the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough.

Jun 3, 08 17:36

Post #1 of 29 (14443 views)

Dear Womens,

I eat really healthy: whole foods, all the good fats (nuts! avocados! eggs!), etc., and eat ALL THE TIME, but I am still hungry ALL THE TIME. I eat so much that my coworkers have just come to accept that when I'm not seeing patients, I'm eating. it's like I eat every spare minute I have at work. I also train a ton like most of you.

I saw the thread on calorie trackers and have always had the sneaking suspicion that I'm not eating enough despite the fact that I'm eating ALL THE TIME. Like, am I one of those girls who trains so much she just has trouble eating enough? and then my body thinks its starving itself so now it won't lose weight?

so I went on thedailyplate.com. it says I need to eat 3,370 calories a day to maintain my weight. Like all triathletes I am trying to get down to "race weight" though, whatever that is, and am kind of stuck. so it says eat 2,870 calories a day and I will lose 1 lb per week. then I plug in what I do on a typical Tuesday, which is a bike commute to and from work (45 miles RT), with a mini brick run at home. Now it says I need to eat 5,473 calories today and I will still lose 1 lb a week.

then I plug in what I ate today, so far. which was a mere 2,089 calories. (and probably someone else's recommended daily intake!) at the top of the screen, it declares, "You may eat about 3,384 additional calories today."

HOLY SHIT. no wonder I'm frickin' starving all the time.

anybody else experience this? can I just help myself to some ice cream every night to meet my caloric requirements? there are so many threads out there on how to cut calories, but no one ever really talks about how maybe, just maybe, we aren't eating enough...

Jocelyn

p.s. still hungry.

...........................................................................
:: I came, I saw, I conquered. then I ran out of money, crashed into a car during an Ironman, and now work a bad-ass job making prosthetic legs for wounded warriors. ::

the blog: My So-Called Civilian Life :: theWongstar.com :: follow me @theWongstar

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [iwjocelyn] [ In reply to ]

Jun 3, 08 17:46

Post #2 of 29 (14438 views)

Many pros eat volumes like that but I'm suprised you are getting those numbers back from a calculator. This is how I handle my caloric intake:

My RMR is 1300, I got it through testing but it is within 50 calories of predicted. I multiply that by 1.2 to account for daily activity. That brings me up to 1550ish. From there I calculate how many calories I've burned during training for the day, subract 500 for dropping weight and that gives me my number.

Generally this means that if I exercise for a solid hour each day I stay at 1550. Anything above that hour is bonus calories for the day.

If you are always hungry look at your protein intake. I had the same issue, was taking in way too many calories, and upped my protein to 100+ grams a day and it has really helped.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jen

"In order to keep a true perspective on one's importance, everyone should have a dog that worships him and a cat that will ignore him." - Dereke Bruce

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [jenhs] [ In reply to ]

Jun 3, 08 17:54

Post #3 of 29 (14430 views)

Psst... hey... she is a pro :)

Are you really only taking in 1550 calories/day on 1 hour exercise days? I think you're smaller than me anyways, but that's not much for a body that's training for Ironman - maybe not enough calories has something to do with the recent blahs?

______________________________________
I know I'm promiscuous, but in a classy way

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [cuds] [ In reply to ]

Jun 3, 08 18:00

Post #4 of 29 (14423 views)

Oh....I don't know people by name yet. *embarassed*

I thought that was an awful lot of training for an AGer.

I'm feeling much better now. When I train I feel great, its just been hard to get out the door.

Now, back to the OP.

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jen

"In order to keep a true perspective on one's importance, everyone should have a dog that worships him and a cat that will ignore him." - Dereke Bruce

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [jenhs] [ In reply to ]

Jun 3, 08 19:04

Post #5 of 29 (14380 views)

"If you are always hungry look at your protein intake. I had the same issue, was taking in way too many calories, and upped my protein to 100+ grams a day and it has really helped."

Fiber takes longer to digest and typically keeps you feeling full longer than most foods. I should mention that a high fiber diet may cause...um...gas issues :-)

I'm not an expert and you should probably talk with one. I am just a guy who was vegan for nine years and had to figure out ways to stay healthy.

"your horse is too high" - tigerchik

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [Hid] [ In reply to ]

Jun 4, 08 9:19

Post #6 of 29 (14248 views)

I found a great resource in the book "Sports Nutrition for Endurance Athletes" it's pretty technical and can be boring, but it does have a lot of great resources on calories tailored to your activity level, and even some sample daily menu plans based on the amount of calories you need per day. For me, the sample "menus" were good to give me a "big picture" idea of what the day's eating would look like.

