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Re: Aging of the IM field [IT] [ In reply to ]
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As a 25 y/o, the gross over-generalizations of millennials kill me. Though it may be true that millennials are generally more aware and conscious of these issues, that doesn't make us all social justice warriors. Neither myself nor anyone in my social circle is as extreme as the pictures painted of us in this thread... I'm a competitive AG'er and show up to local races with a good showing of other competitive 25-29 year olds. I'm more inclined to support local races (sprint, Oly, Half) than shell out $500 for an IM branded 70.3 with an overcrowded bike course. But I can promise you that as one of the largest generations head count wise, we are far more diverse than the mainstream media portrays us to be...
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Re: Aging of the IM field [spencer99w] [ In reply to ]
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spencer99w wrote:
As a 25 y/o, the gross over-generalizations of millennials kill me. Though it may be true that millennials are generally more aware and conscious of these issues, that doesn't make us all social justice warriors. Neither myself nor anyone in my social circle is as extreme as the pictures painted of us in this thread... I'm a competitive AG'er and show up to local races with a good showing of other competitive 25-29 year olds. I'm more inclined to support local races (sprint, Oly, Half) than shell out $500 for an IM branded 70.3 with an overcrowded bike course. But I can promise you that as one of the largest generations head count wise, we are far more diverse than the mainstream media portrays us to be...

So glad to hear that. That is encouraging because the media makes it sound as if everyone has bought into the doom. You are not anymore doomed than the rest of us lol

Carry on.

Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [IT] [ In reply to ]
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IT wrote:

It's awful what's done to each generation. When I was young, we had nuclear bomb drills and a nuclear clock. The world was going to end due to overpopulation. Gasoline and food was supposed to be long gone by now. Y2K.

And Documentaries like the one below don't help alleviate this worry. Humans do continue to press on no matter how much stress we cause the planet with our endless wars, consumption, overpopulation, environmental destruction, etc. Maybe the end is nearing for us sooner than we want to believe. I hope not. I still have many bucket list races :-)

10 Billion
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jV5xiRKw5f4



Death is easy....peaceful. Life is harder.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [70Trigirl] [ In reply to ]
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70Trigirl wrote:
IT wrote:


It's awful what's done to each generation. When I was young, we had nuclear bomb drills and a nuclear clock. The world was going to end due to overpopulation. Gasoline and food was supposed to be long gone by now. Y2K.


And Documentaries like the one below don't help alleviate this worry. Humans do continue to press on no matter how much stress we cause the planet with our endless wars, consumption, overpopulation, environmental destruction, etc. Maybe the end is nearing for us sooner than we want to believe. I hope not. I still have many bucket list races :-)

10 Billion
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jV5xiRKw5f4


One of the great things about sport is the impact it has on an individual and society. That participation in sport is declining and fear increasing is not desirable IMO. Scare tactics have been used for in the past to get people to do what they normally wouldn't do - like kill other people.

Would this be a utopian or dystopian society that a Hitler would try to sell in today's world?
  1. Maintain humanity under 500,000,000 in perpetual balance with nature.
  2. Guide reproduction wisely — improving fitness and diversity.
  3. Unite humanity with a living new language.
  4. Rule passion — faith — tradition — and all things with tempered reason.
  5. Protect people and nations with fair laws and just courts.
  6. Let all nations rule internally resolving external disputes in a world court.
  7. Avoid petty laws and useless officials.
  8. Balance personal rights with social duties.
  9. Prize truth — beauty — love — seeking harmony with the infinite.
  10. Be not a cancer on the earth — Leave room for nature — Leave room for nature.

It's honest of you to say what you're concerns are. I could see how some would take the concerns so seriously as to not want to participate in sports. Still don't think that is good, if that is what is happening.

Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [triczyk] [ In reply to ]
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triczyk wrote:
M33 here, started when I was M28 in the sport, about to drop out of the sport pretty soon...so I feel qualified to comment - these are my top-10 BROAD generalizations as I've seen it

1) Sport is really good for when you're either (1) single or (2) deeply involved in a relationship with established parenting routines. When you're actively dating / starting out / etc. It can be consuming. Hence why maybe 28-35ers are focused on family planning and cannot / will not allocate 8-15+ hours a week to triathlon. If you have an 8 and 12 year old who spends 2 hours a day at soccer, you probably can be efficient an workout alongside them. An 8 month old is still trying to breathe right.
2) The younger AG <25 is focused on getting careers in order, finding new social circles - and probably not willing to spend $1,000 for an IM weekend (I was not)
3) Sunday races suck, and Saturday bike check-in is a joke. Nobody wants to spend the weekend bothering yourself and your family with proper hydration, nutition, etc. and rest when you're potentially visiting a new place. All to get your "nutrition" locked in for a 23rd OA place or something like that. Then its Sunday at 11am and its time to go home, and go to work. We need more Saturday morning races (where you check in saturday). This is why I only do Saturday races with packet pick up the morning of the race.
4) Running is cool again. Its very cool. Trail running is all the rage. And you can run 7 hours a week and get very good. Oh, and you can workout once a day (or maybe just 8-10x a week). Triathlon can't compete with that. Want to stay fit, feel like an athlete and have a life? Run.
5) Working out twice a day every day is really draining and selfish. Younger generations like to socialize a bit more. Balance perhaps? Grind out a 1 hour workout in the morning and have the day free.
6) People are freaking out about biking on public roads. I see it more and more than even 6 years ago. And before you try, the trainer is uber boring and not a substitute to a 6am sunrise bike ride.
7) Younger folks can afford triathlon, but they prefer to travel. Where you've been is the Happy Hour brag vs. what you've done. Most <40s are thinking about the next weekend trip to Europe, not planning their 23 hour training weekend.
8) Drinking is really accessible and "trendy". Wine, micro brews, etc. Not a healthy hobby (or something I advocate), but it creates a lot more distractions (Hey Teddy, wanna go check out "Local Brewery XYZ", vs. "Hey Teddy, how about we smash some FTP intervals for 45 min?") The former happens more.
9) Young people either (1) really get into tris and kick ass or (2) are one and dones. You older folks love to grind out in the sport and be slow as F. I don't see that trend with 30 year olds as they do not appreciate just being there (and hence why old AGs grind it out).
10) Only had 9.

Sport won't die and when you're at the next IM branded race you'll feel like its the center of the world with 2,500 people there. So who cares? Its still fun (if you're into it, and probably old).

I've done several tris including two full IM Wisconsin races, and am in the dreaded aging demo just over 50 (how the hell did that happen).

My last IMWI, I spent around $800 entry, and multi-night stay in Madison (I think rates were jacked up on hotels). I enjoyed the actual race, but overall was kind of a pain and expensive. And I got a talking to about a ridiculous pre-race bike helmet situation.

Two weeks later I ran a 5k on Chicago Lakefront. I showed up late for that race and had to run for the signup. Got my bib fastened just as the gun went off. Set a PR and placed in my age group (no great shakes, it was a slower field that day, but I'll take it). Hour later I was sitting with wife and friends at a lakefront bar, drinking a margarita with fish tacos and enjoying the rest of the day. I looked at my wife and said something like "Remind me why I did IM?". I mean, for a $40 5K entrance fee (which by the way went to cancer research and not a race corporation), I got a placement medal not just participant, and was enjoying life with a margarita. :)

Sorry I am dogging IM. I enjoyed IM and met a lot of nice people along the way. I am still proud of accomplishing the mass start swim, something I had a lot of concern about, but actually ended up enjoying. (Sadly IMWI has gotten rid of the mass start swim.) Also I volunteered 4 times for IMWI (handed out water to bikers, finish line catcher, twice kayak swim helper). IM has it's good and bad points. I think for IM to encourage participation, they should lower costs and also cater more to the non "tri lifestyle" folks. The people who "race to train" are all-in already as customers, and generally get more out of IM than people like me who "train to race" and are not looking for the lifestyle aspect and something to fill a year of their time.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [Indio22] [ In reply to ]
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The spirit of your reply is spot on. Do something productive and then enjoy the day.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [triczyk] [ In reply to ]
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triczyk wrote:
The spirit of your reply is spot on. Do something productive and then enjoy the day.

