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user error in an ultralight world
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About a year and a half ago Lennard Zinn wrote an article in Velo News regarding the importance of the use of torque wrenches. In the article he mentioned an informal study done on division I bikes found that most every bolt on the bike was over-tightened; sometimes by twice the manufacturers recommended torque. Furthermore, it was found that only a couple of team mechanics made used a torque wrench in their frequent bike checks. The over-tightening of the bolts was probably the result of the common tightness check, when the mechanic would gently snug the bolt just to make sure it was tight, over time these “snuggings” resulted in the over-tightening.



What I am getting at is that “snugging” is a relatively well-established technique and a very, very common behavior. Up until recent years very few failures could be directly attributed to it. That is not so much the case. In this day of 350g full carbon forks and sub 100g magnesium stems, the once effective and benign (albeit stupid) mechanical practice, now can cause immediate and severe damage. A recent and controversial post mentioned the failure of a carbon fork at the tour of Qatar. Since the fork was tested to withstand much greater stresses than the rigors of its use, the assembly of the stem and headset were questioned as the cause of the failure. This is a bike assembled by a professional mechanic, what can be expected by lesser qualified mechanics and non-mechanically inclined bike owners. How many owners of ultra-light stems put their bikes together in the hotel room after a flight using nothing but a fold out mini-tool?



Of course the use of a torque wrench will solve this problem. The fact of the matter is that most individuals, and many shops don’t use torque wrenches. A torque wrench is only good if there are torque specs to go along with it. While some products, Syntace areo bars for instance, print their torque specs on directly on the part, easy access to torque specs is not always the norm. This also assumes that torque specs are accurate. I have seen several instances where manufacturer recommended torque was not adequate to prevent the bolt from loosening, or the part from sliding.

Question 1

Is there a point where parts become so light that the margin for improper installation is to small for the part to be considered safe for the average rider? Have parts on the market now reached that point?

Question 2

For those involved in the manufacture and design of bikes, to what extent is reasonably improper installation taken into consideration in the design and testing of the product?

Question 3

How many of own/use torque wrenches out there? What are you observations on the adequacy and accuracy of torque ratings?

Thanks for entertaining such a long post
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Re: user error in an ultralight world [cjeder] [ In reply to ]
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This is an excellent post. We use torque wrenches when possible but not nearly enough. Cannondale is expereimenting with the use of "smart" wrenches that will be used on their assembly line to install compnenets to the correct torque specs and then log those specs along with the bikes serial number and time of assembly. Excellent and unprecedented quality control in this industry. A for the shops... You're right. We use them where possible but there are rarely torque specs available. That is a huge problem. In response to your question number 1: Yup, there is some stuff out there that IMHO is to light. But customers want it. We sell it. You don't see it on my bikes. I warn them. They still buy it. It's demand driven. They are also usually surprised when it breaks. For question number 2, well, I can only answer as a retailer. I have never been a manufacturer. To me the answer to your question runs a wide spectrum. Some companies are very dilligent. Others are utterly wanton. Many are in between. Bottom line: We have to be responsible for our own equipment (and in our case, that of our customers). Even then we make mistakes. Today I got a call from a customer who picked up a Litepseed Saber on Friday and the top half of his seatpost clamp was backwards. The bike went out when I wasn't here. Several people have been counseled. Sternly but fairly.They missed it. Not acceptable. In this case the customer deserves (and gets in our store) credit for the mistake going out that way and him noticing it. It is absolutely 100% our fault- specifically mine. The customer took responsibility to conduct his own inspection and that avoided a potential problem. I am fortunate for that. Those mistakes are rare for us, but they do happen infrequently. Dan Empfield made a good point in a psot yesterday regarding fit: There is a lack of empiracle standards in this industry. When I tried to provide some comprehensive information about using carbon steer tubes with certain stems I came away slightly confused after talking to no less than 3 manufacturers. I spent over an hour on a quiet day researching it and making phone calls and surfing for resources. My findings are not 100% conclusive. So we proceed with caution now on every one we install. Maybe that is the point: Proceed with caution. This is race equipment.

Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com
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If a bike store owner can not find the specs [ In reply to ]
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how do we the customers find them?

As to torque wrenches, Ingersol Rand manufactures air tools with preset torques. Grainger and McMaster both sell preset and adjustable wrenches.

Another company with whom I have worked in the past have even designed and produced a toqueing system that will torque a fitting with a gasket to a point where it actually will not back off even if the gasket relaxes.

My point? the tools are and have been available for years. Where do you find out how much to torque chain rings, head sets, stems, seat bolts (was'nt the Czeck Triathletes accident a seat post snapping, could this have resulted from over tightening a seat bolt?)

Where is this information? how do we as consumers get it?
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Re: user error in an ultralight world [cjeder] [ In reply to ]
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I learned how to become a fairly good mechanic in my younger days when I used to race cars and go-carts. This was a matter of necessity since on my limited budget this was the only way I could afford to participate in a very expensive sport. Setting to the exact torque could be critical to prevent things from either breaking(over torqued) or falling off(under torqued). I believe that the same principles could apply to today's race bicycles, particuarly at the high levels of road racing such as TDF, etc. where the mechanical components would be under the most stress.

