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Advice/Report on IMmoo wanted...
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Hello everyone, it's my first time on this board so bear with me. I am signed up for IM Wisconsin this year and am looking for any feedback and suggestions on the event, and my status as a fairly new triathlete. This will be my second attempt at the Iron-distance, my first resulted in a DNF at the Ultramax in the Ozarks. I dropped out of the race at the 13 mile mark of the run after fighting cramps since mile 15 of the bike. Needless to say it was a long day and I ended up in the medical tent.

A little about myself I am 27 years old 6'0 170 lbs. and have been doing triathlons for 2 years. I consider the run (3:05--26.2) to be my best event and I used to believe that my running would carry over to make me a below average to decent biker but after my DNF I know that I am not anywhere near where I need to be in order to do ironman's. My bike split for U-MAX was 8:10 (not a typo). I was shooting for 6:30ish, I did spend over an hour off my bike trying to work with my cramps and trying to get food down. I was able to get food down until mile 50 of the bike. As far as the swim goes I could not make it across the pool two years ago and I swam a 1:07 at the U-MAX. I was very pleased with that time.

Questions:

*Should I put my swim and run on maintain mode and totally focus on my bike?

*Weights??? I feel that I need to hit them hard for the hilly bike course.

*Cramping:how to avoid?

*IMOO bike course: is it hills,hills,hills...how to prepare myself.



I would appreciate any feedback. By the way I am located in Kansas and my goal is 13 hours. I would also appreciate a course/event report.
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Re: Advice/Report on IMmoo wanted... [KS TRIHAWK] [ In reply to ]
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You do realize that with those four questions, you have set up a HUGE variety of answers, right? That is one of the best parts of this forum...you'll get your answer, b/c of the wide variety of imput from many people.

I'm going to make this easy- Get an online coach NOW! There are many of them, with some of the examples being Multisport.com, Troy Jacobson, and CTS. This will help take the guesswork out of your day-to-day volume. With your track record, your goal should be one thing- to finish.

Next, get nutritional help. I wouldn't go to anyone other than someone who has IM experience. With all of your talk on cramping, my guess would be to look at hydration and electrolytes. You can get half way there by seeking an RD, but experienced advice on nutrition will get the rest of the way there by an IM athlete.

Strength training- An absolute MUST. Find a facility with an ACSM or CSCS strength trainer, and have them teach you how to do a total body strength and conditioning program. Heavy on the squats/leg press/compound movements, BECAUSE.....

...my guess by your screen name, you live in Kansas, which I remember for the year I was out there, was flatter than the Blackwater Eagleman, which will not do well for the rollers in IMWis. To prep for the hills, I would find an overpass, and do hill repeats on the overpass. You need a stronger bike- strength training is only a supplement, and you need to be specific.

Hope this helped a little- Enjoy the race, it really is great!

Rob

http://www.reathcon.com
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Re: Advice/Report on IMmoo wanted... [KS TRIHAWK] [ In reply to ]
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i would advise you to jump over to www.cruciblefitness.com and bump around there for a spell. rich has a very detailed description of the run and bike course and some way fine strategies for attacking them. also tons of more general stuff ( for free. . . . .) on pacing, nutrition, approach/decision making, etc etc for that very race. he is also going to be on the course for a weekend in july ( for very cheap....) with a group he is training for the event and that would absolutely rock for you.

not that i know anything, but strictly from a "buddies perspective" i would say this in answer to your questions, just to further muddy the waters:

definately bike more. my bud andrewmc on the forum here is a good runner also, and he is always saying the IM is about the bike for runners. pursue that wholeheartedly. you kick butt running and swimming already - it is not like you are going to forget how and what are you relly going to gain?

do the weights on the bike in a big ole gear. many will say otherwise but personally i think way too many tri-heads spend way too much standing around in the weightroom when they could be riding.

cramps can caused by a host of things. hope you get this sorted on the road, or by reading tons of tri stuff.