This is exactly how I feel about 70.3. It's still a hard day. But 4.5-5 hours later and I'm hanging out with my family again and drinking a beer.

vs

"ok, wave to daddy as he gets on his bike. He'll be back in 5-6 hours!"
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Re: Aging of the IM field [Geek_fit] [ In reply to ]
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Geek_fit wrote:
triczyk wrote:
The spirit of your reply is spot on. Do something productive and then enjoy the day.

This is exactly how I feel about 70.3. It's still a hard day. But 4.5-5 hours later and I'm hanging out with my family again and drinking a beer.

vs

"ok, wave to daddy as he gets on his bike. He'll be back in 5-6 hours!"

That’s fair - but did you do everything you wanted to on Saturday before?
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Re: Aging of the IM field [triczyk] [ In reply to ]
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I'm not sure I understand your question
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Re: Aging of the IM field [Geek_fit] [ In reply to ]
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Geek_fit wrote:
I'm not sure I understand your question

I might be different but the 3-4 hours it take to check in your bike the day before is sorta a waste of a weekend in my opinion
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Re: Aging of the IM field [triczyk] [ In reply to ]
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Why is it taking you 3-4 hours to drop a bike off in transition?
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Re: Aging of the IM field [Geek_fit] [ In reply to ]
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Geek_fit wrote:
I'm not sure I understand your question

I guess the point is that the time commitment is much more than just race day. If it is not a local race you are having your family travel days before, attend checkin, bike drop, etc all in the day/s before the actual race. You are doing this while trying to maintain a strict diet. You are probably completely distracted, maybe grumpy, maybe on an emotional rollercoaster.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [TIT] [ In reply to ]
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All those things could be applied to running as well...

If it's not local, you have to travel.
You could be managing your diet...and being grumpy.

There are many local tri races (at least around me) that can register morning of. Are reasonably cheap and fun. Yes, even half irons.

But I do understand what you're saying. A local 5k is of course going to be easier logistically than traveling to an Ironman. As well as training for one.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [Geek_fit] [ In reply to ]
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Geek_fit wrote:
Why is it taking you 3-4 hours to drop a bike off in transition?

It probably depends on the actual race. I've only sone one 70.3 so far but there was an hour car drive between T2/finish where I had to checkin and T1 where I had to drop my bike. When I got there, parking was extremely limited and there was a sea of people. It took up the whole of Saturday morning.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [TIT] [ In reply to ]
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Sounds like PAcific Crest! haha.

I understand what you're saying. IM takes a crap ton of logistics. 70.3 (I would argue) takes less than half the logistics
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Re: Aging of the IM field [Geek_fit] [ In reply to ]
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Geek_fit wrote:
All those things could be applied to running as well...

If it's not local, you have to travel.
You could be managing your diet...and being grumpy.

There are many local tri races (at least around me) that can register morning of. Are reasonably cheap and fun. Yes, even half irons.

But I do understand what you're saying. A local 5k is of course going to be easier logistically than traveling to an Ironman. As well as training for one.

Bolded is the real issue. Does someone really have a problem dedicating one weekend to a big race? Not likely. Ironman race day (& weekend) is magical and I love it. It's the months of weekends prior to race day that make me want to have no part of it going forward.

For a 70.3 and shorter I can do my normal weekday training that's part of my routine, and some shorter stuff on weekend mornings (if it works out), and still have a great race.

What I dislike about triathlon in particular, is that having to keep up with all 3 sports means that it's almost impossible to train an hour or less a day (1 session), and keep anywhere near good fitness. You can be an awesome runner on 1 hr a day.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [Sean H] [ In reply to ]
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Sean H wrote:
Geek_fit wrote:
All those things could be applied to running as well...

