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Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question
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I am new to my tri bike, and am currently testing out saddles. The saddle that came with my bike was so uncomfortable I couldn't ride any distance without wiggling around in my saddle. I just tested the JOF 55 and am now trying the Cobb Max. I just don't understand what part of my body should be supporting my weight in aero position.

The JOF 55 saddle left my soft tissues feeling just fine, but my pelvic arch was sore for days after a long ride. Is this something that takes time to build up endurance for, or is this unnecessary pain?

Should my weight be mostly on my pelvic arch, or how is it possible that it is on my sit bones (when I bend forward, they seem to fly up into the air off the saddle)?
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [switchnd] [ In reply to ]
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Soft tissue pain was utterly intolerable for me, but bone pain is something I get used to.

After riding Adamo and Cobb in the last few years, my next experiment is with the Dash saddle. As their fit is highly individual, I wish you luck!

DFL > DNF > DNS
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [switchnd] [ In reply to ]
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where you sit is up to what is comfortable for you. I ride an adamo and it's my sit bones that are on the front of the saddle. It's almost as if my sit bones are pushing back into the front edge of the saddle. This takes some getting used to. Others like to sit further back and use the padding of the seat more.

Most saddles take time to adjust too. If you are putting pressure on a bony part of your body it will hurt (just like when you rode for the first time & the second time your crotch bones were really sensitive). After you ride sit on an ice pack for 15-20 minutes. It helps for the next time your ride. You'll eventually adapt and the bone 'bruising' feeling will be gone. Good luck.
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [GhiaGirl] [ In reply to ]
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Ghia are you on one of their slope-nosed saddles (i.e. podium)? I'm facing this issue as well as I get much more power with hips rolled forward (hip angle opened). I've considered a noseless saddle for this reason, but a slope-nose might provide a better platform . . .

Switchnd life would be so much easier if there was a lending library of saddles we could try out for a couple weeks and then return -- I'm an Adamo fan too but even figuring out the subtle differences in their range is perplexing . . .
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [switchnd] [ In reply to ]
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I'm going through this now too. Visibly, it just looks like the Adamo is the best option for pain free riding. Finding the right version seems to be tricky.

We started with the Adamo TT saddle and I just can't stand it anymore. I think I finally get where the sweet spot is - but it feels so weird - like my squishy parts hang off the front so my sit bones can be the only contact on the saddle. Anyway, I think the TT is just too hard for me but it does have the sloped nose. I just put on an Adamo road model and will take that for a spin - I think it's softer but the rails are not sloped.

My shop is also ordering the prologue (soft and sloped nose) and the breakaway (somewhere in the middle I think) for me to try.

It's also very difficult to see on paper which ones might work. I emailed Dave from ISM and asked him if he had a box of demos he could send me :)
(he said no) LOL

I'd love to hear more reports back from other people.
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [kiki] [ In reply to ]
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Just saw that you asked a question to me. I'm on the podium, but I'm not sure it's slope nosed. It's level from back end to front tip.
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [switchnd] [ In reply to ]
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Saddles are so highly individualized.
I tried an ISM Adamo, it was too "wide" for me, ended up buying a Cobb, but eventually had to scrap it because it was soooo uncomfy.
Went back to trying an Adamo road saddle this time using a zip tie underneath to squeeze the sides together to make it more narrow. (Everyone does that, right?)
So far it's holding up for me on distance rides.
(I roll my hips forward on the saddle. Sometimes, esp during downhills, I end up too far forward and have to eek back a little.)
A friend told me she's using a Fizik because she needs a narrow saddle.
She doesn't do triathlons though, she's riding a road bike, but she does very long distances.
Good luck!
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [space.monkey] [ In reply to ]
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Nope-I needed a wider saddle than the Adamo because I was tired of pressure on my labia.

So far, the Dash saddle passed the 30 mile, 2 hour test. The real results come from triple that distance...

DFL > DNF > DNS
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [MtnBikerChk] [ In reply to ]
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I may spring for a prologue (or find one cheaper on eBay) because when I want to roll pelvis forward on the Adamo Century (otherwise comfy) there's nowhere to go. I land up in this weird perch where everything up front gets mashed and the sit bones aren't in contact at all.

I've never ridden a slope nose but suspect this may be an answer.

It will be happy day when we can 3-D print our own saddles to our own lady specs.
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [kiki] [ In reply to ]
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I'm on the Podium and really like it. I don't think I'd call it slope nosed, though... I agree with the other poster that it's pretty level.
Last edited by: surroundhound: May 31, 14 7:48
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [surroundhound] [ In reply to ]
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Dave at ISM saw this thread and sent me a pretty detailed email to share - so here you go:

After reading through some of the comments I thought I would try and give a quick over view of our performance saddles and you can feel free to pass this information along, cut and paste or totally ignore.