I still do all my own bicycle maintenance because a) I know how b) I live in a rural area with a very long drive to a competent bike shop.

I own torque wrenches left over from my car racing days but seldom use them on my bikes because I usually don't have the manufacturers torque specs readily available. Will use them whenever these specs are available.
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Re: user error in an ultralight world [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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The problem i see is lack of training,your local bike mechanic,has he had formal training?Here in Tallahassee,where its a college town some guy wonders in looking for a job and pow hes a mechanic,trained by the last guy who got the job the same way,there are some good ones here,but because they have stayed with it and now have knowage of what they are doing. When i was wanting to be a mechanic i went to a lot of formal schooling and now have years of school behind me,but of course the UPS man makes a better living,but thats part of the problem,that along with no specs from the manufacturer,Do not expect the problem to get better with parts being made lighter your going to start seeing more parts failing.I now work as a engineer building things and have a background building bike frames and stems and i see bike parts all the time that i just think you got to be crazy to ride that thing,one part failing can cause you to fall and get killed.Randall
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Re: user error in an ultralight world [randall t] [ In reply to ]
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About an hour and half from where I live there is a retired guy who has a bike shop set up in his garage. He doesn't do retail but just mechanical work. He is excellent and I've found better than the bike shops in the area. The problem is that with that distance away from me it's just not practical to take my bike there for every little maintenance problem. As I mentioned, I live in a rural area. The closest bike shop to me is forty-five minutes away and they're strictly family/mountain biking orientated. I'm quite capable of solving and fixing 99% of any problems with our bikes, so it's not a huge issue or disadvantage living in the boonies.
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Re: user error in an ultralight world [Tom Demerly] [ In reply to ]
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Assuming that it was a thomson seatpost that you are referring to. Your tech made a common mistake, the upper clamp on a thomson seatpost, although it say front somewhere on the clamp, it really looks like it should point the other way. This is a mistake I have seen commonly, and have made myself in the past. To thomsons credit I have yet to see a failure resulting from it, but on the other hand since they have a symmetrical post could they just put on a symmetrical clamp? If they would watch some people intsall this stuff they would find these little issues.

As for the availability of torque specs. Syntace, as I said already gets top honors, for printing their specs right on the part. Shimano offers complete torque specs to dealers and consumers in their installation instructions, which are available online, and in STI. Campy does the same. Where I think the problem resides is in parts that assemble on to non standardized surfaces. Derailleurs and bottom brackets, thread into ISO standardized parts, unless inordinately soft metal is used the torque specs dont change from manufacturer to manufacturer. Since the friction fit between a fork, handlebar and stem depends on the relative diameters of the part, amount of friction developed between different materials an surfaces and the ability of the fork or handlebar to withstand crushing forces, it is nearly impossible to provide one best torque spec. Much as you found in your Reynolds fork, Thomson stem research.

As for the information not being out there. While that is a large problem, I think it is compounded by a lack of accessibility to the information. Many times it is a matter of the calling the inside tech guy who then calls an engineer to get an answer to a simple torque spec question. Othertimes the important information is simply not provided. If I had a nickle for every time an inside tech guy told me that "Are you sure, "I have never heard of this happening before".

As cerveloguy says, in auto racing torque specs are very important. It seems that in auto racing mechanics are better kept in the technical loop. Cannondale, Shimano and Rockshox are amongst the few companies that offer technical seminars at not charge to make sure that LBS mechanics are up to speed on the proper assembly of their stuff. Otherwise information seems to be distributed on a need to know basis.

As you can probably tell, I find this incredibly frustrating.
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Re: user error in an ultralight world [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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Craftsman makes a couple of really nice, albeit somewhat expensive, torque wrenches. I think that they have a few different ones in different units to prevent the need to convert between ft or in lbs and N*m. they also have different sized drivers for them.

As far as specifications go, Park Tool has a pretty good chart on their website. Some are general ranges, others are manufacturer specific. It's definitely worth a look.


Brandon Marsh - Website | @BrandonMarshTX | RokaSports | 1stEndurance | ATC Bikeshop |
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Re: user error in an ultralight world [cjeder] [ In reply to ]
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As a big fan of DYI (and someone inherently suspect of ANY work done on my bike by my LBS) I have been my own mechanic for a while now. One of he very first things I learned the hard way was that I needed a torque wrench. I am sure that is has saved me more $$$ in stupidity than it cost (I got a Park TW-2). The tougher part is finding those elusive spec's for various fittings and what not. Park has a pretty good chart when in a pinch. Check out: http://www.parktool.com/repair_help/torque.shtml

Meanwhile, if you are self-wrenching and don't have a TW yet, then get one. Best money you'll spend.





"To give less than your best is to sacrifice the gift." - Pre

MattMizenko.com
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