the course - again check crucible. it is a fabulous bike ride by any definition a real "riders course" it rewards smart riding more than anything, i think.
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Re: Advice/Report on IMmoo wanted... [Rob] [ In reply to ]
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I am planning on getting a local coach in May-August and I am sure that he will clear a lot of these questions up for me but I don't want to be a mess by the time I get to him. I keep hearing from everybody you need to be working on your base (base,base,base...!!). I don't think I have a clear idea of what my base is. (I understand the concept.) I am currently hitting the trainer 4 times a week 90-120 min. sessions...while I pay attention to my HR I do not live by it and usually judge each workout by how I am feeling that day. My question is am I hurting myself in the longrun by going too hard now..(I don't "feel" like I am going to hard)..and should I slow it down and go longer?
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Re: Advice/Report on IMmoo wanted... [KS TRIHAWK] [ In reply to ]
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Agree with some of the above. Check out http://www.triathlonacademy.com and get in touch with Troy Jacobson or one of his coaches. They can help you with your volume, weights, as well as helping you set up a nutrition plan. This is the important part, having a plan and sticking to it as much as possible. You have to be flexible, because things will happen, but try to stick to it as much as you can. Ride your bike more, this will set you up for a better run. Like I said, call or email Troy or one of his coaches. They give you alot of service for not alot of money.

Here was the race report I worte after getting back from Wisconsin this year:

Entry into an Ironman North America event: $375...
plane fair for you and someone to carry your beat ass home: $342...
oversized luggage surcharge for bike: $80 one way...
cab fair to and from airport: $45...
5-night hotel stay in cow-land: $381...
car-rental to get back and forth to the race site: $108...
money for food during the stay (conservative): $200...

...crushing (mostly) the competition in your first pro race, first marathon,
first IRONMAN...priceless!!

Well, I'm home. It was an interesting experience. I may as well have stood
Monona Lake with an armful of 50 dollar bills, throwing them into it one
at a time, while someone hit me in the legs repeatedly with a sledge hammer.
That would have accomplished the same expense and feeling in my legs as I
write this.

I don't know which was the more overshadowing effect, this being my first
"official" race as a pro, or it being my first Ironman. I wanted to place
well, but I also wanted to not die. That is always the first objective.
Not dying.

I got to Wisconsin Thursday to find that the free shuttle to take me to my
hotel did not exist, so I hailed a cab, go in and unpacked, and decided to
ride over to the race site in the morning for the swim practice and
registration.

Friday morning I got my stuff together and rode my bike to swim practice
at the lake. The organization that went into every aspect of this race was
mind-boggling. They had you get a number on your hand at the swim, then
gave you a bag with the same number to put your stuff in. While you swam,
they watched it all lined up in rows. When you were done, they checked your
number and gave you your stuff back, along with free Gatorade and water
bottles.

Registration was very well run. We had several station to go to, all in
order. First, show your USAT card. Next, fill out the medical
questionnaire. Then get weighed in (more important for Clydesdales). Pick
up your packet. Get your athlete wristband, which entitled you to be in
the transition area and get free food at the banquet. Get your timing chip.
Luckily, I only had to walk up to the pro table, and everything was taken
care of for me.

Saturday morning, again swim practice, short spin on the bike, short run
to loosen up, then rest. Lots of rest. The pro pre-race meeting was were they
told us all of the things that we were allowed to do that the age-groupers
could not. Wendy Ingrahm is pretty hot. Chris legh is a pretty boy. His
girlfriend is mad hot, though, so I give him props.

The venue for the race was outstanding. It was held in a hotel (yes, all
three events, smart ass), with one of the conference rooms serving as the
changing rooms. The rooftop of the parking garage was the bike transition
area, and it was something to behold, with two thousand bikes lined up, nary
a hybrid among them. We had to run from the swim, up that spiral ramp to
the top floor, into the changing area to get our transition bags, change,
run out to the bike racks to get our bikes, then down the spiral ramp on
the other side out onto the bike course.

Since I was still on Eastern time and everybody there was on Central time,
getting up at 4am for the race wasn't that bad. I warmed up as usual,
treating this just like any other race. I was pretty nervous, naturally,
and was happy to find out that wetsuits would be allowed for the pros (which
they had already kind of told us they would be). I got into my suit, headed
down to the swim start, entered the water, and started to warm up. I think
I was the only one swimming. Everyone else was just floating along talking.
When the cannon went off, the rest of the pros took off, and I dog paddled
behind. Some elementary backstroke in there as well :)

I exited the water right at 1 hour, which is what I was really hoping for,
so that alone made my day. To bad there was still 138.2 miles to race.
My transitions were some of the fastest among the pros, which I was also happy
with. Within the first mile on the bike, I lost my gel flask going over
a bump. There goes half of my race nutrition right there. I tried to make
it up at the aid stations, but it was no use. The bike course was the hardest
I have ever been on. It was soooooo windy, especially on the second lap.
I'm not just saying that either, the wind picked up considerably as the day
wore on. At the start of the second lap was the special needs area, like
a feed zone in the tour. I was supposed to be able to just call out my number
and someone would hand me my bag, but being as how I was one of the first
people to go through it, they didn't quite have their act together yet.
I had to stop my bike, and get my bag myself. Lost about 2:30 doing that.


