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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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h2ofun wrote:
BCtriguy1 wrote:
bluefever wrote:
Also agree. It's getting to the point where doing the bike on a trainer is the only way to make people happy.

It's a race, you race the course, you race others to enable you to make the most of your best attributes.

It's also a triathlon, Kienles problem is his slow swim, not bike packs at 12m distance.


Triathlon's problem is the sport doesn't favour strong cyclists. I'd love to see a 20m draft zone for the pro race. If you're not willing to work on the bike, that's fine, it should show on your bike split time. It's boring as hell watching this train of uber runners sit in on the bike.

I'd like to see the modest bikers/uber runner rolling the dice either by sitting in a 20m draft train and watching guys like SK ride away, hoping they can catch them, OR by working hard to close the gaps on the bike, and maybe hampering their otherwise stellar runs. I think that would be a far more entertaining race to watch. The way it is now, there's really no point in watching once the bike groups have developed.


One of many reasons I say make drafting legal. The only folks who really push what you offer are folks who cannot swim, or run, so they really are not complete triathletes like Gomez is. Our sport is not uber bikers, it is triathlon. So with drafting legal, it forces folks to have to learn to swim. Still have a great bike, and then have to have a great run. The ITU guys, and gals, are the complete triathlete, which is all that maters. I sure do not care about a single leg of our sport.

I think the main reason you push drafting is that you're a really good runner and a self admitted poor swimmer and biker.

As your stated, our sport is Triathlon, which is theoretically, in long course, an individual time trial across all three elements, with some legal drafting happening during the swim.
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
Adman wrote:
On a side note I have just seen SK's take on the race on facebook. Classy guy as always. Just needs to get faster on the swim.


Class guy for sure, but at this point, I doubt Kienle can get faster on the swim. After this many years racing pro, he has likely maximized his swim improvements. The guys who are faster all grew up swimming. Kienle has basically picked all the fruit off the tree that an adult onset swimmer can. Low hanging fruit, middle or tree, almost top of the tree is all picked over. This swim with a decent upsteam with fresh water with no wetsuit is the worst combo an adult onset swimmer can face. That's racing. Last year, wetsuit in salt water is best case for adult onset swimmer. Kona no wetsuit, but salt water and no real upstream current (although you can end up on a treadmill if the tide is pulling out) is in the middle. Lionel made the right strategic move saving it for Kona, but maybe if Lionel was here, and if he could close to Kienle, the two benefit off each other. Not sure Lionel would have closed to Kienle as he'd have a slightly tougher time in the current.

In any case it's racing. This type of swim will hurt an adult onset swimmer. Everyone knew that going in. I would have loved to see what Ben Kanute and Josh Amberger could have done together on the swim-bike. If Ben had company, it may have also been interesting. Ben did an entire day of racing pushing his own wind. Big kudos to that guy.

I don't think there's much scope for improvement either unfortunately. He is limited in that sense.

Kona will be interesting in the sense that SK and LS could do some damage but you're still going up against a massive train up front.

BK is a guy who has really impressed me in ITU over the last 2 years and is doing the same at 70.3. He may have now found his niche. Still young which is very encouraging. Most hit non drafting racing when they realise they aren't good enough for ITU or are past their prime. BK is not in either category.
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [test] [ In reply to ]
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test wrote:
What happened to Jenson Button? Splits looked solid then nothing after the second run split? Lost his chip or DNF?
Looks like he did the first loop along the river and called it a day. Went from 6:30 pace to 8:00 pace in the first 3 miles.

Sylvan Smyth | http://www.sportstats.asia | sylvan@sportstats.asia | Starvas
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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What are the Age Group awards quantity? 3 or 5.

I wonder what folks think about racing Moats at the race.

Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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Will they do a highlight package of this race and make it available on youtube?
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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h2ofun wrote:
What are the Age Group awards quantity? 3 or 5.
I wonder what folks think about racing Moats at the race.

i wanna say 5 but could be 10 being a WC.

M30-34 ran almost as fast as Gomez, beat Ryan Giuliano. Crazy fast and not much race history, future pro?

808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [hadukla] [ In reply to ]
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hadukla wrote:
h2ofun wrote:
What are the Age Group awards quantity? 3 or 5.
I wonder what folks think about racing Moats at the race.


i wanna say 5 but could be 10 being a WC.

M30-34 ran almost as fast as Gomez, beat Ryan Giuliano. Crazy fast and not much race history, future pro?

There were 2 guys in the 60-64 that finished with the exact same time. So, do both get 5th?

Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [hadukla] [ In reply to ]
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hadukla wrote:
h2ofun wrote:
What are the Age Group awards quantity? 3 or 5.
I wonder what folks think about racing Moats at the race.


i wanna say 5 but could be 10 being a WC.

M30-34 ran almost as fast as Gomez, beat Ryan Giuliano. Crazy fast and not much race history, future pro?

Nm, answered my own question. This guy is a former running star and convicted felon :)

808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [hadukla] [ In reply to ]
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What were the charges?
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [Fishbum] [ In reply to ]
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Fishbum wrote:
What were the charges?


sorry, meant to paste. embezzlement. stole goods from a running store and sold them online

http://www.newsadvance.com/news/local/marathoner-sentenced-in-embezzlement-from-lynchburg-running-store/article_81ab9f3f-9a0f-558d-9ace-0cc4edffb679.html

808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [kjmcawesome] [ In reply to ]
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Do they end up putting the full length videos from the live coverage online?
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [tri312] [ In reply to ]
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tri312 wrote:
Do they end up putting the full length videos from the live coverage online?