Think of our performance saddles this way if it makes it easier to follow. There are two groups, the performance long family and the performance short family. The Short family consists of the Time Trial, Racing, Road, Typhoon while the long family is the Attack, Podium, Breakaway and Prologue. In the long family you have three saddles that share the exact same shape and those are the Podium, Breakaway and Prologue. The major difference between these three saddles is the level of padding. The Podium is the firmest, the Breakaway is roughly 20% softer than Podium while the Prologue is roughly 50% softer than the Podium. The only other difference is the seat rails on the Podium and Breakaway are titanium alloy while the Prologue uses cr-moly rails. The Attack saddle is also part of the longer family and is the same firmness level of the Podium saddle, uses titanium alloy seat rails but has two differences. The Attack is narrower in the transition from the front arms to the back of the saddle. The front arms will be the same dimensionally (more on this later) but the edges have been narrowed to allow more room for the leg to move through the pedal stroke as well as easier fore/aft movement on the saddle. Also, the area of relief where the front arms meet the body of the saddle is deeper and extends further back than on the other models. All the saddles in the long family use the newer sloped ends to the front arms. The long saddles are optimally matched to the traditional road bike position or to triathletes who like to move around on the saddle more such as for climbing and descending or riding with their hands on the base bar a significant amount of time.

The shorter family of saddles follow a similar hierarchy of firmness levels. The Time Trial and Racing saddles are at the same firmest level of padding like the Attack and Podium. The Road model is the same shape as the Racing but 20% softer in firmness and uses cr-moly seat rails instead of titanium alloy found on the Time Trial and Racing saddles. The Typhoon is even softer than the Road model and has a bit more slope built into the body of the saddle. The only difference between the Racing saddle and the Time Trial is the addition of the newer generation sloped front arms. Generally speaking, the two groups of people who benefit from the Time Trial saddle over the Racing are women who like a firm saddle or athletes (men or women) who can ride a firm saddle and have a greater amount of saddle to handlebar drop. If you do not like a firm saddle than the sloped arms of the Time Trial are not going to benefit you and you need to look at the Road or Typhoon. The short saddles work optimally for triathletes/time trial riders who spend most of their time in the aerobar position and like to stay planted in one position with little moving around on the saddle. Also, riders on road bikes who live in areas that are relatively flat or who generally don’t move around on the saddle will also find lots of comfort on the shorter saddles.

A couple of other points that seemed to stand out. For people that say the “nose” feels too wide that is a clear indication that the saddle is not placed correctly. There is no “nose” to an ISM saddle as it has been removed. The front arms match the pubic rami bone structure and should never extend further than the midpoint of your inseam. If they do than the rider is sitting too far back on the saddle or it is positioned too high and too far forward. Theoretically, if you are positioned perfectly on a traditional saddle and then switch to an ISM saddle your overall seat high will be roughly 5 millimeters lower to account for the bone structure of the body being supported on the top plane of the saddle instead of sinking into the cradle part of a traditional saddle. Since the pubic rami bones are being supported higher on the saddle this contributes to the feeling of width that makes it necessary to lower the overall seat height to keep the leg extension the same. Also, if you were to measure from the nose of a traditional saddle to your handlebar and then from the front of the arms to the handlebar this measurement needs to be 4-5 centimeters longer to keep you in the same spot fore/aft over the bottom bracket. If you install an ISM saddle to the same seat height and keep the front of the saddles even than you have radically altered your position on the bike and will not be using the ISM saddle optimally. Also, regarding zip ties, the use of zip ties will void any warranty and more importantly you do not have your saddle positioned correctly and are not maximizing the health, comfort and performance benefits that the ISM design provides. The arms of an ISM saddle are specifically designed to support the pubic rami bones. While there are differences between petite and large people and men and women obviously the bone structure is more the same than it is different. As the hips rotate forward the bones of the pubic rami narrow ( they also angle in and forward) so the arms of an ISM saddle when positioned correctly allow for the natural rotation of the hips and transference of weight from the ischial tuberosity to the pubic rami instead of the soft tissue of the body that was never intended to support weight. An ISM saddle works for men and women equally because it is a human design. Obviously men and women are different, the ISM is just as effective for men as it is for women because of the support of the rider’s weight on bone structure on the top plane of the saddle. For men, everything that is important to us is positioned in front of the arms of the saddle while for women having the weight supported on the top plane of the saddle and having space between the arms as well as an area of relief in the body itself there is no part of the saddle to compress soft tissue. Again, if the saddle feels “too wide” it is not positioned correctly or is being sat upon too far back. If pressure against the bone structure is an issue after the appropriate break in period than the solution is to choose a saddle with a softer level/more padding. This is completely personal preference and what is soft to someone is firm to someone else hence the need for various levels of padding on saddles.