I also second the protein boost mentioned by a couple of other posters. I too am trying to eat all the whole foods and good healthy fats and all that. But once in a while, a warm chocolate chip cookie is very tasty and OK.

p.s. I like your website. :)

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [determination] [ In reply to ]

Jun 4, 08 10:51

Post #7 of 29 (14213 views)

hey! thanks for the input thus far womens. (and um, I suspect some of the "womens" are really dudes that like to peruse the womens forum, but since they are in here, they shall also be referred to as..."womens.")

for clarification's sake, I am a rather large one, 5'9" ish and 148 ish, and "extremely active" as a development athlete for teamTBB. so not quite pro yet, still working full time and training about 20hrs/week.

another friend suggested that the calorie calculations may be high because I tag myself as "extremely active" and also put in all my workouts for the day, where she says to do one or the other. like she calls herself "sendentary" and then puts in all her workouts. I also wonder if they are over-calculating how much I burn when cycling. I chose "Bicycling 14-15.9mph (vigorous)" yesterday, even though that speed for me is not vigorous. So should I instead choose "Bicycling 12-13.9mph (moderate)"? it is a difference of 544 cal/hr vs. 680 cal/hr.

I also perused some of my endurance nutrition books and found different numbers. like anywhere from 2450 cals for a day where I'm only swimming an hour, to 4720 cals for a day when I have a 4-hr brick. if anything I think I'll track myself for a week and just see if I'm eating enough, I think my problem is more on days where I am training more, I need to make a conscious effort to eat more.

...........................................................................
:: I came, I saw, I conquered. then I ran out of money, crashed into a car during an Ironman, and now work a bad-ass job making prosthetic legs for wounded warriors. ::

the blog: My So-Called Civilian Life :: theWongstar.com :: follow me @theWongstar

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [iwjocelyn] [ In reply to ]

Jun 4, 08 12:53

Post #8 of 29 (14145 views)

Regarding the Daily Plate, I sometimes think they overestimate the amount of calories you're burning during whatever activity. Like I always heard that a person who weighs 150 lbs (or maybe it was 130 lbs) he/she will burn 100 calories when running a mile. I weigh less than that but when I say I ran 60 minutes (at 10 min/mile) the Daily Plate will say I burned something like 700+ calories. I know calories vary by speed too, but I know I can't be burning 700+ calories when running 6 miles. A better calorie calculator I like to use is http://www.caloriesperhour.com/index_burn.php. So I calculate calories I consumed on the Daily Plate and then calculate how many calories I burned on the calories per hour site and try to do the math from there...

Hope that helps?

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [iwjocelyn] [ In reply to ]

Jun 4, 08 13:02

Post #9 of 29 (14135 views)

Hi Jocelyn,

I struggled with this a bit training for IMAZ. I found that getting good recovery foods really helped me. But yeah, some days you just get tired of chewing. During big training days I made sure I never went to bed hungry. My quick meal was fat free plain yogurt, tons of strawberries and kashi cereal. I would eat this 2-3 times a day (breakfast...usually with a banana and orange juice, recovery and snack). I don't usually drink orange juice (I'd rather just eat an orange), but sometimes if I knew I was going out on a bike ride first thing in the AM I would drink OJ just for extra calories.

I also ate a TON of avacados. Sometimes I'd just eat a whole avacado with salt and pepper. It filled me up and was a 'healthy' calorie dense food.

It's good to see that you are tracking calories to make sure you get enough. I have a few friends who have trained for IMs and tracked calories as a way to not eat too many. NONE of them have been successful at dropping weight. It seems like you are on the right track, eating healthy whole foods though, just keep eating them!

Good luck!

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [amy1816] [ In reply to ]

Jun 4, 08 17:42

Post #10 of 29 (14032 views)

hi Amy!

thanks, that *does* help. I was contemplating doing just what you do, keep them separate (calories consumed on Daily Plate, with a goal for the day based on calories burned), although I do like how it tells you about how many more calories you should/can still eat for the rest of the day. if anything I can check what caloriesperhour.com says and then pick an "activity level" on Daily Plate that matches it closest, i.e. vigorous vs. moderate. :)

...........................................................................
:: I came, I saw, I conquered. then I ran out of money, crashed into a car during an Ironman, and now work a bad-ass job making prosthetic legs for wounded warriors. ::

the blog: My So-Called Civilian Life :: theWongstar.com :: follow me @theWongstar

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [GhiaGirl] [ In reply to ]

Jun 4, 08 17:53

Post #11 of 29 (14027 views)

hi Ghia! thanks for your insight. I have a Trader Joe's cereal that I love and eat with flax seed and soy milk for breakfast every day, I think I may take your "quick meal" suggestion and feel free to eat it as a snack and recovery too, with fruit! I started eating whole avocados recently too, and yeah, not just in sandwiches or salads.

