Make sure he sees a counsellor, as soon as possible. Hopefully he can get that through his job, but if not, he will need to go independently. Those are horrible things to deal with. Psychologically, it isn't as bad as if he was there and couldn't do anything to save lives, but it is still bad.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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That sounds horrendous. Some people handle these situations better than others, but being a paramedic I can tell you that while you do witness these tragedies, you tend to focus on the job at hand rather than the blood & gore. Yes, sometimes it gets to you, but for the most part he will benefit from his position much more than he will suffer ill effects. He will gain a greater appreciation for the delicacy of life, the importance of safety, the value of good health and the consequences of poor decision making. He will be a stronger person for it, I promise you.

The advice I give the new EMT's and paramedics that I train when they ask me how I remain calm in the midst of chaos is to remind them that all we can do is make things better. We're there because it's already gone bad, so just work with what you've got and make it better.

It is typically the first responders that save the lives of the people we deal with, be it a water rescue, delivering a shock from an AED, holding pressure on an arterial bleed, etc. We do our share, but the initial response that your son provides is absolutely critical in many of these situations.

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The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

Concur with Jason. Counselling, counselling, counselling.

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19° 38’ 11.08” N 155° 59’ 30.66” W

He will gain a greater appreciation for the delicacy of life, the importance of safety, the value of good health and the consequences of poor decision making. He will be a stronger person for it, I promise you.


This is very true. We are avid boaters and having seen so much utter stupidity on his lake, he is Joe Safety on the boat.

Thanks for your response, you made a proud dad "tear-up" a little :-)

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I'll be what I am
A solitary man

I am sad because a little bit of his youthful innocence is gone and he will have some horible images to deal with.

Not to change the subject ... but imagine what the father has to deal with. Crashed the boat leading to his wife's injuries and basically "ran over" his young child, killing her. How do you get past that? How do you look yourself in the mirror?

The thing about being a lifeguard, and other "rescue jobs", is there's no time to think about it ... you just move. If you had time to think about it, you might decide not to do what needs done [i.e., self-preservation].

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-- Every morning brings opportunity;
Each evening offers judgement. --

Same here. My thoughts have been with that family all week. We started boating when my kids were small. I can't imagine what they are going through.

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_________________________________
I'll be what I am
A solitary man

Ok I am going to get flamed for this no doubt, but here goes...is there any end to the need for counselling anymore? It was a rough incident, no doubt, and your son will remember it for a while. But a) he didn't lose a family member, b)he did what was possible in his space to ensure a "positive outcome" given the circumstances. I don't wish the situation on anyone, but at the same time, it's not as though it was his father or mother or a sibling or someone close like that.

What did people do before the grief industry took hold? Sure some people didn't handle things very well. With grief counselling, some people still don't handle things very well. I guess I just wonder why people can't just deal with their problems anymore without every single thing requiring a counsellor. Flame away.

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"I can endure more pain than anyone you've ever met. That's why I can beat anyone I've ever met." Steve Prefontaine, Without Limits

Keep in mind that someone "talking to him" about what happened and how he perceives it, etc would be classified as "counseling". Counseling does not always mean "therapy". Counseling in many cases just means "communication". Counseling could be a whole formal long-term thing or a short conversation.

Being reassured that it was okay to be stunned, scared, grossed out, numb, nervous, anxious, etc would be "counseling". Really, they've just made a fancy term for "making sure your buddy is okay" ... although in today's society the term and certification are likely to cover one's ass for letigation purposes. Making sure that the person if "fit the work" the next shift, next day, or next 5 minutes, etc.

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-- Every morning brings opportunity;
Each evening offers judgement. --

Well TT, I guess my question is then, why isn't his dad ok to talk to him? By the looks of things Tim seems to be a pretty good father. Why does there need to be a diploma and a clipboard to legitimize the conversation?

You're right about the whole legal CYA thing, for sure. I just have to wonder in a case like this, if Tim can have the *talk* with his son when he was younger, that he could probably do all right with this conversation as well.

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"I can endure more pain than anyone you've ever met. That's why I can beat anyone I've ever met." Steve Prefontaine, Without Limits

When I made the comment, I wasn't necessarily talking about a shrink. It could be a doctor, or it could be a co-worker, or someone in a different branch of the Emergency services, (e.g. paramedics, fire, police) but generally it should be someone who knows what to expect. Either they have been there, or have spoken with lots of other people who have been there. Those are the best counsellors. Tim is, I'm sure, a great dad. But if he hasn't had to deal with this type of situation before, then in my opinion it is best for his son to talk to someone who has. This isn't the same thing as "the talk".

Tim's son might be able to deal with this perfectly well on his own. If so, that's fantastic. But many people are not able to deal with it on their own.

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I wouldn't see why he couldn't. FWIK, jasonk seems to be the only one recommending what appears to be professional counseling.

I don't know about you, but I learned how to "deal with stuff" by talking about it with my dad ... grandparent's dying, bad car wrecks on our corner [including one horrific one involving a helmetless motorcyclist], dogs dying, cancer, etc. I'd call that counseling, although when it's your father it's probably just called "parenting".

I would humbly suggest that if he is really unsure about the situation and drastically affected by what he saw, then this would probably be a good time to exit the field of lifeguard/rescue. I would wager that the kid will be fine (as will dad), and will use the event as a learning situation with life applications. Heck, anymore a 20yo that hasn't had one really bad family/friend/life incident is really lucky.

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-- Every morning brings opportunity;
Each evening offers judgement. --

Not really. I'm saying he should definitely be talking to someone who has been through it. That may be professional counselling, but it may not. There is a big difference between seeing your grandparents die of natural causes vs. seeing the mangled body of a kid caught in a propeller. Well, I assume there is, having never been there myself. It may even be dad (and dad should also talk to his son about it).

I'm just thinking when I was 20, I didn't necessarily confide in my dad. It is also really easy to NOT talk about it, or to put it off till later. That is another trait I have, to bottle stuff up. So I'm probably projecting some of my own weaknesses onto this situation.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

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I'm not going to flame you; you're allowed to feel how you feel.

In response to the original post, yes, your son became a man. He had the clear head to use his training in a real world experience. He did his job, and a very hard one at that.

How many of you have had CPR training? How many times have you used it? Wouldn't it give you a reason to pause if you were a part of a life altering event?

I second or third the counseling recommendation. You don't have to be 'NUTS' to need it; counseling (among other things) helps people process events they witness. Events that normal people in the course of their days wouldn't or shouldn't ever witness.

My thoughts and prayers go out to you and the family involved.

I do appreciate all of your responses. I am taking it all in. He sounds OK when we discuss it. I may have him talk to our pastor about it. He is chaplain for the local PD and experienced in grief counseling.

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_________________________________
I'll be what I am
A solitary man

Some deal better with tragedy than others. I would remind him that this tragedy is not his ... he was a participant, and he was trying to save life. But, it's not his famliy, or his actions that caused it. If you are going to work in public safety, you absolutely have to compartmentalize. As sad as it sounds, it's just another day at work for many of us.

I'm a police officer, and I've been in similar situations as your son on more occassions than I can recall. I've had people die in my arms, I've had people die while performing CPR on them, I've seen horrible accidents and violent crime.

Pm me if you need anything.

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"In case of flood climb to safety"