As I made my way around the loop again, got to a big climb and dropped my
chain. Yes, Tommy the bike mechanic dropped his chain. All I could think
of was my boss asking me "do you know how to fix bikes?" Lost another two
minutes dicking with that. Got back on, kept my attitude positive, though,
and finished the loop very strong. Bike time of 5:12. Not quite what I
had hoped for, but it was still one of the fastest of the day, 12th I think,
among some pretty big names. The Aegis was awesome...sooo comfortable over
112 very rough miles.

I was riding along with some one for most of the second lap, just trying
to keep pace. He had caught me from the swim. I would catch him and pass on
the climbs (power to weight ratio :)), only to get bitched when the course
went flat to downhill. I just can't push the big gears some of these guys
who outweigh me by 30lbs can. Finally, at mile 105-110, I let him noodle
away, hoping to pass him on the run.

Off my bike, and WOW! My legs haven't felt that bad since my first
triathlon. My first two steps felt like I was going to fall onto my face.
I got my run stuff, after someone took my bike for me, and headed out to
the marathon. Some guy came into transition with me, and started the run with
me. Same story, lost him on the hills, only to have him go back on the
downhills. About mile 8. after the second large climb on the run course,
I surged up the hill enough so that when he was staying with me, the pace was
hurting him and not me. At the bottom of the hill, there was a turnaround.
I surged hard at the turnaround, and never saw him again. The rest of the
first lap, I felt awesome. I was picking people off, one at a time. I was
in 25th place. In my first ever Ironman.

By the start of the second lap, the fact that I had lost half of my nutrition had begun to take its effect.
I felt weird, to say the least. Dave had told me before the race that even
if my stomach had shut down, that I would still be able to finish the race
just based on the amount of training I had put in. He was right. I was
on auto-pilot the whole second lap. I knew if I stopped to walk, I wouldn't
be able to start running again. If I put my head down, I would have fallen
over. If I looked up, I would have fainted. I was weaving all over the
place, but still running, still keeping a good pace, and still passing
people. I kept it up to the line, and literally fell over it and blacked
out.

I woke up in the medical tent later after two bags of IV fluid. To
my right, a guy was sitting next to me, the same one I had let pass me on the
bike. I had passed him on the run, and he was talking to me. He said he
was surprised That I was able to stay with him and hurt him on the hills.
Really nice guy from Boulder. I sat with him and his girlfriend at the
awards banquet. His name was Mike Larsen. He rides for Prime Alliance.

So I won the collegiate division by a lot. Collegiate National Champion. I wasn't able to accept the Hawaii slot that goes along with that because of being a pro. Oh well. 14th out of 22 pros. Not bad.

All in all, the experience was amazing, and one I will remember for a
lifetime. Thanks to everyone who helped me along the way. Thanks for
following me online. Thanks for the calls and the emails after the race.
Now I'm going to get to a lot of resting and other activities. Hit me up
for Mt. bike rides, etc.

later,

tommy
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Re: Advice/Report on IMmoo wanted... [KS TRIHAWK] [ In reply to ]
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I was resting at the top of one of the many hills at UltraMax and a police car pulled up , he started talking and said his temp gauage said it was 95 outside. It had been 70 the week end before and 70 the week end after.
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Re: Advice/Report on IMmoo wanted... [Tommy Nelson] [ In reply to ]
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Tommy GREAT!!!! report. You motivate me!!!!!!!!
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Being a fast runner is fine and dandy but has [ In reply to ]
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nothing at all to do with being a fast IM unless you meet the criteria below:

1 You can bike better than you can run

2 Speed is your limiter and not endurance i.e. if you had better foot speed your marathon PR would be 2.45 not 3.05, you have the endurance to run a 2.45 just not the foot speed, this is so hard to explain unless there is such a huge disparity between your standalone times and your IM run times.