I think just being in our society with the majority eating *too much*, I've subconsciously gotten the mental block of "don't eat too much, don't eat too much." and I need to get over that and keep thinking "must eat more! must eat more!" One thing that really struck me when I was at Ironman China in April--this was the first time I met a lot of my pro teammates--is HOW MUCH THE PROS EAT. they don't just train volumes, they eat volumes. We stayed at a hotel with an awesome all-you-can-eat buffet, and basically had breakfast/brunch and many dinners there. They would just eat and eat and eat and eat. and they were all so fit.

ok now. I will happily eat more!

...........................................................................
:: I came, I saw, I conquered. then I ran out of money, crashed into a car during an Ironman, and now work a bad-ass job making prosthetic legs for wounded warriors. ::

the blog: My So-Called Civilian Life :: theWongstar.com :: follow me @theWongstar

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [GhiaGirl] [ In reply to ]

Jun 4, 08 18:01

Post #12 of 29 (14019 views)

In Reply To:

My quick meal was fat free plain yogurt, tons of strawberries and kashi cereal. I would eat this 2-3 times a day...

Two summers ago I did street promoing of Kashi (Go Lean & Go Lean Crunch). I'm sure you can imagine how much Kashi eating we did everyday. At the end of the summer we all filled our cars full of cases and cases of Kashi (Go Lean Crunch for me). It lasted me almost a year eating it 2-3 times per day (some days more!). I'm not sure when I read it (here or the blog?), but you mentioned Kashi recently previous to this post and it opened the flood gates for me. I went to Costco and bought a few of the huge boxes (for under $5!!!) and have become re-addicted. Thank you very much!! hehe

______________________________________
I know I'm promiscuous, but in a classy way

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [iwjocelyn] [ In reply to ]

Jun 5, 08 6:49

Post #13 of 29 (13962 views)

you don't need to worry about being anorexic. you are taking in over 2000 a day which is way above the level of anorexia, and you also don't seem to have the mental obsession aspect either. you probably aren't eating enough for your training though. be really careful with those calorie counter things. what they say you "need" is based on formulas, and many people's needs are way off from those. also, many people under inflate their caloric intake. aka they don't count dipping your finger in the icing etc, or think that their meal was 400 calories when it was 700. or they put in that they rode for an hour, but given the stops at lights etc, they didn't burn as many calories as say a hard hour on a trainer. start adding food slowly and see how you do, i wouldn't recommend to just start pounding ice cream without seeing a nutritionist or experimenting a bit fist.

"What am I on? I'm on my bike busting my ass for six hours a day. What are YOU on?" - Lance Armstrong

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [iwjocelyn] [ In reply to ]

Jun 5, 08 6:57

Post #14 of 29 (13959 views)

In Reply To:

I think just being in our society with the majority eating *too much*, I've subconsciously gotten the mental block of "don't eat too much, don't eat too much." and I need to get over that and keep thinking "must eat more! must eat more!"[/quote]
that kind of hit me in the way a lightning bolt would.
Thanks.

maybe she's born with it, maybe it's chlorine
If you're injured and need some sympathy, PM me and I'm very happy to write back.
disclaimer: PhD not MD

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [iwjocelyn] [ In reply to ]

Jun 5, 08 9:31

Post #15 of 29 (13913 views)

Wow, I thought about what you wrote and how I feel most days, so I went to thedailyplate, and apparently I'm undereating by almost 1000 calories per day as well. That's sick. Even when I used the low estimates, I think I'm exactly in the same boat as you.

My biggest problem with food is that I always feel guilty spending too much money at the grocery store. We already spend over $100 per week on food for 2 of us. Does anyone have any tips for how to buy on a budget, but still get quality, healthy and filling food. Or is that completely un-american? ;)

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [tigerchik] [ In reply to ]

Jun 5, 08 12:08

Post #16 of 29 (13863 views)

sweet! glad to be the lightning bolt :) it seems that almost everyone has some degree of eating issues (especially females, but can you blame us?) but as endurance athletes we really need to look at food as an energy source and not the enemy.

...........................................................................
:: I came, I saw, I conquered. then I ran out of money, crashed into a car during an Ironman, and now work a bad-ass job making prosthetic legs for wounded warriors. ::

the blog: My So-Called Civilian Life :: theWongstar.com :: follow me @theWongstar

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [iwjocelyn] [ In reply to ]

Jun 5, 08 12:33

Post #17 of 29 (13855 views)

I really like the food as a friend concept... I need to work on that :) I also need it to stop being my friend right before bed though. I'm currently working on eating more (healthy stuff is what I crave lately) during the day. Yay food :)

---
Miles of Life --- Powered by MarkyV

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [alaina1] [ In reply to ]

Jun 5, 08 14:43

Post #18 of 29 (13824 views)

Agree with poster that there is no way you are anorexic? cmon! that is actually a serious and deadly disease. You would be avoiding food not wondering if eating enough.