As far as trying saddles before you purchase one, we make 5 models specifically as demo models. The Attack, Breakaway, Time Trial, Racing, and Road are all available as demo models through our dealers. The reason we produce demo models is so people can try a saddle for an extended period of time to help the body break in, make the necessary small adjustments to the position of the saddle and realize the long term health, comfort and performance benefits that an ISM saddle provides. This is not achieved with a ten minute ride around the parking lot or a few minutes on a trainer. These things are a start but do not tell the complete story. To start your search for a dealer close to you that carries our demo saddles you can always use the dealer locater tool on our website ismseat.com, ask your favorite shop to get you a demo or one of the online retailers who have demo saddle programs who can ship a saddle directly to you.

I hope this information helps but if you have other questions or need more information please feel free to call or email me and it would be my pleasure to further assist you.


If you want his email address or phone number, message me and I can forward it to you.
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [MtnBikerChk] [ In reply to ]
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Wow.

So helpful, thanks!
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [SallyShortyPnts] [ In reply to ]
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SallyShortyPnts wrote:
Nope-I needed a wider saddle than the Adamo because I was tired of pressure on my labia.

So far, the Dash saddle passed the 30 mile, 2 hour test. The real results come from triple that distance...

Which dash saddle are you using? I'm always in the market for a new saddle.
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [redmeeple] [ In reply to ]
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I went through their demo program and it looks like a custom-made saddle. They asked my weight and what other saddles I had been riding. So, I'm really not sure, but it is extremely light.

DFL > DNF > DNS
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [MtnBikerChk] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for passing along this detailed breakdown of the models.
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [SallyShortyPnts] [ In reply to ]
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SallyShortyPnts wrote:
Nope-I needed a wider saddle than the Adamo because I was tired of pressure on my labia.

So far, the Dash saddle passed the 30 mile, 2 hour test. The real results come from triple that distance...

I hear you about pressure on the labia. I am currently demoing the Cobb Plus, which seems good so far.

When Dave from ISM said that the pubic rami should be where the weight is, does that effectively mean the labia?

I think I will need to demo some ISM saddles next. I am just hopeful that I can find one that works. I know it will never be as comfortable as my couch, but I am struggling with how much discomfort is normal.
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [switchnd] [ In reply to ]
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switchnd wrote:
SallyShortyPnts wrote:
Nope-I needed a wider saddle than the Adamo because I was tired of pressure on my labia.

So far, the Dash saddle passed the 30 mile, 2 hour test. The real results come from triple that distance...

I hear you about pressure on the labia. I am currently demoing the Cobb Plus, which seems good so far.

When Dave from ISM said that the pubic rami should be where the weight is, does that effectively mean the labia?

I think I will need to demo some ISM saddles next. I am just hopeful that I can find one that works. I know it will never be as comfortable as my couch, but I am struggling with how much discomfort is normal.


No, I'm referring to sitting on the ischium. Google the pelvis and you'll see that it's forward of the pelvic rami. Good luck with the Cobb Plus. I got a couple of years out of it.

DFL > DNF > DNS
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [SallyShortyPnts] [ In reply to ]
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I'm a good 6 weeks into riding an Adamo Race saddle. I was having horrific labial tearing (yes, TEARING) and swelling on rides in a more traditional saddle.

The good news is that I have ZERO issues with my girl parts in the Adamo. My labial region is quite happy.

The bad news is that there is definitely some bruising going on with my bony bits. I've found, at first, that I was trying to ride too far, too soon (i.e. 40+ miles). I then made a commitment to ride for 60-75 minutes every other day for two weeks. THIS made a huge difference in my comfort on the bike. In addition, I made it a point to try to ride as forward on the saddle as I could. Every few miles, I'd remind myself to scootch forward. It's definitely more comfortable up there (once your bony bits are conditioned) and riding more forward eliminates any chafing you may get in the crease of your thigh and the 'nose' of the saddle if you're riding too far back.

The only dilemma is that things came up after a 50ish mile ride, and I wasn't able to get back in the saddle for about 6 days. It's not comfy again.