3 Did I mention being stronger on the bike than the run?

I had similar delusions of grandeur about my running last year, I'm not really fast but I do ok 1.25-ish half.

I was toast at Moooo for a couple of reasons, one my "speed" and I use that term loosely did not move over to the IM and my bike sucked.

I was in a similar spot to you when I decided to start training for CDA. What I am doing is lots of biking, lots of hills. Up until this week I was riding at least 4 times a week, I was a little ill last week and went skiing this past weekend but I am going to try and maintain a pretty large volume of biking.

I am swimming three times a week, twice for an hour 15 and once for a hour 30.

Running three times a week, mostly trail running, 2 are mostly pretty slow and pretty hilly the third is more of a tempo.

I am going to continue this until about 8 weeks out and then start to incorporate speed work.

It was not a lack of speed that kicked my ass in Moooo it was a lack of enough strength to be able to capitalize on it.

Maybe this will work a little better this year, if not it has take most of the people I know more than 2 IM's to figure out this game.

I think that unless you are competing in your AG that for the most part your "focus" should be your weakest event, in my case it was my bike 7.05 and my bike could have been a lot faster but I was scared of blowing up on the run as I did at Utah, need'nt have worried about that given my 5 hour marathon.

If you are biking 8 hours is there really any point in putting your focus on going to the track to take 3 seconds a mile off of your IM run pace of 9 minutes? thats just a hypothetical. You see what I am saying?
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Re: Advice/Report on IMmoo wanted... [Rob] [ In reply to ]
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I disagree. Do not worry about "hittin' the big weights". This will not likely help you much. Get stronger by running hills and biking hills, do lotsa them.

andrew



In Reply To:
You do realize that with those four questions, you have set up a HUGE variety of answers, right? That is one of the best parts of this forum...you'll get your answer, b/c of the wide variety of imput from many people.

I'm going to make this easy- Get an online coach NOW! There are many of them, with some of the examples being Multisport.com, Troy Jacobson, and CTS. This will help take the guesswork out of your day-to-day volume. With your track record, your goal should be one thing- to finish.

Next, get nutritional help. I wouldn't go to anyone other than someone who has IM experience. With all of your talk on cramping, my guess would be to look at hydration and electrolytes. You can get half way there by seeking an RD, but experienced advice on nutrition will get the rest of the way there by an IM athlete.

Strength training- An absolute MUST. Find a facility with an ACSM or CSCS strength trainer, and have them teach you how to do a total body strength and conditioning program. Heavy on the squats/leg press/compound movements, BECAUSE.....

...my guess by your screen name, you live in Kansas, which I remember for the year I was out there, was flatter than the Blackwater Eagleman, which will not do well for the rollers in IMWis. To prep for the hills, I would find an overpass, and do hill repeats on the overpass. You need a stronger bike- strength training is only a supplement, and you need to be specific.

Hope this helped a little- Enjoy the race, it really is great!

Rob
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Re: Being a fast runner is fine and dandy but has [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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You speak the truth...I actually remember thinking to myself prior to my first IM that all I had to do was make it to the run and I would be fine. In hindsight I know that it doesn't matter if you are the best runner in the world if you are running on cement legs. I trained much more for the run then the bike just because I like to run more then I like to bike. Hopefully that will change when I start to see some improvement, I have already seen quite a bit over this winter. I guess I really didn't comprehend how bad it could get...but I sure do now. In summary, I am sure most of the advice I will get is to totally focus on the bike for it is obvious to me now that is what I need to do. As far as the weights go I will probably continue to lift until the weather gets nice and I can hit the hills. Thanks for your insight!
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Re: Advice/Report on IMmoo wanted... [denewone] [ In reply to ]
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I don't have much experience to base my opinion on but I don't know how much tougher it could have been. It was over 90 degrees and I thought that the bike course was very tough (weak rider). That 20 mile stretch of repaved road (gravel if you ask me) killed me. Other than that I was very impressed with the race. I am planning on doing the 1/2 Ultramax in ST. Louis in June. What was your experience like?
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Re: Advice/Report on IMmoo wanted... [KS TRIHAWK] [ In reply to ]
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Had a bad day . I heard that out of 500 there were 200 finishers. One of the best marathoners around was doing the run for a team and he almost dropped.
Doing 1/2 gulf coast, 1/4 ultraMax, Ironman Florida
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