Yes.


http://www.ironman.com/...ship70.3m&y=2017
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [hadukla] [ In reply to ]
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hadukla wrote:
hadukla wrote:
h2ofun wrote:
What are the Age Group awards quantity? 3 or 5.
I wonder what folks think about racing Moats at the race.


i wanna say 5 but could be 10 being a WC.

M30-34 ran almost as fast as Gomez, beat Ryan Giuliano. Crazy fast and not much race history, future pro?

Nm, answered my own question. This guy is a former running star and convicted felon :)

So he's probably good at running, right?
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [davejustdave] [ In reply to ]
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I can't locate the Age group results. How am missing these.
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I don't think Kienle is an AOS as I've read that he's been racing triathlons since age 12. This only makes it more unlikely that he would be able to drop 240 sec/19 = 12.6 sec per 100 m off his 1900 m swim given his 21-22 years of swimming. *Ass-u-ming* he has worked equally hard on all three disciplines, it would *appear* that perhaps he simply has less innate swim talent than bike and run talent. Very few people have equal talent in all three.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
Last edited by: ericmulk: Sep 10, 17 19:37
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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Standout performance for me was Kanute. We all knew about Gomez, Kienle, Don etc. and they all did what we expect of them.

Just a few months ago at St George BK lost 5 mins on the bike to Kienle and now he's riding at the same level plus he's the best swimmer in the field and he's only what -24?! This guy could be the next Craig Walton but better. He still has time for a lot more bike improvement, next season he could combine Potts swimming ability with Stadler bike speed, then Gomez will really have to run fast!
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [Trirunner] [ In reply to ]
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Trirunner wrote:
"Based on that podium, I think the myth of ITU not translating to long course is thoroughly busted. "

Alternatively, couldn't it be said that the ITU guys are changing the definition of long course? They complete a half Ironman at such speeds that it only leaves the full distance as long course?

I think this is the biggest takeaway from this 70.3 season, and yesterday's race highlighted it.
At the very top, 70.3 is no longer raced as long course, it is basically a non-draft Olympic. The top dudes are racing pretty much all-out from the gun, there is not much pacing going on.
Hence, at the WC level you pretty much cannot have a weakness or you won't win.
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [Dan The Man] [ In reply to ]
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Don't forget though that Javi is somewhat new to focusing on 70.3 (assuming he continues to going forward) and is able to swim with Kanute. I assume his bike will improve as well. 70.3's future looks potentially exciting!

"It's good enough for who it's for" - Grandpa Wayne
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [kjmcawesome] [ In reply to ]
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kjmcawesome wrote:
Gomez.

What do I win?

Just bummed that Sanders (smartly) didn't race and get exposed. He might have even cracked the top 10!

It ALMOST seems like you need to be able to swim and run in this sport to win a world championship...

/kj

http://kjmcawesome.tumblr.com/
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [kjmcawesome] [ In reply to ]
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Really all you need to be is the best runner. That's what this race showed.

I had a feeling guys like Gomez/Don/Appleton just got through the climb then eased off waiting for Sebi to come by and tow them to T2. So I put this together and it confirms my suspicions. Especially Gomez, lol. More power to him to know he could run Ben down.

Ben was the big winner from this strategy as it allowed him to build such a big lead on the bike only Gomez could run him down. I'm guessing if these guys were willing to put their noses into the wind at all that Ben would not have gotten on the podium.

Looks like Sebi really did get pissed and stopped pulling everyone. He was putting time into Ben until he caught the group.

But Ben putting that much time into even Sebi on the climb is quite impressive. I'm guessing he's a smaller dude than Sebi?


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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [Sean H] [ In reply to ]
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I didn't see how it played out. Did Gomez get dropped on the climb and look like he was chilling and waiting for a pack to catch him?

Seems like he didn't see Kanute as a threat and let him get away and played it to beat Keinle.

Would love to see Gomez vs Kienle's power profile for the ride. But if you can get out of the water first and run 1:10, it gives you a LOT more options of how you want to play the bike leg.

/kj

http://kjmcawesome.tumblr.com/
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [Sean H] [ In reply to ]
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Sebi's plan was to go hard on the climb if the gap was small, and more mellow on the climb when the gap after the swim was big. He then wanted to power on the top.


Sean H wrote:

But Ben putting that much time into even Sebi on the climb is quite impressive. I'm guessing he's a smaller dude than Sebi?

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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [kjmcawesome] [ In reply to ]
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I'm not sure if Kanute had a faster transition or just dropped Gomez right away but Gomez was 20 sec back at 5 miles before the climb.

And funny you mention Sanders. If he had been in this race I don't think the "bike pack" would have waited for him to tow them to T2 like they did with Sebi, as I'm not sure many of them except for Gomez think they could beat him in a foot race.
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [Sean H] [ In reply to ]
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Sean H wrote:
I'm not sure if Kanute had a faster transition or just dropped Gomez right away but Gomez was 20 sec back at 5 miles before the climb.

And funny you mention Sanders. If he had been in this race I don't think the "bike pack" would have waited for him to tow them to T2 like they did with Sebi, as I'm not sure many of them except for Gomez think they could beat him in a foot race.

100% agree. Anyone in that pack was thinking 2nd or 3rd was possible if Keinle burned too many matches and Kanue came back to the field. One of those things happens.

/kj

http://kjmcawesome.tumblr.com/
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Re: 70.3 worlds men's race thread [kjmcawesome] [ In reply to ]
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kjmcawesome wrote:
I didn't see how it played out. Did Gomez get dropped on the climb and look like he was chilling and waiting for a pack to catch him?


Ben "dropped" Javier right from T1. He just sit on the bike and put the hammer down while Javier started the bike way easier.
Last edited by: vittorio: Sep 11, 17 10:35
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