If it's not local, you have to travel.
You could be managing your diet...and being grumpy.

There are many local tri races (at least around me) that can register morning of. Are reasonably cheap and fun. Yes, even half irons.

But I do understand what you're saying. A local 5k is of course going to be easier logistically than traveling to an Ironman. As well as training for one.


Bolded is the real issue. Does someone really have a problem dedicating one weekend to a big race? Not likely. Ironman race day (& weekend) is magical and I love it. It's the months of weekends prior to race day that make me want to have no part of it going forward.

For a 70.3 and shorter I can do my normal weekday training that's part of my routine, and some shorter stuff on weekend mornings (if it works out), and still have a great race.

What I dislike about triathlon in particular, is that having to keep up with all 3 sports means that it's almost impossible to train an hour or less a day (1 session), and keep anywhere near good fitness. You can be an awesome runner on 1 hr a day.

Yeah, that's basically what I said above. 70.3 is a pretty ideal distance. At least for me, I don't have to do much more than what I would normally do (I average about 7-8 hours a week) and still stay near the pointy end of competition.

For IM...7-8 hours basically puts me MOP. Probably wouldn't even be there if I wasn't a strong swimmer.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [Geek_fit] [ In reply to ]
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Geek_fit wrote:
Why is it taking you 3-4 hours to drop a bike off in transition?

It depends on the race. One IM we did had a split transition which was located far from everything else. From our AirB&B we had to walk almost 30 minutes to the train station through crowds of tourists. By the time we got off the train it was probably another hour (looking at maps, purchasing tickets, waiting for train, train ride). Then we had another 20-30 minute walk to transition. After that we had to walk back to the train, take the train and walk back to our accommodations, again fighting crowds of tourists. It was long and tedious and took a good portion of the day. But other races have been much easier where we only spent maybe an hour getting bikes to transition.

Death is easy....peaceful. Life is harder.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [70Trigirl] [ In reply to ]
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Right. There are always going to be outlier cases. I've done local running races that required a bus ride and waiting around for it to start. But that should hopefully be far from the norm for most races.

Again, I'm not saying a 5k takes the same day of effort as an IM. I just don't think 3-4 hours to check in your bike is the norm
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Re: Aging of the IM field [Geek_fit] [ In reply to ]
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Geek_fit wrote:
All those things could be applied to running as well...

If it's not local, you have to travel.
You could be managing your diet...and being grumpy.

There are many local tri races (at least around me) that can register morning of. Are reasonably cheap and fun. Yes, even half irons.

But I do understand what you're saying. A local 5k is of course going to be easier logistically than traveling to an Ironman. As well as training for one.

Wow that’s great
I don’t know if races like that near me

But I do travel a lot

Where do you live?
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Re: Aging of the IM field [MrTri123] [ In reply to ]
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Pacific Northwest
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Re: Aging of the IM field [TIT] [ In reply to ]
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TIT wrote:
Geek_fit wrote:
I'm not sure I understand your question


I guess the point is that the time commitment is much more than just race day. If it is not a local race you are having your family travel days before, attend checkin, bike drop, etc all in the day/s before the actual race. You are doing this while trying to maintain a strict diet. You are probably completely distracted, maybe grumpy, maybe on an emotional rollercoaster.

  1. Why would an age grouper bother being on a strict diet....read from Greg Lemond's old book about cycling. Rule number one to being a good athlete is to be able to eat anything for loading up before an event and eat anything for recovering after event. Greg said something like this, "I have to eat in 23 different hotels in 23 days and race on 21 days and perform. I have to perform with what I get, or I lose the Tour de France"....how simple is that? All you age groupers need to take a page out of that
  2. Why are you distracted. Just focus on what is in front of you. If its your family, its your family...then ignore your bike. If it is your bike cause you're putting on new rubber, ignore your family. Its reasonably simple if you set the expectations. If you can't do it, then don't bring your family. They will be thankful to not come
  3. No reason to be grumpy. We're doing this for recreation and entertainment. No one cares about your results. Not even your family. Only you. No one is looking at the nth decimal place beside our names. Our families will throw away all those finisher medals in the trash the day after we die. No one has any use for our times nor medals....don't be grumpy!

