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EU to resume aid
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The very latest is that the EU is on the brink of resuming financial aid to Palestine.

And the reaction from President Abbas and his representatives? It's about time because the Palestinian people need it. That's fine except for the usual Muslim tone of all take no give. They haven't renounced one iota their desire or policies for violence and their attitude is the rest of the world owes them. In reality even if they renounced their violence and showed some semblance of being willing to compromise with Israel the world still owes them squat! They take others' humanitarian kindness as some kind of debt owed to them for some unfathonable Muslim inspired reason.

The only reason I can guess is that they are the true believers and should have all the advantage over the rest of us infedels. It amazes me how many infedels are willing to compromise to their reality.

Colour me a simpleton, but I can't imagine anyone here wanting to help a financially strapped violent family down the road knowing full well that they hate your guts because you are not have their religious beliefs and given the opportunity would burn your house down kill your family. Futhermore they have a brotherhood in beliefs with others in the neighbourhood who would like to do likewise. Yes these are the same Palestinians who voted in their terrorist government, obviously because they like the policies and the terrorist ways. The same Palestinians who explode to violence and hatred of us at the slightest provocation such as some cartoon depictions. The same Palestinians that went to the Olympic village in Munich and took hostage and slaughtered athletes. The same Palestinians that have a list of terrorist acts literally too long to recount originating from their fold. And here we are, on the brink of giving them millions of dollars so that they can say, "Hey about time you godless pigs and Jins. We'll reciprocate with a couple of bombs or so when we get the chance and if our buddies in Iran can get what they want we'll really show you some fireworks. Fuck you very much."

A show of willingness to get along and abandon their bombing defenseless civillian ways will never happen because it's in their blood, their culture and their screwed up RELIGION. People in the West should stop kidding themselves. As such those scumbags should get their money from their bum buddy oil rich Muslim brothers because they have no right to expect any non-Muslim to help them, (except for basket case activists who they can capture hostage for fun)......period!
Last edited by: kangaroo: May 16, 06 6:06
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Re: EU to resume aid [kangaroo] [ In reply to ]
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I didn't read your whole post - sorry.



The Readers Digest version is that the EU (with the US and Israel on board) are going to channel aid through Abbas, bypassing Hamas. It's probably in everyone's best interest to keep the Palestinians from erupting into civil war, while at the same time strengthening Abbas and not giving Hamas legitimacy until they renounce violence.

Interestingly, Hamas and Fatah representives hammered out a consensus statement which demands a Palestinian state based on the 1967 border. Implicit in this statement, of course, is that Israel still exists as a distinct entity. The main problem is that the Hamas political leader in Damascus is still calling for the destruction of Israel and a Palestinian state from "river to sea", and the Hamas PM is vascilating between the two positions.

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Re: EU to resume aid [jhc] [ In reply to ]
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"It's probably in everyone's best interest to keep the Palestinians from erupting into civil war"

Why?
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Re: EU to resume aid [ajfranke] [ In reply to ]
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Because long term stability in the region depends on a negotiated peace settlement. That can only happen if the Palestinians have a unified government that is viewed as legitimate and that will actually renounce violence and negotiate. It's not going to happen if Palestine is at 99% unemplyment and the entire population is radicalized, anti-West, and fighting each other.

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Re: EU to resume aid [jhc] [ In reply to ]
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We have been giving vast amounts of aid my entire adult life. I suggest that is exactly the reason there is 90% unemployment, radicalism, and anti-West attitudes.

When you don't have to work for a living, you don't, and you have plenty of time to wallow in hate, usually directed at those giving you the money.
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Re: EU to resume aid [ajfranke] [ In reply to ]
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The aid we're giving is not welfare. It's to pay the employees of the PA

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Re: EU to resume aid [jhc] [ In reply to ]
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The aid we're giving is not welfare. It's to pay the employees of the PA

I don't think those are mutually exclusive categories, actually. (Seriously.)

But they're going to have to start the aid again. You can't starve the Palestinians, for crying out loud.








"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."
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Re: EU to resume aid [vitus979] [ In reply to ]
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I don't think those are mutually exclusive categories, actually. (Seriously.)

I agree. But we're not paying people to sit around and wallow in their own hate as Art claims.

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Re: EU to resume aid [jhc] [ In reply to ]
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I beg to differ. What are those employees doing? Not seeing a lot of road, sewer or water construction, the formation of a system of law, or new school and hospital construction going on, so I am guessing it isn't that.
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Re: EU to resume aid [ajfranke] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
I beg to differ. What are those employees doing? Not seeing a lot of road, sewer or water construction, the formation of a system of law, or new school and hospital construction going on, so I am guessing it isn't that.
Um, how about running the hospitals, school, etc.. that are already there.

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Re: EU to resume aid [jhc] [ In reply to ]
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Laughing.

