical thoughts in my head it gets ugly. I think for me just focusing on the foot strike is a simple thought that also leads me to better posture and alignment. Thanks for sharing the video (I look like an uncoordinated goofball trying some of those drills !)
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [ejd_mil] [ In reply to ]
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This year has been a bit of a breakthrough for me. While running I keep saying:
Posture, foot fall, relax, cadence.

I’m running in Salming D5’s. 5 mm drop and kept seeing the back outside heals wearing off - same with all my old shoes.

Knees just kept hurting and I blamed it on everything from imbalances to weak hip flexors to tight this or that.

I was studying some of the barefoot discussion and decided to try and stop heal striking and start mid foot landing. 180 cadence and a posture where my foot was landing more under my body. I am still in my same Salming D5’s and I have to think about how I’m running - so it’s not natural yet - about a month in.

So far no injuries and my knees are feeing good since the change.

Dan Kennison

facebook: @triPremierBike
http://www.PremierBike.com
http://www.PositionOneSports.com
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [solitude] [ In reply to ]
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solitude wrote:
run more, run slower eventually leads to running more, running faster

This.

The only injury that has sidelined me was a meniscus tear. I dissected the injury 200 ways before I found what I think was the cause. We moved. Prior to moving I could step out my door and run a 5 mile out and back with zero turns / corners. After moving our new neighborhood was exactly one mile end to end. So to get any volume I had to zig zag through every corner possible. I was marathon training so I went from 10-15 mile runs with zero turns to 10-15 mile runs with a 90 degree turn about every quarter mile. Never thought twice about it until it was too late and the damage was done.
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [bpdupre] [ In reply to ]
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bpdupre wrote:
I'm sure you're right, that better posture and alignment are what is ultimately keeping me injury free. But running form is a bit like a golf swing for me, where if I have too many mechanical thoughts in my head it gets ugly. I think for me just focusing on the foot strike is a simple thought that also leads me to better posture and alignment. Thanks for sharing the video (I look like an uncoordinated goofball trying some of those drills !)

I did the drills this morning. It was like trying to learn to line dance. Def keeps you on your toes! Also activates the feet and ankles and works to create spring.

I have feeling that "safety position" in running is straight legs. What I mean by that is I use way less energy when my legs are straight and I am turning over them (like poles) with my hips over top. That is what these drills re-inforce imo.

Being a bender saps energy.

Training Tweets: https://twitter.com/Jagersport_com
FM Sports: http://fluidmotionsports.com
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [SharkFM] [ In reply to ]
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SharkFM wrote:

...
I have feeling that "safety position" in running is straight legs. What I mean by that is I use way less energy when my legs are straight and I am turning over them (like poles) with my hips over top. That is what these drills re-inforce imo.

Being a bender saps energy.


Maybe straighter than you personally would run otherwise but dead straight? I think if you look at the form of top runners there would consistently be a small bend at the knee when the legs are bearing weight. Too much bend would be bad but that doesn't mean no bend. I also don't think we are particularly great at sensing exactly what our bodies are doing while running. Maybe they just feel completely straight. Take some videos, maybe your legs are straight, when they are under you, but you'd be the exception and I can only think that would make somewhere more injury prone - maybe the knee?

The other thing is that if you have an injury history in a specific part of the body then we can shift to a way of running that helps there but taxes somewhere else. That might be a price worth paying. But it doesn't make it the right thing for everyone. No idea if that applies to you.

ETA the straight in the video means overall posture and bent means bent at the waist, for instance. It doesn't mean the legs.
Last edited by: OddSlug: Dec 24, 18 13:05
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Re: Aha moment in running? Injury free? [solitude] [ In reply to ]
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solitude wrote:
run more, run slower eventually leads to running more, running faster

Yeah this. I was getting all sorts of injuries, predominantly muscle tears, calves especially. That was only running 30 - 40 a week. I couldn't go 3 months without picking up an injury. I made zero progress in 2 years. Ditched intervals and ran slow, following the 80/20 philosophy. Actually for 6 months I was doing 80% easy, 20% moderate. Nothing hard. I've now been injury free for 2 years. Running 80km a week, some weeks over 100 with no problems. And I can now do interval work.
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