I am also looking for ways to cut food budget. It seems that the cheap stuff is the junk. And we are so cash poor right now and just two of us...we were spending that much also and had to cut out the Trader Joe's, though I think it is reasonable. (not to hijak thread I was repsonding....)

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [jenhs] [ In reply to ]

Jun 6, 08 11:09

Post #19 of 29 (13748 views)

I am an RD and in geriatric patients the activity factor is 1.3 if they are out of bed, 1.5 if they wander/walk around all the time, and 1.2 if they are on bed rest, so you may want to kick up the 1.2 to 1.5 or higher.
Krista

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [pookie87] [ In reply to ]

Jun 6, 08 11:18

Post #20 of 29 (13746 views)

I am the laziest triathlete in the world. I have a desk job and no kids so when I'm not training I'm sitting on my ass. I will concede that it is more than bed rest though :-). I'll up it to 1.5.

Thanks for the info. The number was given to me by the dude who did the test and I didn't see any reason to disagree. Now I do!

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jen

"In order to keep a true perspective on one's importance, everyone should have a dog that worships him and a cat that will ignore him." - Dereke Bruce

Last edited by: jenhs: Jun 6, 08 11:18

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [alaina1] [ In reply to ]

Jun 6, 08 11:39

Post #21 of 29 (13731 views)

Believe it or not I shop at BJ's club. Before I checked it out, I thought everything they had was very processed. But, they have huge bags of fresh spinach and salad greens, great tomatoes, and fruit. They also carry whole wheat bread and tortillas, natural peanut butter, veggie burgers, turkey hot dogs, turkey bacon, Kashi cereals and granola bars, Stonyfield Farm yogurt, whole wheat pasta, and skinny cow ice cream sandwiches. My only complaint is that all their snack size canned fruit is in light or extra light syrup-I am working on getting them to carry fruit in juice :-) Hope this helps!

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [pookie87] [ In reply to ]

Jun 6, 08 13:05

Post #22 of 29 (13705 views)

mmmm skinny cow ice cream sandwiches! maybe I will stock up on those for my recovery snack!

to the previous posters regarding anorexia...um, thanks, I realize it is a deadly and serious disease and wasn't trying to make light of that. I was just trying to describe the condition of inadvertantly starving your body by not eating enough to meet your caloric needs. there is actually a condition called anorexia athletica or "compulsive exercising." I don't think I have that either but if I was in fact short by over 3,000 calories at 5pm in the afternoon like the Daily Plate had declared, I thought that was cause to be concerned about having a potential eating disorder.

but thanks to everybody's different suggestions, I've realized that it probably overcalculated my daily energy requirement, and even so I still need to eat more.

...........................................................................
:: I came, I saw, I conquered. then I ran out of money, crashed into a car during an Ironman, and now work a bad-ass job making prosthetic legs for wounded warriors. ::

the blog: My So-Called Civilian Life :: theWongstar.com :: follow me @theWongstar

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [iwjocelyn] [ In reply to ]

Jun 6, 08 18:43

Post #23 of 29 (13660 views)

"to the previous posters regarding anorexia...um, thanks, I realize it is a deadly and serious disease and wasn't trying to make light of that."

I don't know here. Why did you put it in the topic of your post? Were you being insensitive or are you conptemplating a problem?

"your horse is too high" - tigerchik

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [iwjocelyn] [ In reply to ]

Jun 6, 08 20:24

Post #24 of 29 (13644 views)

Hi Jocelyn,
Just another note of confirmation stating the same basic thing. I've been logging everything I eat for the past few weeks, and just about every nutrition tracker I've seen overestimates caloric expenditure during exercise. The way I get around it is to wear my HR monitor and manually log calories burned for each exercise (except for swimming and weights). I've been pretty good about eating what I should...actually went over by 650 calories yesterday! I did a longer brick workout earlier this week and ended up with a deficit of 600+ calories, but I had already eaten 4100 calories, so I figured that was plenty...not to mention I wasn't hungry!

I've been losing about 1 pound a week, which has been my goal. I eat over 2700 calories almost every day. I do think that undereating is one of the biggest reasons people on diets can't lose any weight.

Did we happen to meet at the World's Toughest Half? I am friends with Sinclair.

Cheers,
Diana

Re: the accidental anorexic? inadvertantly not eating enough. [Hid] [ In reply to ]

Jun 9, 08 14:56

Post #25 of 29 (13512 views)

if I was trying to be insensitive, I wouldn't have posted in the "kinder and gentler" forum.
if I came off as being insensitive, I apologize.

...........................................................................
:: I came, I saw, I conquered. then I ran out of money, crashed into a car during an Ironman, and now work a bad-ass job making prosthetic legs for wounded warriors. ::

the blog: My So-Called Civilian Life :: theWongstar.com :: follow me @theWongstar

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