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Re: Aging of the IM field [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
TIT wrote:
Geek_fit wrote:
I'm not sure I understand your question


I guess the point is that the time commitment is much more than just race day. If it is not a local race you are having your family travel days before, attend checkin, bike drop, etc all in the day/s before the actual race. You are doing this while trying to maintain a strict diet. You are probably completely distracted, maybe grumpy, maybe on an emotional rollercoaster.

  1. Why would an age grouper bother being on a strict diet....read from Greg Lemond's old book about cycling. Rule number one to being a good athlete is to be able to eat anything for loading up before an event and eat anything for recovering after event. Greg said something like this, "I have to eat in 23 different hotels in 23 days and race on 21 days and perform. I have to perform with what I get, or I lose the Tour de France"....how simple is that? All you age groupers need to take a page out of that
  2. Why are you distracted. Just focus on what is in front of you. If its your family, its your family...then ignore your bike. If it is your bike cause you're putting on new rubber, ignore your family. Its reasonably simple if you set the expectations. If you can't do it, then don't bring your family. They will be thankful to not come
  3. No reason to be grumpy. We're doing this for recreation and entertainment. No one cares about your results. Not even your family. Only you. No one is looking at the nth decimal place beside our names. Our families will throw away all those finisher medals in the trash the day after we die. No one has any use for our times nor medals....don't be grumpy!

Well it is easy to sit there and write something that makes it all sound so simple but the reality is that many athletes struggle with their emotions before and after a big event.

Leading up to my first 70.3 I was extremely distracted because the athletes guide made everything sound so precise. All of my previous oly/sprint races were just about showing up and checking in on the day. Then of course it was running over nutrition, pacing etc in my mind, doubting myself. I have my second 70.3 coming up in 2 months and I know I will be a lot less nervous and distracted.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
TIT wrote:
Geek_fit wrote:
I'm not sure I understand your question


I guess the point is that the time commitment is much more than just race day. If it is not a local race you are having your family travel days before, attend checkin, bike drop, etc all in the day/s before the actual race. You are doing this while trying to maintain a strict diet. You are probably completely distracted, maybe grumpy, maybe on an emotional rollercoaster.


  1. Why would an age grouper bother being on a strict diet....read from Greg Lemond's old book about cycling. Rule number one to being a good athlete is to be able to eat anything for loading up before an event and eat anything for recovering after event. Greg said something like this, "I have to eat in 23 different hotels in 23 days and race on 21 days and perform. I have to perform with what I get, or I lose the Tour de France"....how simple is that? All you age groupers need to take a page out of that
  2. Why are you distracted. Just focus on what is in front of you. If its your family, its your family...then ignore your bike. If it is your bike cause you're putting on new rubber, ignore your family. Its reasonably simple if you set the expectations. If you can't do it, then don't bring your family. They will be thankful to not come
  3. No reason to be grumpy. We're doing this for recreation and entertainment. No one cares about your results. Not even your family. Only you. No one is looking at the nth decimal place beside our names. Our families will throw away all those finisher medals in the trash the day after we die. No one has any use for our times nor medals....don't be grumpy!
.
So much of that "old school mentality" is lost on triathletes today Dev.Instead of just going out and enjoying smashing each other in training while riding up random mountain roads and laughing about it in the pub later,people are now training in their electronic bubble and then posting the numbers on social media.
.
For me it is a shame to see that people are more interested in staring at the numbers on their Garmins than the scenery passing by around them on training rides and runs.I started to notice the change in attitude in around 2003 and it has just magnified since then.
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Re: Aging of the IM field [ThailandUltras] [ In reply to ]
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Sure that’s true to some extend. But I know plenty of triathletes who are more old school than not. Of course they also tend to crossover into gravel biking as well
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