I really wish I felt the bony pain on my sit bones. I feel it about an inch in front of my sit bones.
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [Glfprncs] [ In reply to ]
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IIRC, I had the same pain on the Adamo Race, which I rode for several years. It took time to condition myself for the 50+ mile rides as well.

Stay with it, while remembering what you've already learned, not too many miles too soon. The bruising eventually gets better.

DFL > DNF > DNS
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [SallyShortyPnts] [ In reply to ]
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SallyShortyPnts wrote:
IIRC, I had the same pain on the Adamo Race, which I rode for several years. It took time to condition myself for the 50+ mile rides as well.

Stay with it, while remembering what you've already learned, not too many miles too soon. The bruising eventually gets better.

Thank you!! You've given me hope.
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [switchnd] [ In reply to ]
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Another saddle series worth checking out is Selle SMP. There is a great blog post about them (that also explains the bone structure of the pelvis and a bike saddle quite nicely) over on Steve Hogg's blog http://www.stevehoggbikefitting.com/...1/09/all-about-smps/

I ride a selle smp plus (currently on a road bike) and have previously used the SMP TRK on a roadbike with aerobars for up to a 70.3 race. It's been so friendly to soft tissue that I jokingly call it the marriage saver.

Good luck!
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [switchnd] [ In reply to ]
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Just to confuse things even more, I ride with a Specialized Jett road saddle on my tri bike and that's good with me for 6+ hours.

Sorry, that probably doesn't help much. Damn things are like swimming goggles - you just have to keep experimenting until you find what works for you.

This might be asking the bleeding obvious but are you 100% confident that your bike fit is right as well?
Last edited by: blackthugcat: Jun 26, 14 2:15
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [Glfprncs] [ In reply to ]
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Glfprncs wrote:
I'm a good 6 weeks into riding an Adamo Race saddle. I was having horrific labial tearing (yes, TEARING) and swelling on rides in a more traditional saddle.

The good news is that I have ZERO issues with my girl parts in the Adamo. My labial region is quite happy.

The bad news is that there is definitely some bruising going on with my bony bits. I've found, at first, that I was trying to ride too far, too soon (i.e. 40+ miles). I then made a commitment to ride for 60-75 minutes every other day for two weeks. THIS made a huge difference in my comfort on the bike. In addition, I made it a point to try to ride as forward on the saddle as I could. Every few miles, I'd remind myself to scootch forward. It's definitely more comfortable up there (once your bony bits are conditioned) and riding more forward eliminates any chafing you may get in the crease of your thigh and the 'nose' of the saddle if you're riding too far back.

The only dilemma is that things came up after a 50ish mile ride, and I wasn't able to get back in the saddle for about 6 days. It's not comfy again.

I really wish I felt the bony pain on my sit bones. I feel it about an inch in front of my sit bones.

Sorry to hear about all of your saddle issues. To second other posters, it could be a fit issue.

It sounds like you may open your hip angle by rolling forward off your seat bones onto your pubic bone? I also tend to do this and there is nothing wrong with riding this way as long as you are keeping your upper body relaxed and your weight is distributed appropriately between arms & saddle. Again - this is a fit issue.

I use a Cobb v-flow plus on my road & TT bike and have been ramping up the miles over the past two months to get ready for bike leg of iron distance relay (Challenge AC). I went from 2 hours saddle time on my TT bike to 5+ hours last weekend and have had no issues ramping up miles and riding the next day. I tend to stay locked down in aero position and that saddle has been very, very good to me.

Plus, Cobb has a phenomenal trial program. They are also very helpful about saddle selection and positioning if you call them.

But the first thing I would do if i was you is go have fit checked!

I hope your saddle issues resolve soon!
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [switchnd] [ In reply to ]
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Check out the Specialized Sitero. It feels very firm at first but after 6 or 8 rides it becomes very comfy. I can move forward or backwards on the saddle and never have any pressure in the bad spots due to the v-shaped cutout . I have had many tri saddles and this one is the most comfy by far. However, saddles are very butt specific, so my experience with the Sitero may not parallel yours. Good luck
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Re: Aero position/saddle/pelvic bone question [redbudtri] [ In reply to ]
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Just wanted to share that after one last 'tweak' with my bike fitter (we swapped out my front stem from a 6 degree rise 80 mm of reach to a 15 degree rise 90 mm of reach, I now ADORE my Adamo saddle. That adjustment moved my weight back just enough that I'm now more on my sit bones, and that area in front of my sit bones isn't holding my body up. It also alleviated the neck/shoulder issues I was having in aero. Yay!
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