What, maybe five percent of them?
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Re: EU to resume aid [ajfranke] [ In reply to ]
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I don't know - your number might even be right.

The question remains - how does starvation, mass unrest, and civil war further the goal of a negotiated peace?

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Re: EU to resume aid [jhc] [ In reply to ]
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You get peace when one of the parties is defeated. Preventing defeat sustains conflict. Peace comes when the winner imposes it, as Israel is now starting to do.

We didn't get peace with Germany by negotiating. We got peace by our winning and their losing.
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Re: EU to resume aid [ajfranke] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
You get peace when one of the parties is defeated. Preventing defeat sustains conflict. Peace comes when the winner imposes it, as Israel is now starting to do.

We didn't get peace with Germany by negotiating. We got peace by our winning and their losing.


And when the terms imposed by the victor are impossible for the loser to swallow, you have sustained low-level conflict (as we see now in Palestine) until such time the loser is able to build themselves back up again and resume high level conflict (as we saw after WWI).

Israel can unilaterally withdraw and build a wall, but it won'tr stop Palestinian terrorism, nor will it lead to pace deals with other Arab conuntries.

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Re: EU to resume aid [jhc] [ In reply to ]
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No, the loser has to completely and totally lose. As with Germany and Japan.

Bankruptcy and Civil War followed by new leaders who are focused on rebuilding society rather than hatred would be just the thing.
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Re: EU to resume aid [ajfranke] [ In reply to ]
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And you tihnk civil war will lead to new leaders focused on rebuilding society (and peace with Israel) how?

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Re: EU to resume aid [jhc] [ In reply to ]
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Yes.

Otherwise, they don't eat. It is funny how having to work to put food in your mouth has a way of focusing the mind.
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Re: EU to resume aid [ajfranke] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
No, the loser has to completely and totally lose. As with Germany and Japan.

Bankruptcy and Civil War followed by new leaders who are focused on rebuilding society rather than hatred would be just the thing.
Germany totally lost and was humiliated after WWI which was the prime motivating factor for the rise of the Nazi Party in the 1930s and WWII. Thankfully we learned our lesson after that war and instituted the Marshall Plan.

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"A society is defined not only by what it creates, but by what it refuses to destroy."
John Sawhill
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Re: EU to resume aid [jhc] [ In reply to ]
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1) "I didn't read your whole post - sorry."

You're excused. My posts are kind of long.

2) "The Readers Digest version is that the EU (with the US and Israel on board) are going to channel aid through Abbas, bypassing Hamas. It's probably in everyone's best interest to keep the Palestinians from erupting into civil war, while at the same time strengthening Abbas and not giving Hamas legitimacy until they renounce violence.
Interestingly, Hamas and Fatah representives hammered out a consensus statement which demands a Palestinian state based on the 1967 border. Implicit in this statement, of course, is that Israel still exists as a distinct entity. The main problem is that the Hamas political leader in Damascus is still calling for the destruction of Israel and a Palestinian state from "river to sea", and the Hamas PM is vascilating between the two positions.""

At the end of the day, the money is still going to the Hamas supporters with the same desires as Hamas, ie the people who voted them in, and through them possibly to Hamas members themselves. (I did read your whole post)
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Re: EU to resume aid [ajfranke] [ In reply to ]
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1) "We have been giving vast amounts of aid my entire adult life. I suggest that is exactly the reason there is 90% unemployment, radicalism, and anti-West attitudes."

Exactly!

FACT is another feature of the behaviour this religion fosters is bad work ethic. Those that have oil don't work much and get state handouts. Those that don't have oil believe it's their birth right to recieve financial aid from the very infedels they so hate and want to see dead. Those that want to argue can do so but the live samples and situations existing obviate this.

Anyway who has time to really work when you need to go to the Mosque five times a day for lengthy rituals. Some even go to the Mosque for self encouragement then go home and slaughter their young teenage daughters in front of their wife in case they grow up and marry for love out of arrange marraige. A great righteous deed to save the family's honor. By the way this kind of thing is hardly an isolated incident so don't quote the antics of some individual mad guy in the US as a rebutal. These things I'm refering to are single source all Muslim religious related.

2) "When you don't have to work for a living, you don't, and you have plenty of time to wallow in hate, usually directed at those giving you the money."

As a contrast look to the Israelis. They have the smallest piece of land and no oil but they sure have developed a whole lot more economically than any Muslim lands that have no oil.

It's really not as complicated as some might try to suggest. Let their oil rich Muslim brothers who should be the ones to help them do so. If the Muslim bond cannot progress beyond the common desire to exact terror to civillians then that's their problem. Live like the starvesd animals they are. Do whatever they want within their own space. The minute they become a threat however just do what the Israelis do. Hit them as hard as required to reciprocate the threat they come up with. Either this for them or the impossible ...ie they learn to have a peaceful attitude.

Why all the screwing around?
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